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 11/10/2004 09:25:09 PM · #1
I was just curious, and as I'm just getting into photography, how many of you have taken some sort of formal training or have degrees in photojournalism? Is it worth it?

I was thinking, if you can take the pictures, they pretty much speak for themselves, and as long as you have a nice portfolio, does it really matter if you have some piece of paper that says you sacrificed four years of your life learning about algebra and sociology in a college enviroment?

I'm considering taking a dp class at the local community college just to help pass the slow times of the winter months, and, obviously, because of my heightened interest in the subject.

By the way, I am in no way saying that I'm a capable professional photographer or anything. I'm just curious if you all think that having a four-year degree would make it *that much* easier to make this hobby into a career, if that opportunity did so happen to present itself somewhere in the future.

edit: Obviously, I'm talking about a job working for a major publication or whatever. Not stock photography because I understand how that works. Is there anyone who does actually make a living doing stock photography, by the way?

Thanks.

dave

Message edited by author 2004-11-10 21:26:19.
 11/10/2004 11:28:47 PM · #2
I am in the same boat as you. I have just gotten into photography and I find myself getting totally absorb in it. I have been doing some reading to try to self educate myself and am hopeful that it will improve my skills. I just bought a new book (The Photographer's Handbook, by John Hedgecoe). It looked pretty good, but time will tell. I have been thinking about formal training myself and have looked into several schools. I too wonder though if it is possible to self teach and become great at the art.
 11/10/2004 11:37:55 PM · #3
I work for the AP out of the SF branch... I have a previous thread on the topic at hand, and it also has my abbreviated life story. I have a BA in Broadcast, MA in Cinema, and a MA in journalism. I also teach at SFSU.

link, scroll down for the whole reply.
//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=140126

I would go to school. Photography is based on experience and a good teacher will give you their experiences as well as teach the tech side.

Adam

Message edited by author 2004-11-10 23:40:48.
 11/10/2004 11:42:57 PM · #4
Thanks for the comments so far. Anyone else have any opinions or experience?

I might have to go to the book store and look around. I bought "Perfect Digital Photos in a SNAP" and it's a good book but doesn't go that far in depth. Basically a few pages worth about the stuff that matters, then about half the book is all about photoshop -- which is cool and all, but I figure I can get to that point (photoshop) later.
 11/10/2004 11:46:20 PM · #5
you can't be taught art - art is in you - just let it evolve
.... david morris

I believe, self taught is the only way to bring out originality and give you the opportunity to develop your own unique style. Taking this road is full of up and downs (like my score on this site) but at the end, you will be a better photographer for it.

for gaining a job? well i don't know about that - but if you can get your work out there and well known, there is nothing stopping you creating a well developed portfolio - which in return will lead you into a successful carrer of photography

for studying? well me for instance, I am very good at memorising all the dots and dashes needed to finish a test with high marks and grades. but would this make me a world class photographer or even some one worth hiring, well - no it wouldn't

you gotta develop a portfolio in either way to display what your capable of !

for studying in a local community college? do they teach adobe photoshop? I doubt it, a lot of them teach in cheap or free software so that anyone can get started. most likely you know more than you would learn there anyway.

I might be wrong but yeh thats my 2 mins of fame

Message edited by author 2004-11-10 23:52:21.
 11/10/2004 11:52:06 PM · #6
Look at life as if you are a camera and save your money for you will be bored to death by the subjectivity factor of this trade. lol

Message edited by author 2004-11-11 00:26:54.
 11/11/2004 12:00:44 AM · #7
listen up. This is one of the biggest lessons I have learned in my life. Photojournalism does not require a degree. In fact, I don't believe that a degree helps hone your skills as a photojournalist. I am on the video side, but it applies in both fields. I got my degree. I worked hard studying everything but how a camera works. Out of the 130 hours I completed I had ONE three hour class that explained how to use a camera. And I was on the "technical" route of the broadcasting department. I wish I had never wasted the time, effort, heartache and money it took to get that worthless degree, because merit is based almost entirely on your resume tape (in still photography, it is your port.) That being said, it is not an easy biz to get into. You have to work hard, but don't use the university route. find out where you want to work. get a job there as a file clerk, or a janitor if you have to. Any job at all. Go buy a police/fire band scanner. On your free time listen to it, and be an ambulance chaser. Take beautiful pictures of the things that a paper would normally run. Call the assignment desk and tell them you have some pictures you would like to send them. After they run 2 or 3 of your pictures, start asking about a photographer job. Keep at it. Don't give up. Keep taking good pictures. Make sure they people who count know who you are.

just my opinion based on my experiances.
drake
 11/11/2004 12:09:25 AM · #8
Originally posted by graphicfunk:
Look at life as if you a camera


haha I hear you there. Not sure if I'm taking this too literally, but I definately notice myself looking at the way light is hitting objects out there all day long or the possible composition of an image. It's strange how I look at things now after only being into this for a month or so.

Also, I notice myself looking at my girlfriend's 'girlie' mags not to check out the women in there but to look at all the different photos.

----

Thanks for the advice. fstopopen, sounds like you've been there, done that.

First things first though, I have to get some nice images for a portfolio going. What would this usually contain? Images on a CD in jpg? Or printed images, or both? Or maybe if my photo was used in a magazine or a website, that magazine or website?

Thanks again.
 11/11/2004 12:20:09 AM · #9
Develop a portfolio which is targeted at the photo job your after or make seperate portfolio for different interviews

taking santa pics christmas - would be portraits of children
taking news - would be newsworthy stuff
advertising - well known objects and how people would use them and stuff

maybe others can tell you the pictures you need to have to get into certain areas

I don't think websites hold up much merit in a portfolio but magazines would - not saying that it wouldn't help to be around on the net but that doesn't really count as a job (in the industry i mean)

Message edited by author 2004-11-11 00:21:05.
 11/11/2004 01:31:59 AM · #10
Originally posted by fstopopen:
listen up...Go buy a police/fire band scanner. On your free time listen to it, and be an ambulance chaser. Take beautiful pictures of the things that a paper would normally run. Call the assignment desk and tell them you have some pictures you would like to send them. After they run 2 or 3 of your pictures, start asking about a photographer job. Keep at it. Don't give up. Keep taking good pictures. Make sure they people who count know who you are.

drake


This is quite possibly the best advice I've read yet. Especially the last sentence. Smokin!
 11/11/2004 02:18:26 AM · #11
Don't knock college... It's a great experience and you learn a lot more than algabra and sociology... The 10 years I spent getting my 2 year degree were some of the best of my life :)
 11/11/2004 04:23:52 AM · #12
I'm in college right now trying to do photography. I am learning that not many schools don't offer what I'm looking for, and that is a dedicated photography program. I have been to two colleges now, been at this for about four years and don’t really have crap to show for it. I have taken ONE B&W class, and that taught me more than all the other classes put together. The college that I’m at right now requires that I take 135 hours of art to get my degree. Out of all those classes are about 5 photography focused classes. That is not worth it to me. I would like to go to some art school but the ones that have what I want are in Colorado and California. Not ready to just pack up and leave right now, so I’m hanging tight doing my photo-a-day shots and trying to make some money. I don’t think college was a good idea for me, but I’m glad that I have been where I have because that has made me who I am todayâ€Â¦but that is life experience and not really education that you sit in a class and learn. Getting your degree is absolutely necessary for most jobs, but I think photography is one that seems to be able to get by without it, you just need to show them you got what they want. Once they see that you can shoot great they will hire youâ€Â¦or whatever. Reading this thread has helped me now in my decision to take a break on college and later on when I’m ready to make a move, even if then, I can go to Colorado; but for now I need money, and all I feel like is that I’m wasting it and myself on college.

Message edited by author 2004-11-11 04:24:16.
 11/11/2004 08:21:28 AM · #13
People who hire photographers will take a degreed applicant ahead of someone who doesn't have formal training. That isn't saying that college is a better teacher than what you can learn from experience; and it is not saying that the college trained person is the better photographer. But it is a fact of life that the people without degrees are found waiting in line behind the ones who have a degree when it comes to getting jobs. If you really want to give yourself the best chance at a carrer as a pro photog, do both. I know it's a cliche but it is true- degrees open doors. In the age of digital, young people with camera and fancy portfolio are going to be a dime a dozen.
 11/11/2004 08:30:48 AM · #14
Originally posted by myqyl:
Don't knock college... It's a great experience and you learn a lot more than algabra and sociology... The 10 years I spent getting my 2 year degree were some of the best of my life :)

Quite agree, university was a fantastic time of my life so far.

I think university helps solidify belief in your own abilities as well as provides you with core fundamentals that help you day-to-day in your profession. If you REALLY WANT to be a professional photographer I wouldn't hesitate in recommending it.

Check out Sportsshooter.com. Practically all the pros there say you need a degree.
 11/11/2004 09:17:14 AM · #15
deapee I would love to see how your work will progress after school or not. I find, I my opinion, that my work is getting better on my own. I hope that some day we both get to be the photographers that we want to be.
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