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10/21/2004 01:57:33 AM · #26 |
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10/21/2004 02:49:11 AM · #27 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I'm just trying to express how deeply, deeply upset the world is over the actions of the current US administration. I'm not anti-US, in the least. The values upon which the country was founded are great and noble, and it is a wonderful place with many wonderful people. It is the Bush administration I'm at odds with, and the blind support of it by many of your citizens. At the hands of a skillful propaganda machine, many many people are being deceived not out of a lack of intelligence, but a lack of an informed, balanced view.
[...]
Your country, your constitution is being bled and burned from under your feet... |
JimmyTheFish,
I, and MANY citizens all across this wonderful nation, AGREE with the above sentiment 100%.
Moreover, I am convinced that on November 2nd John Kerry will be CONCLUSIVELY elected president, unlike what occurred in 2000. Thereafter, Mr. Kerry will move to restore the international respect and goodwill that the Bush administration squandered over the past three and a half years.
I am hopeful and optimistic, and, like MANY MANY American citizens, I'm backing up my "faith with works;" so that on November 3rd I don't wake up with this nagging question on my mind, "Did I do all I could do to put my country back on the right-track?"
I love my country, and I -- and many others -- recognize that what the Bush administration has wrought is not the kind of legacy I want to leave to those that come after me. Unfortunately, since 9/11, many well meaning Americans confused nationalism for patriotism, and in the process forgot about all those wonderful ideals and values that you mention. Just as a quick example of how down-is-up and up-is-down these days, Mr. Bush repeats over and over again that our boys are in Iraq to "fight for freedom;" however, here at home, Mr. Bush's party -- our Commander-in-Chief's party -- prohibits non-supporters from attending Republican rallies, unless they first sign an "oath of support" for Mr. Bush. [ref] In the other hand, Mr. Bush's supporters are often seen at pro-Kerry rallies heckling the Democratic candidate.
I grew up believing in an America where dissent is viewed as legitimate, where dissent is tolerated and where our representatives are accountable to us. However, the Bush administration, and many of its supporters, do not belive in the kind of America that I grew up believing in. This is why I'm backing up my "faith with works," so that others can grow up believing in the America I continue to belive in.
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10/21/2004 06:32:47 AM · #28 |
I just finished reading most of the responses posted to this thread and would like to congratulate everyone for the discussion points raised and the tact used in replies. It's nice to see that differing points of view can be considered.
Everyone have a lollipop!
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10/21/2004 06:51:27 AM · #29 |
Eat s&?% and die.
(Note: he's my brother, I can talk to him like that)
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
I just finished reading most of the responses posted to this thread and would like to congratulate everyone for the discussion points raised and the tact used in replies. It's nice to see that differing points of view can be considered.
Everyone have a lollipop! |
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10/21/2004 11:48:38 AM · #30 |
Beagleboy,
You gonna let your little brother talk to you like that!? Shoot, I guess little brothers never learn. :)
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10/21/2004 12:00:21 PM · #31 |
One of the best things about the USA is that if you really disagree with the way the country is being run, you have the right to leave.
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10/21/2004 12:12:05 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by louddog:
One of the best things about the USA is that if you really disagree with the way the country is being run, you have the right to leave. |
Even better yet, if one disagrees with the way the country is being ran, then one has the RIGHT to change it from WITHIN! Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? In America we have the right to hold our public officials accountable, and that can only be done by remaining here and fighting back.
Message edited by author 2004-10-21 12:12:58.
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10/21/2004 12:58:40 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by bdobe:
Originally posted by louddog:
One of the best things about the USA is that if you really disagree with the way the country is being run, you have the right to leave. |
Even better yet, if one disagrees with the way the country is being ran, then one has the RIGHT to change it from WITHIN! Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? In America we have the right to hold our public officials accountable, and that can only be done by remaining here and fighting back. |
Amen.
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong is not only unpatriotic and servile, it is morally treasonable to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt. |
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10/21/2004 02:22:09 PM · #34 |
Isn't it amazing how some people can take just about everything wrong in the world and blame it on one person? I hear it's Bush's fault the Yankees lost!
Back to the original topic; Thanks Canada for helping us out where you can. It's very much appreciated. If you ever get attacked by terrorist, we will stand by your side and help you defeat them. If you ever fall victim to a natural disaster, we will be there with aid and volunteers and will ask for nothing in return. We very much enjoy having you as a neighbor and appreciate you helping us out in our time of need.
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10/21/2004 02:51:15 PM · #35 |
Not blaming everything at all. However...one person can do a lot. Stalin? How about Hitler? Would it have been better to have someone else in charge? When Hitler was elected he was wildly popular. People thought he was a cool dude.
Originally posted by louddog:
Isn't it amazing how some people can take just about everything wrong in the world and blame it on one person? I hear it's Bush's fault the Yankees lost!
Back to the original topic; Thanks Canada for helping us out where you can. It's very much appreciated. If you ever get attacked by terrorist, we will stand by your side and help you defeat them. If you ever fall victim to a natural disaster, we will be there with aid and volunteers and will ask for nothing in return. We very much enjoy having you as a neighbor and appreciate you helping us out in our time of need. |
Message edited by author 2004-10-21 14:53:33.
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10/21/2004 03:43:21 PM · #36 |
In response to original post:
Don't let the fiscade fool you (sp?).THere are more outraged Canadians over this than happy needle-wielding ones. I,personally, think what's mine is yours.
Not that I've had a flu shot in the past 15 years :-(
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10/21/2004 03:45:25 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
What I still don't understand is that the U.S. can come to us with their hand out for flu vaccine, but when their citizens come to Canada to purchase reasonably priced prescription drugs, they freak.
Many U.S. politicians keep bellowing that our drugs aren't safe, but I guess our vaccines are as good as gold.
Oh well, who am I to try to understand the mind of the politicos.
I'm just glad we can help. Now roll up your sleeve and count back from 5. This will only sting a little... |
Actually, there's a huge debate over the legitimacy of our drugs. Many countries around the world (including the US, France, etc) have banned substances that Canada still loads in to it's drugs and food by the boat loads. Including certain dyes which are proven to cause cancer. |
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10/21/2004 03:47:58 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by bdobe:
Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? |
Errr, shout that around the Congo, Iraq, (most of the middle east for that matter) South Africa, Cuba, even Mexico from what I hear..people are desparately TRYING to leave for exactly this reason. |
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10/21/2004 05:36:19 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by myqyl:
Canada is the kind of nation Americans wish we could be.
My heartfelt thanks :) |
what a joke.. speak for yourself not the rest of America.. you'll find the vast majority does not agree with you... I would never live in a socialist nation... America is about being an independent individual, not about being someone that expects the government to take care of them... the founders of the country came here to get away from government control, not start a country where the government is the provider... America is the greatist nation on earth.. thats why millions of people try to come here each year, even Canadians... the only Americans I know running to Canada were draft dodgers... the people crying for change are asking for socialist ideals to be put it place... democracy or not, socialism is not what America was founded on.. our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves at the ideas some of you have... America is what it is... if you don't like it here pal, then leave...
BTW, I have never had the flu or a flu shot... this scare is completely overblown... only high risk people should even consider it... everyone I know that has gotten a shot in the past has gotten the flue!
As for Madmort and friends saying the Bush Administration mismanaged, well thats not a fact, it is your opinion.. In FACT Bush has done a great job... we were just getting out of the recession Clinton had us in when 911 hit.. we could have easily fallen into a depression.. but we didn't.. in fact the Bush administration saved us from that.. and the economy has been growing ever since... and come election day, I think you'll see that your in the minority...
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10/21/2004 05:42:55 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by Anachronite:
our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves |
Aint that the truth. :/ |
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10/21/2004 06:25:54 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? |
Errr, shout that around the Congo, Iraq, (most of the middle east for that matter) South Africa, Cuba, even Mexico from what I hear..people are desparately TRYING to leave for exactly this reason. |
Oh jeesh GoldBerry, comparing the political situation in the U.S. -- the subject of my comment -- and the countries you list is ridiculous. Please note that I spoke of "mismanaging the country," which is a far cry from a local war, apartheid, devastating economic depression or the conditions that you allude to in your response. As a rhetorical exercise, I could contemplate your question in absolute terms; that is, when confronted with an adverse situation, political or otherwise, is it better to "fight" or to take "flight"? I choose fight. I wonder, where would my country -- the U.S. -- be if brave people had opted to take "flight," rather than "fight": We might still be a segregated country; women might still not have the right to vote; we might still be caught in a quagmire in Vietnam... and so on. Again, as an "academic" exercise, the rhetorical question you pose might have some relevance; but, in the context of domestic politics and of holding public officials accountable, the rhetorical question bears little relevance.
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10/21/2004 06:36:42 PM · #42 |
Sorry folks :( All I meant to do was thank a neighbor for being neighborly... I should have known the thread would invoke those that believe that good relations with other nations is somehow unpatriotic... It's truly sad that some Americans believe that being rude is patriotic and that thanking another nation for their kindness is Unamerican... I wonder what the founders would think of their behavior...
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10/21/2004 07:20:03 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by louddog:
Isn't it amazing how some people can take just about everything wrong in the world and blame it on one person? I hear it's Bush's fault the Yankees lost!
Back to the original topic; Thanks Canada for helping us out where you can. It's very much appreciated. If you ever get attacked by terrorist, we will stand by your side and help you defeat them. If you ever fall victim to a natural disaster, we will be there with aid and volunteers and will ask for nothing in return. We very much enjoy having you as a neighbor and appreciate you helping us out in our time of need. |
Thanks man. Wanna a beer and a tuque?
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10/21/2004 07:27:28 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
Originally posted by louddog:
Isn't it amazing how some people can take just about everything wrong in the world and blame it on one person? I hear it's Bush's fault the Yankees lost!
Back to the original topic; Thanks Canada for helping us out where you can. It's very much appreciated. If you ever get attacked by terrorist, we will stand by your side and help you defeat them. If you ever fall victim to a natural disaster, we will be there with aid and volunteers and will ask for nothing in return. We very much enjoy having you as a neighbor and appreciate you helping us out in our time of need. |
Thanks man. Wanna a beer and a tuque? |
I have to ask, what the heck is a "tuque"? This is what Google turned up: //web.syr.edu/~jmmckenz/tuque/
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10/21/2004 07:28:36 PM · #45 |
It's also a toque. (winter hat)
Message edited by author 2004-10-21 19:29:17.
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10/21/2004 07:32:32 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by bdobe:
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? |
Errr, shout that around the Congo, Iraq, (most of the middle east for that matter) South Africa, Cuba, even Mexico from what I hear..people are desparately TRYING to leave for exactly this reason. |
Oh jeesh GoldBerry, comparing the political situation in the U.S. -- the subject of my comment -- and the countries you list is ridiculous. Please note that I spoke of "mismanaging the country," which is a far cry from a local war, apartheid, devastating economic depression or the conditions that you allude to in your response. As a rhetorical exercise, I could contemplate your question in absolute terms; that is, when confronted with an adverse situation, political or otherwise, is it better to "fight" or to take "flight"? I choose fight. I wonder, where would my country -- the U.S. -- be if brave people had opted to take "flight," rather than "fight": We might still be a segregated country; women might still not have the right to vote; we might still be caught in a quagmire in Vietnam... and so on. Again, as an "academic" exercise, the rhetorical question you pose might have some relevance; but, in the context of domestic politics and of holding public officials accountable, the rhetorical question bears little relevance. |
As ridiculous as comparing Bush to Hitler and Stalin???
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10/21/2004 07:35:48 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
Originally posted by louddog:
Isn't it amazing how some people can take just about everything wrong in the world and blame it on one person? I hear it's Bush's fault the Yankees lost!
Back to the original topic; Thanks Canada for helping us out where you can. It's very much appreciated. If you ever get attacked by terrorist, we will stand by your side and help you defeat them. If you ever fall victim to a natural disaster, we will be there with aid and volunteers and will ask for nothing in return. We very much enjoy having you as a neighbor and appreciate you helping us out in our time of need. |
Thanks man. Wanna a beer and a tuque? |
MMMMMMMMMMM Canadian Beer! Thanks again Canada! I'll pass on the hat though.
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10/21/2004 07:36:54 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
Just to mix it up a bit; the US is also the worst largest producer of pollution, nuclear weapons, and toxic chemicals. |
And food. |
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10/21/2004 07:37:48 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by louddog:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? |
Errr, shout that around the Congo, Iraq, (most of the middle east for that matter) South Africa, Cuba, even Mexico from what I hear..people are desparately TRYING to leave for exactly this reason. |
Oh jeesh GoldBerry, comparing the political situation in the U.S. -- the subject of my comment -- and the countries you list is ridiculous. Please note that I spoke of "mismanaging the country," which is a far cry from a local war, apartheid, devastating economic depression or the conditions that you allude to in your response. As a rhetorical exercise, I could contemplate your question in absolute terms; that is, when confronted with an adverse situation, political or otherwise, is it better to "fight" or to take "flight"? I choose fight. I wonder, where would my country -- the U.S. -- be if brave people had opted to take "flight," rather than "fight": We might still be a segregated country; women might still not have the right to vote; we might still be caught in a quagmire in Vietnam... and so on. Again, as an "academic" exercise, the rhetorical question you pose might have some relevance; but, in the context of domestic politics and of holding public officials accountable, the rhetorical question bears little relevance. |
As ridiculous as comparing Bush to Hitler and Stalin??? |
WHAT THE F@#K!?
When HAVE I compared Bush to Hitler or Stalin?
Message edited by author 2004-10-21 19:39:13.
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10/21/2004 07:42:39 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by bdobe:
Originally posted by louddog:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by bdobe:
Why would anyone want to leave the country one loves simply because a presidential administration is completely mismanaging the country!? |
Errr, shout that around the Congo, Iraq, (most of the middle east for that matter) South Africa, Cuba, even Mexico from what I hear..people are desparately TRYING to leave for exactly this reason. |
Oh jeesh GoldBerry, comparing the political situation in the U.S. -- the subject of my comment -- and the countries you list is ridiculous. Please note that I spoke of "mismanaging the country," which is a far cry from a local war, apartheid, devastating economic depression or the conditions that you allude to in your response. As a rhetorical exercise, I could contemplate your question in absolute terms; that is, when confronted with an adverse situation, political or otherwise, is it better to "fight" or to take "flight"? I choose fight. I wonder, where would my country -- the U.S. -- be if brave people had opted to take "flight," rather than "fight": We might still be a segregated country; women might still not have the right to vote; we might still be caught in a quagmire in Vietnam... and so on. Again, as an "academic" exercise, the rhetorical question you pose might have some relevance; but, in the context of domestic politics and of holding public officials accountable, the rhetorical question bears little relevance. |
As ridiculous as comparing Bush to Hitler and Stalin??? |
WHAT THE F@#K!?
When HAVE I compared Bush to Hitler or Stalin? |
I didn't F*&^%$&*ing say that you F&%*$(*ing said that. Read F%$#@ing closer next F^$%#%ing time, please.
However, since you choose to call Goldberry's comaparison ridiculous I was wondering why the F*^(&% you didn't say a F&^%%*)&ing thing about the other ridiculous comparison mentioned.
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