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08/26/2004 11:11:39 AM · #1 |
Ranks of Poverty, Uninsured Rose in 2003
"Approximately 35.8 million people lived below the poverty line in 2003, or about 12.5 percent of the population, according to the bureau. That was up from 34.5 million, or 12.1 percent in 2002.
The rise was more dramatic for children. There were 12.9 million living in poverty last year, or 17.6 percent of the under-18 population. That was an increase of about 800,000 from 2002, when 16.7 percent of all children were in poverty. "
CNN story...
Interstingly FOX NEWS story is very short on that ?
CBS got the whole version..
Map : people with no insurance
Texas top with 24.7 %
Message edited by author 2004-08-26 11:23:59. |
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08/26/2004 01:04:00 PM · #2 |
But that is impossible!!
George Bush told us that the vast majority of his tax cuts would benefit those at the bottom.
And he keeps telling us how GREAT the economy is doing, and about all those new jobs.... I don't get it. ;)
Message edited by author 2004-08-26 13:04:24. |
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08/26/2004 01:27:58 PM · #3 |
It is unreal to think that so many Americans live in poverty. I fear that someday there will only be two economic classes in USA, Filthy rich and the rest of us. It's not supposed to work this way but the problem with the "trickle down" theory. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
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08/26/2004 01:48:45 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by joanns:
It is unreal to think that so many Americans live in poverty. I fear that someday there will only be two economic classes in USA, Filthy rich and the rest of us. It's not supposed to work this way but the problem with the "trickle down" theory. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. |
Indeed. Register to vote people, since we are not multi millionaires, that’s all we can do. |
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08/26/2004 04:41:41 PM · #5 |
"A Democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of Government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that Democracy always collapses over a loose fiscal policy, always to be followed by a Dictatorship."
Written by Professor Alexander Fraser Tytler, nearly two centuries ago while our thirteen original states were still colonies of Great Britain. At the time he was writing of the decline and fall of the Athenian Republic over two thousand years before.
Looks like liberals have discovered the secret - and Democracy is doomed.
Oh, and for the record, in general, the "poor" in our country aren't.
Fact #1: The way the Government measures it, you can be a multi-millionaire living in a paid-for three million dollar home and have 7 million dollars in the bank and still be defined by the government as "living in poverty." if you don't have "income".
Fact #2: If 12.5% of U.S. citizens are living below the "poverty" line, then how is it that
a) 94.6% of households in the U.S. have telephone service
b) 98.2% of households have televisions ( and the average number of sets per home is 2.4 )
c) 68.0% of households have CABLE television service
d) 86.4% of households have Video Cassette Recorders
e) 67.9% of households own their own homes
f) 92.0% of households own automobiles ( and the average number of autos is 1.8 )
Ron |
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08/26/2004 04:46:47 PM · #6 |
Wow. I must be living in poverty then.
I don't have a phone service to my house, I only have one television, I don't have a VCR, I don't own my own home.
Curious how your figures state that 94.6% of households have phone service. Did they call them to check on this ? Yes I'm being facetious, yes the point of how the data is acquired is meaningful, both for the poverty figures and for the usage figures Ron quotes.
300 million people is a hard number to meaningfully survey. A few million either way can easily get overlooked. The elections have a hard enough time getting a count, never mind VCR salesmen.
Message edited by author 2004-08-26 16:48:38.
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08/26/2004 06:26:42 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by gingerbaker:
But that is impossible!!
George Bush told us that the vast majority of his tax cuts would benefit those at the bottom.
And he keeps telling us how GREAT the economy is doing, and about all those new jobs.... I don't get it. ;) |
America, the only nation on earth where you can have a car, cell phone, HBO, big screen TV, xbox, $150 Nikes and $50 of lotto tickets a month and still be considered poor. Don’t worry we can just tax the rich and pay people to sit home and pump out more welfare recipients. That will fix everything.
Message edited by author 2004-08-26 18:27:08. |
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08/26/2004 06:41:25 PM · #8 |
Nice slam on the fox story. One problem. The Fox story is 672 words long and the CNN story is only 651 words long. So “interestingly CNN story is very short on that”. What should we deduce form that? |
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08/26/2004 06:47:34 PM · #9 |
Id be curious all the factors that make up "the poverty line".
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08/26/2004 07:12:38 PM · #10 |
[quote=pitsaman]
Map : people with no insurance
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08/26/2004 07:15:33 PM · #11 |
Nobody is saying that is bad here,I know that 68 % of households own a home.
The fact is ,it is going down not up !And we should not let that happen. |
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08/26/2004 07:40:02 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
Id be curious all the factors that make up "the poverty line". |
//aspe.hhs.gov/poverty/index.shtml |
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08/26/2004 08:30:31 PM · #13 |
This is kind of interesting, but very long.
//www.heritage.org/Research/Welfare/BG1221.cfm
Message edited by author 2004-08-26 20:49:49. |
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08/26/2004 09:34:37 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by thelsel:
Nice slam on the fox story. One problem. The Fox story is 672 words long and the CNN story is only 651 words long. So “interestingly CNN story is very short on that”. What should we deduce form that? |
That CNN lifted their story from Reuters wire service and Fox lifted theirs from the Associated Press wire service ? |
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08/26/2004 10:06:32 PM · #15 |
Yes, everytime a repbubican is presisdent the poverty rate is always higher and the homeless increase. Yet the democrats come and leave office and the problem remains the same. The only thing is that the liberal media does not discuss the poor when the democrats are in office.
Well, not too long ago, it was learned that the poor in this country are too overweight.
Such is the wisdom that partisanship produces in having intelligent people sound so superficial. I was born poor. I was raised in the ghetto. I could not even finish school. Yet, this country gave me the chance to struggle out of poverty and dramatically upgrade my standard of living and exceed the income of those who did college and hold phd's.
Look, the poor will always be with us. Add to this the influx of foreigners who come to feed on our system. The new additions and strains on our resources forces this number of poor to rise. Most countries outside the USA are really into poperty. Yet, the poor would prefer to be poor in America than poor in their countries.
No program will wipe out poverty. Bring us the poor of the world and America will simply become a third world country. Systems have been tried such as socialism, communism and these just do not work. And if they did what kind of life would you live? No competing brands and lines everywhere. Each is alloted x amount of the resources and the end of customer service.
The problem of the poor is univesal and has been with us from the start and it will always be with us. Long ago they said give them education and the poor will disappear. Well, in America education is rampant and notice that the poor numbers is not at all checked.
Life is not fair. It was never meant to be. But the solution to poverty has evaded humanity and the best minds. It is okay to make yourself feel better that you would give up all the comforts you now enjoy so that others will have a part...but soon the cup runs dry and we are all reduced to the same level.
Being that this is a monumental problem with no immediate solution, politicians feed on this ambiguity and each promise a solution. At the end, they only enrich themselves at our cost and come with programs which only enslave the poor even more.
It is simply a problem which eludes its own solution. I know, the intelligent feel that all problems can be solved if we expend enough time in trying to solve it. This is the same mentallity that says we can turn our enemies into friends if only we spend the time to communicate with them. History proves all these assumptions wrong. Yet, we are dependent on Pandora's box. She sits atop the box containing "Hope." And that is all that we have.
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08/26/2004 10:41:47 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by pitsaman:
Nobody is saying that is bad here,I know that 68 % of households own a home.
The fact is ,it is going down not up !And we should not let that happen. |
Actually, it is NOT going down. It is increasing every year.
Year... Percent of home ownership
1994... 64.0
1995... 64.7
1996... 65.4
1997... 65.7
1998... 66.3
1999... 66.8
2000... 67.4
2001... 67.8
2002... 67.9 latest year for which figures are available
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08/26/2004 10:49:07 PM · #17 |
Damn graphicfunk, I actually agree with several of your statements.
Your sounding pretty moderate, you’d better be careful.. :) |
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08/27/2004 12:45:53 AM · #18 |
This is a great, and classic discussion! For a moment, let me be deliberately provocative. It will probably get me into trouble, but hey, that's life, too.
Quote: "Approximately 35.8 million people lived below the poverty line in 2003."
Consideration: Does anyone know what the "poverty line" is? It is an arbitrary income amount. If you're below it, you're below the poverty line. If you're above it, you're above the poverty line. Who sets it. Federal government. Anyone know where it's set? When it was last reset?
Quote: "It is unreal to think that so many Americans live in poverty."
Consideration: Living below the poverty line is not the same thing as "living in poverty." The poverty line does not count assets (like retirement savings). It doesn't count support from parents, family or children. Is poverty a relationship between earned income and an arbitrary line, or is it lack of adaquate food, safety, shelter, and most of all dignity? The story and the discussion haven't focused on the tradgedy of living without dignity and all it implies.
Quote: I don't have a phone service to my house.
Consideration: My son doesn't have phone service to his house either. Instead he has a cell phone and finds it completely adaquate. And even if he didn't, where is it written that phone service is one of life's little necessities (like food)?
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08/27/2004 12:47:45 AM · #19 |
Concluding my prior post: Here's my point. we often (and sometimes inadvertantly) play fast and loose with the facts. We internalize sound bites and the attractive cliche. Lets all be a bit more critical in our thinking, a bit more thoughtful about what is presented to us as news, and try to get to some depth on the issues we're debating.
My intention is not to offend or belittle, but it is to offer a provocative POV.
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08/27/2004 02:09:30 AM · #20 |
| More lenses,I'm buying more lenses,don't want to be poor.... |
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08/27/2004 07:21:37 AM · #21 |
I have seen a lot of people "below the poverty line."
Some in my neighborhood now. 2 18-21 year old boys and their Mom. They get Medicaid (were talking about my job and they told me, without asking)for healthcare, and some other kind of assitance (can't remember). They "own" the $245,000 home, she drives a 2003 Durango, the boys have two "Fast and Furious" cars, 2 brand new (dealer plates still on) Suzuki crotch rockets, 2 jetski's, mechanics equipment (cherrypicker, full sets of Craftsman tools, etc), and a 2000-somethin Camaro. 46+ inch TV and giant surround sound system and leather furniture, etc., etc., etc. They are below poverty line!?!...with money that is reported!!
I need to ask them what their jobs are, cuz I am in the wrong field. Then again, they have an older brother in jail for trafficing drugs, so guess what?
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08/27/2004 08:48:06 AM · #22 |
I work at the Bureau of Census.
I can tell that 43.2% of all statistics is made up. :-)
Message edited by author 2004-08-27 09:06:46.
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08/27/2004 08:48:43 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by graphicfunk:
No program will wipe out poverty. . |
I don't think that is true and I believe my position is proven in many countries in the world.
Go to Canada. Tell me where the poverty is. Go to Denmark. Find some real poverty and I will buy you dinner. Go to many european countries and the same will be true.
Poverty is not unavoidable - it is the product of lousy policies. Other countries have done a much better job, over a good long time, of taking care of their people, then the U.S.
They have better policies. On purpose.
And they as societies give up things for it, too. Like an enormous gap between the rich and the poor. Like huge military expenditures. Most importantly, the citizens long ago gave up the notion that they were not mutually interconnected, and that the PUBLIC GOOD was the highest pursuit of government.
Which is pretty different from what we have here, I think. Which still seems to be : if it's good for Goodyear, it's good for America. |
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08/27/2004 09:00:29 AM · #24 |
Originally posted by giega:
I work at the Bureau of Census. I can tell that 43.2% of all statistics is made up. |
Quit !
Message edited by author 2004-08-27 10:38:04. |
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08/27/2004 09:10:24 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by pitsaman:
Originally posted by giega:
I work at the Bureau of Census. I can tell that 43.2% of all statistics is made up. |
Quit !
Go work for Swiftboat veterans for truth :-) |
I don't involve myself in politics, sorry :-)
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