Advice on basic light set up for home studio

Tamron SP 24-70mm f/2.8 Di VC USD Canon Mount

11/11/2011 09:38:04 AM · #1

I bought a roll of thick white paper background to take some photos at home of my children. I was very pleased with my first attempt shown below which was taken in my living room mid-day with the subject facing the window and patio doors. The only light was a Speedlite 430 EXII which was attached to the top of the camera and turned on and faced upwards. I have not learnt how to use this light yet so simply turn it on and use whatever the default setting is.

Anyway the photo had quite a lot of shadow which I managed to reduce in Photoshop with my limited knowledge of editing.

I assume it would be better to have sufficient light to not have to do this in Photoshop or at least not to the same extent. I therefore seek advice on a simple lighting set up that is not going to break the bank. I will probably only take photos like this on rare occasions as it involves rearranging the living room to do so though it is nice to be able to take shots like this rather than go to a professional studio and have someone else take them.

Any advice appreciated.

Mike

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

11/11/2011 09:42:22 AM · #2

go to the mall and check out the lighting setups and modifiers of say Picture People and then reproduce at home with halogens or cheap slave flashes.

sjhuls

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/11/2011 10:04:55 AM · #3

Looking at your camera settings I think you need more lighting. You are at 400 at f 5.6 and your shutter speed is still quite low. You need to get enough light to be able to shoot at f 7.1 or higher with your shutter speed at 1/100 or higher. The reason the pumpkins and the little girl in the background are a little out of focus is the f stop and the shutter speed.

Here is what I have and I obtained everything for around $250 you might have to spend more because I got a great deal on some cheep flashes with peanut triggers already on them:

A good Speed light flash(you already have this)
at least 2 additional light sources I would find some as cheap as you can, maybe some cheap strobes from cowboy studios(100-250 for a set of 2) depending on what you get.
At least 1 soft box(I would recommend 2) you can also get these from cowboy studios with a stand for around $40

When you shoot do it in a place where you can control the light, a little bit of light is okay so that you can focus on the subject but the main light source should be from your flashes so that the other light doesn't mess up your set-up.

You need 1 flash as your main source, kind of diagonally to the side. The other source can be a reflected from a large reflector placed on the other side (if you get another flash then you can use it for fill instead). One flash should be overhead on the background this will get your background a bit more white it still won't be perfect(you need a much more expensive set-up to light up the whole background) but at least it will eliminate cast shadows. What ever you use on camera to trigger the other flashes it should be pointed toward the ceiling as a fill not directly at the subject if you are using the on camera flash to trigger use a piece of cardboard taped in front to keep it from hitting your subject directly.

Anyway this is how I light most of my subjects and I only spent around $250 for everything. I have 4 flashes (1 nicer speedlight, and 3 additional cheep ones) And two softboxes with stands.

Garry

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

11/11/2011 10:18:36 AM · #4

Subscribing to thread...very interested to read up on setups.

BTW...Jen, is there a difference/preference to using a reflector or a second flash for fill? Also, what is the difference between using a softbox vs a shoot-through umbrella?

11/11/2011 10:22:53 AM · #5

Thank you sjhuls - that is a really useful reply. I especially thank you for the advice on my settings - it was annoying that the baby and pumpkin in the rear were out of focus and your explanation helps me see the reason. The photo shoot must have lasted 10 minutes maximum as the little ones were quite grumpy and tired so it was a case of just shooting lots of photos like crazy rather than a slow methodical approach.

I will look into these light suggestions and the cowboy studios site and see if I can source something similar in the UK.

Many thanks

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/11/2011 10:24:53 AM · #6

Originally posted by mike_311:

go to the mall and check out the lighting setups and modifiers of say Picture People and then reproduce at home with halogens or cheap slave flashes.

Thanks mike_311. Unfortunately we don't have any malls here but assume you mean go to have a peek at a professional studio and reproduce their set up. Out of interest, what is a cheap slave flash? Do you have any examples of such a flash?

Message edited by author 2011-11-11 10:25:22.

sjhuls

Canon EOS-7D

11/11/2011 10:31:08 AM · #7

Originally posted by gcoulson:

I don't think there is a huge difference, so if you have a tight space an umbrella might be a better option because they fold up and store easier. I think a soft box gives you slightly more control. Really it's just a matter of personal preference.

As far as using a second flash verses reflector there is a huge difference, a second flash as fill is much easier to control and much more powerful so if you are shooting multiple people then it's almost a must in my opinion. I always have to get the reflector really close to my subject to get decent results. A second flash can be farther away and doesn't inter-fear with your shot.

Tamron SP 24-70mm f/2.8 Di VC USD Canon Mount

11/11/2011 10:44:53 AM · #8

Originally posted by gcoulson:

Yes, there is a difference between using a softbox and an umbrella. However, for those who are new to using off camera flash that difference seems insignificant and the space consideration that has been mentioned would probably be more important.

Check out this Youtube video in which the difference is very well illustrated.

By the way, The Strobist Blog is the resource that is often pointed to in threads like this, and for good reason. It will teach you all of the answers to the questions that have been asked here so far and a lot more. After you go to the welcome page start on the lesson Strobist 101. I guarantee you a kick start to everything that you need to know to use off camera flash on a budget. The tell you what you need to know from what to use and where to buy it.

Mike

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

11/11/2011 11:04:13 AM · #9

Originally posted by paulsteven:

Originally posted by mike_311:
go to the mall and check out the lighting setups and modifiers of say Picture People and then reproduce at home with halogens or cheap slave flashes.

Thanks mike_311. Unfortunately we don't have any malls here but assume you mean go to have a peek at a professional studio and reproduce their set up. Out of interest, what is a cheap slave flash? Do you have any examples of such a flash?

yes that's pretty much what i was suggesting, there is a picture people in the mall by me where the take the pictures right out in the open. they have just like Jen described a main flash angled off to the front, one on top to kill backdrop shadows and what appears to be two in a softbox on each side of the subject.

a slave flash that can be triggered by another when it fires, you could use them off camera however you want and use your main speedlight to trigger them. you can usually get them cheap since they dont have to do anything but flash.

atupdate

Pentax K-R

Promaster 28-200mm f/3.8-5.6 XR IF

11/11/2011 11:55:05 AM · #10

Here are a few websites I found worthy of visiting.

Lighting Fundamentals

Portrait Photography Lighitng 101

Portrait Lighting Cheat Sheets

Tim

11/24/2011 05:39:54 AM · #11

Would these be of any good to use in conjunction with the Speedlite?

Link to soft boxes on Amazon

Message edited by author 2011-11-24 05:40:33.

11/24/2011 10:06:19 AM · #12

Not without an adapter to mount them on the speedlights instead of the continuous lights that they come with and are designed for.

There are lots of softboxes available that are designed primarily for speedlights. Without seeing a close up and detailed shot of these umbrellas I can't tell if they can be made to work or not, however, if you buy this package then you will be paying for the continuous lighting portion that you don't need. I've got several continuous fixtures and bulbs that I don't need because I did the same thing. I do use the umbrellas with my speedlights using a mount for this purpose, something like this.

These are more along the lines of what you might want to consider for use with speedlights:

Umbrella kit
Softbox kit

edit to add: Here's a discussion on the umbrella adapters that I referred to above. I've mentioned it before, but I can't emphasize it enough, there is so much information for what you are intending to do at The Strobist Blog. I would definitely go there and start with the lesson Lighting 101.

After you learn about the basics and have a better understanding of what you will need and, just as important, what you won't need (like continuous lighting), then you can go here for strobist kits at Midwest Photo Exchange. This part of Midwest Photo Exchange has been designed to meet the needs of photogs who want to use speedlights as their source of lighting.

Really! I don't mind helping out in the forums, but there is no better place to learn all of this than the Strobist Blog.

Message edited by author 2011-11-24 10:25:12.

11/24/2011 10:20:37 AM · #13

Thanks yakatme

Sorry for my newbie question..

I did buy a white umbrella and stand and bracket but must confess I have not used it yet.

I am trying to organise my set up to take some photos of my daughters for a Christmas card idea and here is what I have so far:

Canon 40D
EF 50M 1.8 II
EF-S 17-85 mm Kit Lens
Tripod
Speedlite 430 EX II
White Umbrella and stand and bracket
Stand and bracket to mount speedlite
Some cheap ebay cable to enable me to mount flash on the stand.
A cheap ebay radio control for the flash
Huge white paper backdrop and frame to hang it on

And this is on its way: 42" reflector

Anyway my previous attempts at doing a photo shoot like this was fairly successful using just the Flash mounted on top of the camera and the whote backdrop directly facing the patio doors. However I did find that things were a little grey and there were quite a few shadows. I would prefer to get my lighting set up better to prevent this as much as possible. I am on a tight budget so thought the softbox lights may do the job.

There seems to be all sorts of types of lights and lighting set ups possible so it is all a bit confusing.

I had hoped to do the shoot this weekend so was going to make some last minute purchases in preparation.

Btw, the girls will be wearing white fairy/angel dresses so this is probably going to cause me problems with white on white:)

Message edited by author 2011-11-24 10:25:58.

11/24/2011 10:25:51 AM · #14

Look back at my post. Instead of posting again I edited my post to include a lot more info.

11/24/2011 10:26:51 AM · #15

Ok thanks yakatme

11/24/2011 10:40:29 AM · #16

Yes, I did see the results of your first attempt and I saw that you got a lot of feedback before I had a chance to chime in.

Here's the way that I 'backward engineer' what you did and how I approach it instead: It looks to me like your image used a combination of ambient lighting and flash because there seems to be some motion blur. Because you didn't have enough flash illumination you had to rely on ambient lighting a little and you used too slow of a shutter speed to make the exposure without motion blur.

Without using a light meter you need another way to determine if what you are doing is going to work out. What I do is to shoot on manual settings and compare an exposure with the speedlights and without. The one without should be a pretty dark exposure so that the one with your flashes is properly exposed. That way you know that your flashes are the primary light source. When you are using flash as your primary light source you eliminate two problems, motion blur and mixed white balance problems.

As mentioned before, you will need a dedicated flash just for the backdrop. Be careful to not over do it on the intensity. A little off white is okay and easier to deal with in post processing than an over blown background. I made that mistake several times in the beginning.

The white dresses should not be a significant problem. It will just take some time adjusting the lights to get it right. One very important thing to not forget: there are several variables in adjusting the lights. Besides the obvious flash power, distance from your subject makes a big difference in illumination of your subject. Distance also has other effects but I'll let you discover that on The Strobist Blog and let them explain it better and more concisely than I can.

I would start with the following settings and adjust from there:

f/8, shutter speed at around 1/200 but no more than 1/250, flash intensity at medium.

I have to get to cooking Thanksgiving dinner, but I'll check back later.

11/24/2011 10:50:31 AM · #17

Thanks yakatme - very helpful indeed.

You are correct that my photo used ambient lighting and flash. I figured the natural light from the patio door windows would not be sufficient on their own hence the use of Flash. And I was pretty sure the Flash wouldn't be enough on its own if I closed the curtains. The curtains are yellow so thought that would be a bad idea anyway. This is the only room in my house that the white backdrop will fit in and it is a squeeze at that.

I will give what you suggest a go and also finish watching the videos on the strobist (which are damn good!!) I am not sure if I will have time or the money to get an additional dedicated flash for the backdrop but will have a better idea of what I need after checking out the links you kindly provided. Though did spot this on Amazon which looks pretty good - not sure how one triggers a flash like this though if I already have the 430 EX attached to my camera.

I will not get a chance to test the set up properly until the weekend as it requires quite a bit of upheaval of the living room and my other half wouldn't be too keen on me doing that today:)

I will report back with my results.

Happy Thanksgiving!!

Message edited by author 2011-11-24 11:07:43.

mcaldo

Samsung GX-10

Pentax SMC-F 50mm f/1.7

11/24/2011 06:45:18 PM · #18

Originally posted by paulsteven:

Though did spot this on Amazon which looks pretty good - not sure how one triggers a flash like this though if I already have the 430 EX attached to my camera.

Hi Paul. I had a look to the link and saw a review from someone lamenting that it won't work in TTL mode with his canon camera.
Probalby you have seen that as well and it might not be important to you, but just in case..

Message edited by author 2011-11-24 18:45:47.

11/27/2011 04:08:53 AM · #19

Thanks mcaldo

Yes I did read that too but bought one anyway as I really needed to do this photoshoot this weekend in time to get my cards made for Christmas.

Doing the shoot later today so will report back on how things turned out. May try a shoot in the forest rather than inside with the white backdrop so that should be fun:)

PuppyDogMom

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/27/2011 09:03:53 AM · #20

OK...no laughing...what's cowboy studio?

Leo

Apple iPhone Xr

11/27/2011 12:34:26 PM · #21

Originally posted by PuppyDogMom:

OK...no laughing...what's cowboy studio?

It's an online company that sells lighting equipment. Link for cowboy studio.

tanguera

Nikon D750

Sigma 35mm f/1.4 DG HSM for Nikon

11/27/2011 01:17:48 PM · #22

Originally posted by yakatme:

Check out this Youtube video in which the difference is very well illustrated.

In this clip, he is shooting into the umbrella, using the reflective surface, which most definitely would produce a somewhat harsher light. I would argue that this is not a true comparable example of softbox vs umbrella. Shooting through a white umbrella produces almost indistinguishable lighting differences. If the umbrella is large enough, despite the curvature the falloff at the edges is almost exactly like that of the softbox.

kgeary

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

11/27/2011 06:18:00 PM · #23

You should probably start with one light and ditch the "studio" attempts until you get better at one light. Once you better understand one light you'll understand what you need to start adding as you work your way to a full studio setup.

You already have a 430ex, so what I'd recommend you purchase is:

Cheetah QBOX 24 for a modifier for your 430ex.
Cheetah Boom for more versatile light positions.

Start there, master it, and then work up.