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06/24/2004 11:15:25 AM · #51 |
Well GW
Tell me something about this photo
You have been a photographer for 36 years, I've been one for 2. Still I'm able to that this photo is an horrible shot. The background is really stupid and I know that even I could do better, then when I write my thought about this shot, (which are not unfair, the shot is terrible), then you go crying like a little baby. If you have been taken so bad photos for 36 years I would have though you should be used to people talking badly of you photos and you should mark them words and try to learn from them. For example in this fish shot, mind you background. The comment I left on this shot is just in you spirit of "helpful" comments. When you say that people only should give those "nice shot" comments to avoid angry people, that is so not true, you just have to be careful how you put things, guide people, don't trash them down. It's just like in real life, you have to communucate with respect for others. |
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06/24/2004 11:16:33 AM · #52 |
Originally posted by Imagineer:
Anyone whose profile pic shows them posing with their gun resting on a dead moose must enjoy courting controversy.
It's been an entertaining thread leading to some blatant honesty by many - albeit slightly angered. The odd spot of heat on this site really is not to its detriment but actuially adds to its cultural diversity. The threads will die a natural death soon enough... |
Well put.
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06/24/2004 11:22:59 AM · #53 |
| I know my name was mentioned. I wanted to see how he reacted to his own style of commenting. I don't think he really found them helpful or appreciated my time. |
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06/24/2004 11:38:41 AM · #54 |
Originally posted by zeuszen:
Originally posted by Imagineer:
Anyone whose profile pic shows them posing with their gun resting on a dead moose must enjoy courting controversy.
It's been an entertaining thread leading to some blatant honesty by many - albeit slightly angered. The odd spot of heat on this site really is not to its detriment but actuially adds to its cultural diversity. The threads will die a natural death soon enough... |
Well put. |
here...here
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06/24/2004 11:39:21 AM · #55 |
As if it weren't bad enough for making all those rude comments, he had to go start another thread and start naming names, that's just plain personal and vindicative. If you had any manners or respect, you know it's not cool to point out the exact person. Glad I wasn't named in the complaint. And he was talking about blacklash, I think he's just asking for a strong reaction from this forum.
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06/24/2004 11:48:48 AM · #56 |
aren't you people bored with this yet?
drake |
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06/24/2004 11:53:22 AM · #57 |
Originally posted by Sonifo:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by bestagents:
...I know how, umm, frustrating or discouraging it can be to look at 200-400 pics in a challenge and see many that, well, probably should not have been submitted. |
This is the phrase which comes off as arrogant, mean, and contrary to the purpose and spirit of DPC, and really pushes my button. The rules lay out quite clearly which photos should "be submitted" -- every other aspect of the photo is open to comment, but not that.
If you were a teacher, would you really tell the kids not to bother turning in their work if they didn't think they'd get an "A"? |
You would actually let your kid turn in work if it wasn't an A to him? My kids try their hardest at everything they do. If it is not an A to them then they wouldn't turn it in. Life should be like this. Why do something halfway right? Doesn't make sense to me. People should give it their all.
If you all want to show your snapshots then get a gallery somewhere, don't submit them to a challenge. |
I think you're making a great point, but against your own argument.
If your kid worked hard all week on a school assignment (which the whole point of is to learn), really applied HIS abilities, and completed what he thought was the best he could do, and turned his assignment in, expecting to it to be graded and returned to him showing where he went wrong or how to do it better next time, so he could "learn" from it... and then he got it back with a response from the teacher like this:
I can't believe you turned in work like this kid. I have been a teacher and grading papers for "blank" years, and I have never been forced to read such dribble as this. Your punctuation and grammar are terrible, let alone the content is boring and dull at best. I could write better in my sleep. I sure hope you do better in your other classes. Don't give up the vo-tech program. What were you thinking? Duh!
I suppose when he came home to you ready to drop out of school, you would think good for that teacher for speaking his mind and all the constructive criticism. What's wrong with you son/daugher? You worked all week and you didn't turn in an "A"? Why did I let you turn this in? Doesn't make sense to me. I don't think you did your best.
etc. etc.
If a teacher did this even once or twice it simply would not be acceptable. Anyone condoning Mr. GW, because they see some good comments, or the one they received was helpful, and I agree some of his stuff is, they need to check out ALL of these threads and ALL of his comments/actions in question.
I realize this is not a real "school", but IMO, this arrogant, self-serving, mean spirited, demeaning, rude, demoralizing personal attacks, even if not all the time is simply...unacceptable.
Also, on a side note, as a 9year veteran of the Navy, I find it offensive to imply that this behaviour is ok because of, or due to a military background. You can be from the military, you can be direct and to the point, you can offer criticism, without being cruel or harsh.
ps. mean people suk!
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06/24/2004 12:02:41 PM · #58 |
Originally posted by fstopopen:
aren't you people bored with this yet?
drake |
You're here too, aren't ya? 
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06/24/2004 12:14:50 PM · #59 |
Hello Glacier,
Seems this post has made you famous. Look at these stats:
Challenges Entered: 4
Votes Cast: 805
Avg Vote Cast: 5.6522
Votes Received: 869
Avg Vote Received: 5.3613
Comments:
Made: 169
Helpful: 77
Received: 109
Forum Posts: 36
Profile Viewed: 4024 times
Over 4000 people have checked out your profile. Don't know when the checking started but I bet it's been since this controversy has been going. Well, I too took a look and here is what I saw: a person who has entered only four challenges but has voted on 805 images and made 169 comments. This tells me you prefer commenting and providing critical (not in the negative sense of the word but as in critique) input to entering images in the contests here. Do you trash the images with low scores? No, you don't. Your average score is over 5.6 so you rate pictures slightly higher than average. There are other raters who do not make strong comments but give other people's photos very low ratings. I know which I'd rather have look at my photographs. I think you should keep on as you have been with a minor change - think about not calling a photo "good" or "bad" and rather talk about what works well and what doesn't. It's amazing what this tiny difference in how you couch suggestions makes. Personally I think making trashing comments to pay somebody back for the comments they made is pretty childish. My husband received an insulting comment on another site. He went to the photographer's work, picked out a really good piece, and make a positive comment. Then he said "I can see why you find my work of little worth" or something like that. The other photographer got the point and sent him an e-mail of appology. That might not have happened but it did. He realized that his comment on my husband's work had been too harsh and was based on his bad mood and not my husband's work. So if you don't like somebody's comment, try sending them a private comment. Don't trash their work! That's my humble (not) opinion. ;) Ann
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06/24/2004 12:25:12 PM · #60 |
Originally posted by KarenB:
I would suggest people edit their comments so they are not personal attacks. |
I suggest that everyone heed this advice.
Quoting from the rules:
Blatantly slanderous, rude, or profane comments may be removed, and the owners of such comments may be suspended or lose their accounts.
Emphasis mine. "Blatant" is characterized as "failure to conceal the act". "Completely obvious" is another way of reading "blatantly" if it makes it easier to understand. There is already a SC discussion underway because of one user's particularly profane comments.
Message edited by author 2004-06-24 12:32:37. |
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06/24/2004 12:41:15 PM · #61 |
for AWPollard - as one of the oldest members of the site (chronologically, that is) I take great exception to your age-ist comments. I also find the leaving of retaliatory comments by anyone to be childish. I started out my mermbership on this site leaving comments on almost every single image in any given challenge, and then I joined the Critique Club. I now no longer comment nor do I participate in the Critique Club. This kind of carping and payground behaviour is part of my disappointment. I came here to learn and I have had PMs and responses that call the integrity of the site into question...what in hell are you all here for?
Message edited by author 2004-06-24 12:54:26.
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06/24/2004 12:49:00 PM · #62 |
I might be wrong, I often am, but the point of this thread and the reason this one was started as a seperate one was to emphasize the fact that other people are acting just a rudely and meanspirited as they say he acted. GW made his comments in the other thread to no specific person. It was a general comment on the peceived quality of the submissions in one challenge. It is unfortunate about the phrasing he used to express his disappointment. It could be because he is from a remote lonely part of the country and not used to the finer points used in civilized conversation. I don't think the military did that to him, never even implied it. Everyone had an opportunity to respond to his rudeness in that thread.
Now. Let's think about the people that proceded to leave rude comments on his pictures. Did they leave those comments during the voting stage or did they leave them as a vindictive act, for no other reason than being upset about his comments? Should one view these people less harshly because they are acting out? To me, they acted with far more disrespect than someone that, for all I know, was being honest and spending the time to look at and comment on pictures that he sees during the voting stage of a challenge.
He is fullfilling the mission of the site, no matter what you think of his style. Those others are simply being spiteful. |
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06/24/2004 12:50:24 PM · #63 |
| This whole thing reminds me of road rage... |
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06/24/2004 01:03:57 PM · #64 |
| I think it a good idea for people to look at John Setzler's comment on Glacierwolf's Guns and Roses photograph. John, not only shows us a great example of a fine critique but does it without sugar-coating and with the intent for everyone to learn from. It's no wonder that John is such a respected member of DPC and a fine photographer. A man of class whom we should all learn from. |
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06/24/2004 01:09:03 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by EddyG:
Originally posted by KarenB:
I would suggest people edit their comments so they are not personal attacks. |
I suggest that everyone heed this advice.
Quoting from the rules:
Blatantly slanderous, rude, or profane comments may be removed, and the owners of such comments may be suspended or lose their accounts. |
Number 1:
I hate censorship. I believe that as Americans we are privileged to have the right to speak our minds in whatever way we see fit. Do some abuse that privilege? You betcha! But that is part of the deal and you won't have one without the other. Is the DPC site the appropriate venue to let loose your uninhibited rantings, users' feelings be damned? I don't think so!
Number 2:
You CAN be direct AND honest without being cruel, rude, or profane. If you are unable to differentiate then I, for one, wish the DPC site council would take a most expedient stand against such offenders that would include an across the board ban from the site, period. Harsh? Yes but the punishment fits the crime. As a registered user who is considering becoming a member, threads like this one give me reason to pause. What about someone new who hasn't yet discovered how wonderful this site and the people who frequent it can be? Do you think they are going to become members? Would you? In this way, inappropriate behavior brings direct harm to DPC and should be dealt with swiftly.
Number 3:
Have you ever had a friend or family member do something forehead-smacking-stupid (which we all do at one time or another)? Have you ever said to them, "what were you thinking?" I'll bet you have. I'll bet you've even said it to yourself. Did you mean anything cruel by it? Of course not! Did any of you ever stop to think that maybe that's all Kevin meant when he wrote, "what were you thinking?" We don't know if he said it in jest or if he meant to be harmful because of the medium of communication used. We are not able to judge by a tone of voice, for example. So maybe we should give the benefit of the doubt. On the other hand, writing a blatant "your picture is stupid" or "you suck" is perfectly clear. The writers of such posts should at the very least be warned that continued harassment will not be tolerated - ever!
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06/24/2004 01:25:16 PM · #66 |
Originally posted by amsmyth:
for AWPollard - as one of the oldest members of the site (chronologically, that is) I take great exception to your age-ist comments.
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I am no spring chicken. Sorry you read into it to be age-ist. It's just that one persons lack of tact led to my lack of bearing by even given this whole topic the time of day.
Originally posted by amsmyth:
what in hell are you all here for?
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Is this directed at me?
I came here:
1) To Help (there are those who need it here)
2) To Learn (I need to learn a lot more)
3) Participate in challenges, as that looked like an interesting way to be forced to shoot something I might not normally take pictures of.
As for commenting I will not be driven by the emotional flow of the forums wether to comment or not. I comment, and I will continue to comment in the nature that I have. |
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06/24/2004 02:10:17 PM · #67 |
Originally posted by oskar:
Well GW
Tell me something about this photo
You have been a photographer for 36 years, I've been one for 2. Still I'm able to that this photo is an horrible shot. The background is really stupid and I know that even I could do better, then when I write my thought about this shot, (which are not unfair, the shot is terrible), then you go crying like a little baby. If you have been taken so bad photos for 36 years I would have though you should be used to people talking badly of you photos and you should mark them words and try to learn from them. For example in this fish shot, mind you background. The comment I left on this shot is just in you spirit of "helpful" comments. When you say that people only should give those "nice shot" comments to avoid angry people, that is so not true, you just have to be careful how you put things, guide people, don't trash them down. It's just like in real life, you have to communucate with respect for others. |
You are way out of line here. I think you should be suspended for this!
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06/24/2004 02:16:34 PM · #68 |
| Sorry this just doesn't make sense to be...how in the world is he any more 'out of line' than GW when he said that he was going to publicly announce the picture he thought was the most awful, and who it belonged to? How is it any more out of line than GW saying "I hope you're better with a shotgun than with a camera" as a "critique" for one of the entries? I just don't see how it's any different, and if you are going to call Sonifo for his, you should call GW on his errors first, as he was the first to begin this cycle of name calling. Know what I mean? |
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06/24/2004 02:21:09 PM · #69 |
Originally posted by bethany_marie_23:
Sorry this just doesn't make sense to be...how in the world is he any more 'out of line' than GW when he said that he was going to publicly announce the picture he thought was the most awful, and who it belonged to? How is it any more out of line than GW saying "I hope you're better with a shotgun than with a camera" as a "critique" for one of the entries? I just don't see how it's any different, and if you are going to call Sonifo for his, you should call GW on his errors first, as he was the first to begin this cycle of name calling. Know what I mean? |
I really don't see what he did wrong. I wouldn't mind if my photo was placed up here and said this was the worst photo ever. Who cares...I guess if you really want to learn you won't mind.
OH, here is my worst photo and I think the worst photo ever on dpc.
I didn't get one comment here to help me to make this a better shot.
Wait maybe this is it...
I got one good comment to help me out with this shot. hmmm...
Message edited by author 2004-06-24 14:23:32.
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06/24/2004 02:21:16 PM · #70 |
Anyone wants beer ?
I have solution for this:
Let's have DPC GTG at Gillete Wyoming on July 4 TH !
GW supporters on west side of Main Street and opponents on East.
At noon everyone start shooting (with camera of course ).
The loser side buys beer to the winner side !
Message edited by author 2004-06-24 14:24:29. |
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06/24/2004 02:26:53 PM · #71 |
Originally posted by pitsaman:
Anyone wants beer ?
I have solution for this:
Let's have DPC GTG at Gillete Wyoming on July 4 TH !
GW supporters on west side of Main Street and opponents on East.
At noon everyone start shooting (with camera of course ).
The loser side buys beer to the winner side ! |
How about soda. I don't drink beer. eww...
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06/24/2004 02:30:41 PM · #72 |
Originally posted by Sonifo:
Originally posted by pitsaman:
Anyone wants beer ?
I have solution for this:
Let's have DPC GTG at Gillete Wyoming on July 4 TH !
GW supporters on west side of Main Street and opponents on East.
At noon everyone start shooting (with camera of course ).
The loser side buys beer to the winner side ! |
How about soda. I don't drink beer. eww... |
Is it any cute landscapes there besides the Tetons ? |
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06/24/2004 02:31:39 PM · #73 |
| Now this thread is getting more to my liking! You buying Pitsa? |
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06/24/2004 02:32:53 PM · #74 |
For you all you can drink (and eat ) !
Chk this gallery ! |
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06/24/2004 02:39:20 PM · #75 |
I really don't see what he did wrong. I wouldn't mind if my photo was placed up here and said this was the worst photo ever. Who cares...I guess if you really want to learn you won't mind.
You're missing the point...Honestly, I don't care what his opionion of my picture is either, and I wouldn't care if he posted it to the whole world to say it was horrible. But you just said that you thought someone should have been suspended for saying what he thought of GW's picture...but at the same time you didn't seem to be bothered at all by Gw's comments about other's photos. It was just kind of strange....maybe it was tongue-in-cheek and I just didn't get it, I don't know. |
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