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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> technical - win98 memory
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 10/24/2004 10:40:41 AM · #1

i am looking at a knowledge base article that deals with the issue where win98 will not run properly with more than 512M memory installed.

they mention limiting the Vcache to 512M - i am wondering if that disables the extra memory or if that extra amount ( anything over 512M ) will still be used. i don't see the point of adding more if i have ti limit it anyway. i currently have another 512M i can plug in, but don't want to waste my time if it's just going to sit there like a lump.

the knowledge base article

thanks


10/24/2004 11:13:41 AM · #2
Win98? Yikes, uh, lemme think back.

I wanna say that I've had it set up in the past with more than 512 on a 98 machine (I want to say 768 or so). The trouble is that 98 was out when memory was quite expensive. As such, most machines that had more than that were slated to be servers and had NT installed on them.

Since you already have the additional 512, I'd say go ahead and try it out. It shouldn't take much time and it'll answer your question straight away.
 10/24/2004 11:36:53 AM · #3
Upgrade. ;)
 10/24/2004 11:49:06 AM · #4
(well, I didn't want to actually say it ;)

Thats another avenue: go pick up Win XP and drop tons of memory in it :)
 10/24/2004 12:01:43 PM · #5
Originally posted by RobCoursey:
(well, I didn't want to actually say it ;)

Thats another avenue: go pick up Win XP and drop tons of memory in it :)

Heh, don't forget you could buy a buttload of memory for the price of XP... (XP Home is horrible, it behaves more like WinME, so you definitely need XP Pro, which is much better stability- and usability-wise than Home, but XP Pro will run you $200-300)

I use Linux. It's more powerful and stable than Windows, and it's free! You could then buy 2 GIGS of RAM for the price of XP Pro.

Just trying to remind everyone that Windows isn't the only choice you have. :)
 10/24/2004 12:20:56 PM · #6
Originally posted by skylen:
XP Home is horrible, it behaves more like WinME, so you definitely need XP Pro, which is much better stability- and usability-wise than Home

I was under the impression XP Home runs the same kernel as XP Pro..
 10/24/2004 12:22:44 PM · #7
to install linux i have to make a partition in my disk right?
 10/24/2004 12:28:44 PM · #8
Originally posted by skylen:
XP Home is horrible, it behaves more like WinME, so you definitely need XP Pro


I run both XP home and XP Pro and the differences between the two have never been noticeable for my usage.
10/24/2004 12:29:18 PM · #9
Originally posted by Discraft:
to install linux i have to make a partition in my disk right?


Yes. The easiest way is with a program called Partition Magic. You can create partitions on the fly.
 10/24/2004 12:34:14 PM · #10
Originally posted by PaulMdx:

I was under the impression XP Home runs the same kernel as XP Pro..


You may be right. I don't know the inner workings, but in my experience, XP Home has trouble killing locked up/crashed apps and recovering without a reboot. XP Pro seems better in this respect. Also many extremely useful features like remote desktop sharing are missing from Home. But if you don't need it, you may survive without the extra features. :)
 10/24/2004 12:35:01 PM · #11
after i do the partition i install it on the clean partition right? and do i have to format the disk for the partition? and where can i find a free linux coopy? sorry for so many question out of the thread!
 10/24/2004 12:39:01 PM · #12
i know it doesn't work if i don't alter the Vcache setting. by the sounds of the article - it seems it just tells windows there is less memory than there actually is - so it runs properly - in which case there is no point in adding the extra.

i don't like XP, and am only going to upgrade if i can't resolve this issue - we have a number of PC's here, and the others run XP, my win98 machine is the most reliable.......

Message edited by author 2004-10-24 12:39:20.
 10/24/2004 01:09:26 PM · #13
Originally posted by Discraft:
after i do the partition i install it on the clean partition right? and do i have to format the disk for the partition? and where can i find a free linux coopy? sorry for so many question out of the thread!


I use Xandros linux, I've used SuSE and Redhat/Fedora and have found xandros to be the best desktop distro (it's been developed to be aimed at those used to windows). The OCE (Open Community Edition) is available free of charge.
 10/24/2004 02:13:28 PM · #14
Good place to start if you wanna find free Linux distributions.

Linux ISO Images.
 10/24/2004 02:32:12 PM · #15
Originally posted by Discraft:
after i do the partition i install it on the clean partition right? and do i have to format the disk for the partition? and where can i find a free linux coopy? sorry for so many question out of the thread!


I believe part of installing linux is formatting the partition so as to be able to accept linux. It's a different format than for windows.
 10/24/2004 03:28:24 PM · #16
personally I am quite happy with Win 2K
 10/24/2004 03:39:23 PM · #17
Originally posted by soup:
i am looking at a knowledge base article that deals with the issue where win98 will not run properly with more than 512M memory installed.

they mention limiting the Vcache to 512M - i am wondering if that disables the extra memory or if that extra amount ( anything over 512M ) will still be used. i don't see the point of adding more if i have ti limit it anyway. i currently have another 512M i can plug in, but don't want to waste my time if it's just going to sit there like a lump.

the knowledge base article

thanks


Ok limitation on the memori it's limitation on yours mainboard, If the board support 386 you can install 512 but thay run only at 386 it a memory limitation on hardware , and vRam this is you harddrive.
 10/24/2004 03:51:50 PM · #18
soyo p4vsa board ( i think ) P4 1.6ghz - 400mhz FSB - ata 100 HD - 64M video
main board supports up to 3gig SDram.


10/24/2004 04:58:40 PM · #19
Originally posted by soup:
i am looking at a knowledge base article that deals with the issue where win98 will not run properly with more than 512M memory installed.

they mention limiting the Vcache to 512M - i am wondering if that disables the extra memory or if that extra amount ( anything over 512M ) will still be used. i don't see the point of adding more if i have ti limit it anyway. i currently have another 512M i can plug in, but don't want to waste my time if it's just going to sit there like a lump.

the knowledge base article

thanks

Performing the VCache limitation mentioned in the article will limit the amount of memory that can be cached, but it does not limit in any way the amount of memory Win98 will address and use. The amount over 51MB will still be available, and will still be used -- but it will not have the benefit of the cache. This can run into timing problems with some applications, but if the applications are well written to follow the expected use of the OS's capabilities they will run fine.

It should be noted that many applicates written with Win98 in mind (and most games) had code in them that does the OS's job -- either taking control of disk or memory access or ignoring the OS's control on the video. These programs invariably run into problems when the assumptions the programs made about why the OS is doing what it is doing are wrong. Limiting memory increases the likelihood the assumptions will be wrong, and increases the chance of the poorly written applications and games causing problems.

Will the applications and games you use cause problems? Stick the memory in and find out. That is the quickest way to find out.

But, to reiterate, the memory above 512MB will be available and will be used -- it just won't have the benefit of the system cache.

***

I don't quite know why the options of upgrading and linux were brought up when you were asking a very specific question about Win98; changing OS's will make the question obsolete -- but it will not answer it.

David
 10/24/2004 05:05:43 PM · #20
Windows 98 & WinME
 10/24/2004 11:15:27 PM · #21
thank you, i am pondering my options.

Originally posted by Britannica:
Performing the VCache limitation mentioned in the article will limit the amount of memory that can be cached, but it does not limit in any way the amount of memory Win98 will address and use. The amount over 51MB will still be available, and will still be used -- but it will not have the benefit of the cache. This can run into timing problems with some applications, but if the applications are well written to follow the expected use of the OS's capabilities they will run fine.

It should be noted that many applicates written with Win98 in mind (and most games) had code in them that does the OS's job -- either taking control of disk or memory access or ignoring the OS's control on the video. These programs invariably run into problems when the assumptions the programs made about why the OS is doing what it is doing are wrong. Limiting memory increases the likelihood the assumptions will be wrong, and increases the chance of the poorly written applications and games causing problems.

Will the applications and games you use cause problems? Stick the memory in and find out. That is the quickest way to find out.

But, to reiterate, the memory above 512MB will be available and will be used -- it just won't have the benefit of the system cache.

***

I don't quite know why the options of upgrading and linux were brought up when you were asking a very specific question about Win98; changing OS's will make the question obsolete -- but it will not answer it.

David

 10/26/2004 09:23:17 AM · #22

i came across an article at extremetech.com - the issue with the memory and win98 seems to go beyond just limiting memory amounts to 512 meg.

it seems that win98 only really uses 160 meg of RAM, and anything over that is shown to actually slow down system performance. ugh.

i have a new 80gig HD to install, and i am now trying to decide whether to move to :
win2000 ( have it )
winXP ( need to buy it )
or Mandrake ( have it, and its free )


10/26/2004 11:36:13 AM · #23
Originally posted by PaulMdx:
Originally posted by skylen:
XP Home is horrible, it behaves more like WinME, so you definitely need XP Pro, which is much better stability- and usability-wise than Home

I was under the impression XP Home runs the same kernel as XP Pro..


It is the same software and kernel. XP Pro just enables a few more features and has some additional applications bundled.

At least in my experience, XP Home has been more stable than the corporate controlled XP Pro that I use on my work laptop.

I'm running XP Home on 3 machines for a year or so without any crashing or lock-up options at all. Finally a MS OS that doesn't bring the house down when any application dies. Shame it took them so long to write a decent one.
 10/26/2004 11:54:50 AM · #24
no way i am going to pay $199 for XP pro - i am pretty pissed they charge as much as they do for something that is obviously a constant security risk.

there are 2 legit winXP home disks sitting on my desk - but i can't use them ( they are installed on the other machines ) - to run XP pro would cost this home office $600
 10/26/2004 01:40:22 PM · #25
Originally posted by Discraft:
to install linux i have to make a partition in my disk right?


yes and no.

You can test ride with knoppix, which is a full featured debian based distro which runs entirely from CD. You don't even need a hard disk on the machine actually. What it does is create a sort of virtual hard disk on your memory, uncompress what you need on demand and run from there. It takes advantage of every bit of memory you feed it. You can also access your data on your HD if you like to.

It brings plenty of programs included (about 2GB), among which you can find The Gimp 2.0. It's absolutely amazing how smooth it goes running from CD alone (and memory, of course).

The main caveat is it "forgets" your custom configs when you power off, although there are ways to overcome this, or you can jump to a HD based distro later if you feel like it (I'm using Fedora core 2 rigth now).

And, the frosting on the cake, as you could expect, it's free.

Message edited by author 2004-10-26 13:45:33.
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