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10/20/2004 06:45:56 PM · #51 |
Why Librodo.? are we aking this for granted.?Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by heida:
what does this word mean? |
It means Librodo is about to get another ribbon. |
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10/20/2004 07:06:50 PM · #52 |
Originally posted by kiwinick:
Why Librodo.? are we aking this for granted.?Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by heida:
what does this word mean? |
It means Librodo is about to get another ribbon. |
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Why Librodo? Because... he has all those beautiful, doe-eyed children that melt your heart, to photograph. On the other hand -- I have the unkempt, elderly lady, with no teeth who yells at you if you don't give her a handout.
Doe-eyed children beat out no teeth ladies any day. |
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10/20/2004 07:11:14 PM · #53 |
Another interesting fact is that everyday people, like you & I, may actually be in 'poverty' according to our city, state or country. I personally feel like poverty means to go without necessities, but according to the state of California: a married couple living in LA County, making less than $30K a year combined income (or something close to that number) is considered living below the poverty line. So, with that, we may have many entries of every day people doing without some 'comforts' rather than doing without 'necessities', but because of the 'poverty line'. They would accurately fit the challenge, would they not? I am not saying that they won't be judged harshly by the great voters of DPC, but i would have to believe they fit the challenge... any thoughts?
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10/20/2004 07:15:35 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by debitipton:
Why Librodo? Because... he has all those beautiful, doe-eyed children that melt your heart, to photograph. On the other hand -- I have the unkempt, elderly lady, with no teeth who yells at you if you don't give her a handout.
Doe-eyed children beat out no teeth ladies any day. |
I love your logic :) I don't mind another doe-eyed children pictures here, but I'm interested in no-teeth lady's picture as well :)
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10/20/2004 07:32:26 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by kevrobertson:
Poverty;
will a picture of my bank balance count?
kev |
I think if you have a camera, internet access and can afford your membership, then you aren't living in poverty!!!!
But I guess it has different definitions to different people. |
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10/20/2004 07:46:46 PM · #56 |
| IMO the truth of the matter is you can be wealthy at the same be in poverty. |
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10/20/2004 07:47:52 PM · #57 |
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Message edited by author 2004-10-20 19:48:59. |
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10/20/2004 07:49:11 PM · #58 |
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10/20/2004 07:59:37 PM · #59 |
most college students fall in the statistical realm of the impoverished, what with a net worth of about -$10,000 to -$75,000 because of beautiful loans, I should just take a self-portrait here!
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10/20/2004 08:11:18 PM · #60 |
The dishes aren't the problem. Poverty doesn't wear a smile. [/quote]
Lordy, you think poor people don't smile? Believe me, poor people find lots to smile about. They smile at their grandchildren just as you would. They laugh with family just as you would. They enjoy a drink at the local pub. Poverty doesn't only have that beatific "Save the Children" look. People with very little can sometimes have more than we do here in the west. |
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10/20/2004 08:13:45 PM · #61 |
Why not? If you aren't happy with your present situation than you won't be happy else where.
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by chiqui74:
To me, this is poverty but then again, I'm sure some of her neighboors think she's well off because she has dishes to wash. |
The dishes aren't the problem. Poverty doesn't wear a smile. |
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10/20/2004 09:11:25 PM · #62 |
I see poverty daily at my school. I've seen it daily for the past 10 years that I've been in public education. I have learned a thing or two about poverty during that time, and one thing I know is that here in the land of the free and the home of the brave, there are times when poverty is a matter of priorities rather than inadequacies. This may cause a flame fest, and that's fine, I'm prepared. Let me explain...
Of course, there are plenty of kids right here in the US that go to bed hungry. They live in deplorable conditions. They have NOTHING. I'm not even discussing those situations. The priorities vs. inadequacies that I see are the situations where the student comes in to apply for assistance in getting school uniforms, but is wearing new, $150.00 tennis shoes. It's the mother who rushes into school late to drop off the application for free/reduced lunch, and rushes in while carrying her Dooney & Bourke bag, and wearing desinger clothes, but can't stay to talk about her child's behavior issues because she is in a rush to get to the nail salon for her weekly appointment. It's the family who is driving a new Hummer but has a house with crumbling walls and broken windows. It's the mother who leaves her young daughters at home, alone, unattended all weekend, while she gambles on the riverboat casinos, then returns home with no money for food for the week. These are the kinds of priorities that keep the cycle of poverty going for a lot of people, at least based on my personal experiences and vantage point.
Whew... that being said, poverty is everywhere, sometimes smiling, sometimes not. The kids (young ones) have no idea that they are impoverished until society tells them otherwise. Kids that are poor smile, laugh, and play like other kids. Many times they love school because it's warm (or cool depending on the weather), clean, smells halfway decent, has food, running water, and teachers who hug them
and tell them how happy they are to see them every day. Photos of poverty don't have to be all gloom and doom. I think that photos that show the hopeful aspect of poverty, rather than the despair, should be equally well-received. Just because a photo doesn't show a scene from National Geographic, with half-naked, emaciated, dirty kids, doesn't mean it's not poverty. But that's just MHO.
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10/20/2004 09:17:53 PM · #63 |
Does Poverty have to actually mean Lacking money? Cant it mean lacking other things that are important to our daily needs?
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10/20/2004 09:20:06 PM · #64 |
Originally posted by ursulas:
Lordy, you think poor people don't smile? Believe me, poor people find lots to smile about. |
Sure they do, and there are wealthy folks who drive beat-up Volkswagens, but you'd have a tough time depicting wealth with that image. Portayals of hardship and struggle will tend to evoke poverty better than than a happy college student. These kids may well be impoverished, but the bright colors and carefree expressions draw your focus away from that aspect.
Take the same two kids in torn, drab clothing crying over an empty bowl and you've got a photo that's all about poverty (though not necessarily more appealing). |
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10/20/2004 09:25:19 PM · #65 |
| This definately makes for an interesting challenge. Sitting here, thinking about poverty and I'm thinking of this neighborhood not too far from where I live...I just can't picture walking through there with $600+ worth of nice shiney equipment lol...next idea! |
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10/20/2004 09:29:09 PM · #66 |
Originally posted by laurielblack:
Just because a photo doesn't show a scene from National Geographic, with half-naked, emaciated, dirty kids, doesn't mean it's not poverty. |
You're absolutely correct, but to depict this in a photo requires context. I pointed out the smile in the earlier photo because in that context, the woman may actually be well-to-do. There is no sense of struggle or hardship, nor any contrast of others in a better situation. Someone in rural North Korea might be considered middle class with only a few dollars a week, yet couldn't afford drinking water alone in Connecticut. |
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10/20/2004 09:30:18 PM · #67 |
Originally posted by smoon273:
Does Poverty have to actually mean Lacking money? |
No, of course not.
Originally posted by smoon273:
Cant it mean lacking other things that are important to our daily needs? |
Sure it can...
"Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?
My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends.
Worked hard all my lifetime, no help from my friends,
So Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?"
--Janis Joplin
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10/20/2004 09:33:12 PM · #68 |
| thats a great song mick, and thank you lauriel black for that incredible speech. you made alot of fine points and i 100% agree |
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10/20/2004 11:12:55 PM · #69 |
Originally posted by rennie:
Originally posted by debitipton:
Why Librodo? Because... he has all those beautiful, doe-eyed children that melt your heart, to photograph. On the other hand -- I have the unkempt, elderly lady, with no teeth who yells at you if you don't give her a handout.
Doe-eyed children beat out no teeth ladies any day. |
I love your logic :) I don't mind another doe-eyed children pictures here, but I'm interested in no-teeth lady's picture as well :) |
I love Librodo's photos, the people he photographs are so beautiful. Not to mention he just generally does great work. The no-teeth lady has character or maybe multiple characters! But honestly, she can be scary as all get out sometimes. We'll see how brave I am! |
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10/20/2004 11:18:57 PM · #70 |
Originally posted by laurielblack:
I see poverty daily at my school. I've seen it daily for the past 10 years that I've been in public education. I have learned a thing or two about poverty during that time, and one thing I know is that here in the land of the free and the home of the brave, there are times when poverty is a matter of priorities rather than inadequacies. This may cause a flame fest, and that's fine, I'm prepared. Let me explain...
Of course, there are plenty of kids right here in the US that go to bed hungry. They live in deplorable conditions. They have NOTHING. I'm not even discussing those situations. The priorities vs. inadequacies that I see are the situations where the student comes in to apply for assistance in getting school uniforms, but is wearing new, $150.00 tennis shoes. It's the mother who rushes into school late to drop off the application for free/reduced lunch, and rushes in while carrying her Dooney & Bourke bag, and wearing desinger clothes, but can't stay to talk about her child's behavior issues because she is in a rush to get to the nail salon for her weekly appointment. It's the family who is driving a new Hummer but has a house with crumbling walls and broken windows. It's the mother who leaves her young daughters at home, alone, unattended all weekend, while she gambles on the riverboat casinos, then returns home with no money for food for the week. These are the kinds of priorities that keep the cycle of poverty going for a lot of people, at least based on my personal experiences and vantage point.
Whew... that being said, poverty is everywhere, sometimes smiling, sometimes not. The kids (young ones) have no idea that they are impoverished until society tells them otherwise. Kids that are poor smile, laugh, and play like other kids. Many times they love school because it's warm (or cool depending on the weather), clean, smells halfway decent, has food, running water, and teachers who hug them
and tell them how happy they are to see them every day. Photos of poverty don't have to be all gloom and doom. I think that photos that show the hopeful aspect of poverty, rather than the despair, should be equally well-received. Just because a photo doesn't show a scene from National Geographic, with half-naked, emaciated, dirty kids, doesn't mean it's not poverty. But that's just MHO.
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Take a well deserved bow. That couldn't have been said better. :) |
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10/20/2004 11:27:28 PM · #71 |
I think that where ever we are its around you. Down here in Godzone its the sma the parents gamble on the pokies and we have 8yr olds wandering the streets at night and the parents dont want to know.
I see poverty daily at my school. I've seen it daily for the past 10 years that I've been in public education. I have learned a thing or two about poverty during that time, and one thing I know is that here in the land of the free and the home of the brave, there are times when poverty is a matter of priorities rather than inadequacies. This may cause a flame fest, and that's fine, I'm prepared. Let me explain...
Of course, there are plenty of kids right here in the US that go to bed hungry. They live in deplorable conditions. They have NOTHING. I'm not even discussing those situations. The priorities vs. inadequacies that I see are the situations where the student comes in to apply for assistance in getting school uniforms, but is wearing new, $150.00 tennis shoes. It's the mother who rushes into school late to drop off the application for free/reduced lunch, and rushes in while carrying her Dooney & Bourke bag, and wearing desinger clothes, but can't stay to talk about her child's behavior issues because she is in a rush to get to the nail salon for her weekly appointment. It's the family who is driving a new Hummer but has a house with crumbling walls and broken windows. It's the mother who leaves her young daughters at home, alone, unattended all weekend, while she gambles on the riverboat casinos, then returns home with no money for food for the week. These are the kinds of priorities that keep the cycle of poverty going for a lot of people, at least based on my personal experiences and vantage point.
Whew... that being said, poverty is everywhere, sometimes smiling, sometimes not. The kids (young ones) have no idea that they are impoverished until society tells them otherwise. Kids that are poor smile, laugh, and play like other kids. Many times they love school because it's warm (or cool depending on the weather), clean, smells halfway decent, has food, running water, and teachers who hug them
and tell them how happy they are to see them every day. Photos of poverty don't have to be all gloom and doom. I think that photos that show the hopeful aspect of poverty, rather than the despair, should be equally well-received. Just because a photo doesn't show a scene from National Geographic, with half-naked, emaciated, dirty kids, doesn't mean it's not poverty. But that's just MHO.
[/quote] |
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10/20/2004 11:33:22 PM · #72 |
| Well I have posted to "Poverty". maybe it isnt a "In your Face " image but I have turned it around for another vview of the subject,. Hope that viewers see the point more than they have on "Schooldays" |
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10/21/2004 01:57:32 AM · #73 |
For anyone caring to read a true story of personal poverty, pull up a seat and see how poverty can be right in front of you, yet invisible.
In November of 1989, I was faced with what could only be described as the beginning of an unbelievable set of circumstances.
Due to some dangerous psychological issues with my kids' Mom, I had to take them away from her for their own safety, as ordered by Child Protective Services, pack up and escape with them. We were able to move in with some "friends" and stay there. At the time, I was a mobile mechanic and sub-contractor for a fleet of commercial vehicles and was earning a good living. A minor table saw accident left me with a small portion of one of my fingers missing while staying there, and was told to take some time off work to take care of that and the issues with my family life. When I returned "home", I found my so-friends were into dealing drugs and once again fled with my kids. I had to leave behind my work truck by choice - kids or tools. I chose the kids obviously. By the time I was able to get back and get the truck, everything was gone, and the insurance had lapsed.
That that left me with two very young children to care for, no access to money, a borrowed car, no means to make a living, little personal effects other than our clothing and homeless. Yes, homeless (no immediate family in this State).
Where does one turn in this condition? One goes to the Welfare department and gets help, which is exactly what I did in January of 1990. We managed to get an apartment and had nothing to furnish it other than what we had in the car. We slept on the floor. I bought thrift store everything. I went to fast-food joints for the little extras in life like salt, sugar, napkins, etc, but always asking first. Stealing is not something I will resort to.
Hope this is forming a picture here, as THIS is poverty. We did have a roof over our heads, and I often worried about how to provide for my two kids, ages 4 & 5 at that time. I did find odd jobs working on people's cars here & there and helped with extras like a beds, furniture, etc.
So what is the point of all this? Certainly not to make anyone feel sympathetic but rather look around and realize there is poverty everywhere, but it may not be visible. When we stepped out of our apartment and my daughter started school, we looked just like anyone else. Clean, decent clothes, good personal hygiene and a facade to never be suspected of not having a have a pot to piss in.
Eight months later, I was able to get off welfare and return to work, slowly building up needed tools to do my work and provide for my family. My kids lived with me since that time really, and their Mom got better and we now can talk as friends. We all survived, and learned some valuable lessons about where we were at one time and the fine art of appreciating what we have, rather than looking at what we didn't have.
Yes, we were an example of true poverty, but to the busy world outside, we were just like anyone else. How can we determine what is and what isn't poverty? I doubt many can say they have ever been down that low to see what it's like.
Poverty doesn't have to mean the classic fly-ridden, Ethiopian starving child portrayed on the "Feed the Children" infommercials. It can be anywhere, in different levels, in different perspectives. Even when I was at my lowest, it was a far cry better than some have it in this world, and trust me, with 10 years in the Navy and being all over the world, I can say I have seen poverty !
So how are you going to vote, or better yet, cast judgement on what is and what isn't poverty?
Are you qualified to make that call?
Just think before clicking.
Message edited by author 2004-10-21 04:05:57. |
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10/21/2004 02:31:30 AM · #74 |
What an amazing story, Brad. I can only admire you for going through that and climbing up again and getting everything organised. What a story.
As for the voting, it is still the art of the photographer to get the message across, which will be hard without any visible signs. But I certainly will look harder if I don't get that message at first. |
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10/21/2004 03:45:43 AM · #75 |
Originally posted by kosmikkreeper:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by heida:
what does this word mean? |
It means Librodo is about to get another ribbon. |
AHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! ;-) How right you are!! |
This is STRESSFUL. A eustress (positive stress) though.
Of course I probably have better access to poverty-stricken people and places but I don't have the time to do it. I will leave for China on Saturday and I am not planning to be connected on-line during my entire 10 days there.
But I am surprised and flattered (at the same time) that people expect me to ribbon. I have seen so many so many good pictures that denote poverty here in DPChallenge, far better than my posts.
Anyway, i might be able to photograph something before I leave...who knows. That menas that I have to do it today.
Good luck guys.
manny |
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