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07/19/2004 07:09:57 PM · #51 |
You need to understand that when it comes to culture, I belive there are no "americans". Maybe ony those amerindians. Columbus only discovered the continent not that long ago end every since it became a mixture of all the cultures in the world. A salad of people and cultures from all the countries in the world. They are only americans by citizenship, culturaly and ethnicaly they are, italian-americans, dutch-anmericans, romanian-americans, turk-americans, afro-americans... etc. This makes it verry hard to define an "american culture", I belive this also goes for sense of humour, irony and such. IMHO
Message edited by author 2004-07-19 19:11:41.
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07/19/2004 07:18:48 PM · #52 |
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
You need to understand that when it comes to culture, I belive there are no "americans". Maybe ony those amerindians. Columbus only discovered the continent not that long ago end every since it became a mixture of all the cultures in the world. A salad of people and cultures from all the countries in the world. They are only americans by citizenship, culturaly and ethnicaly they are, italian-americans, dutch-anmericans, romanian-americans, turk-americans, afro-americans... etc. This makes it verry hard to define an "american culture", I belive this also goes for sense of humour, irony and such. IMHO |
Leading vaguely away from the topic, that's always struck me as strange/ different in the US- a large number of people I meet here introduce themselves by explaining their ethnic background - I'd assume they'd want to be considered americans but it always comes across as claiming to be Scottish or Irish or from some other country than America. I suppose it must be from being such a young country, but at some point hopefully people will start identifying themselves by where they are from, not where their grandparents came from. Maybe it is just because I"m used to a more homogonised ethnic background of the people I meet, or the fact that I can trace my ethnicity back about 400 years all in the same nationality. But it seems to be a peculiarly American trait.
Message edited by author 2004-07-19 19:19:09.
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07/19/2004 07:48:09 PM · #53 |
This is strange you know. Because if you think of americans in terms of USA and Canada, that is so, but if you go south those countries clearly identify themselves. And they are not older. For example Mexico, Brazil, and mostly all latin south american countries clearly have cultural identities. One of the reasons I'm thinking could be that the exodus of people to USA and Canada never stopped, people keep going there from all over the world even today.
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07/19/2004 08:15:41 PM · #54 |
| I remember this picture from the judging - I am an american and I didn't miss the ironic idea. For me it didn't look so much like a bird in a cage but more like a bird on the other side of a chain-link fence. I rated it a "5" because I didn't think that the shot had enough power to carry the idea\irony. Perhaps a wider angle would have helped give more of the impression of a cage. Or an angle that would have shown that the top was caged too. |
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07/19/2004 08:54:50 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by Kavey:
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I still hold to the point that there IS a difference in humour between people of different countries and that irony seems to be used more often in Britain (and some other places) than in the USA.
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I wholeheartedly agree that humor in different countries is different. I know in a couple of countries I have been in, we were asked by our guides to please refrain from snide or sarcastic remarks towards each other (you know, the "your mother" things), because that was basically "taboo" there.
And, one only has to catch an episode or two of a British comedy to see the difference between them and American sit-coms. (I tend to laugh more at the former).
And, like Kavey said, that is neither good nor bad, just the way it is. Dang, wouldn't it be boring if we were all the same.
After thinking about it a while, perhaps there was some misunderstanding. Not in the actuall irony, I think that was fairly evident, but in the role it plays. As has been said, in Europe, irony is more humorous or poignant (right word?), whereas irony in America is used more sarcastically; perhaps with less humor, and for more drama. (which would suit this shot well).
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07/19/2004 09:24:05 PM · #56 |
Do any of you think that the understanding of irony in a subject has anything to do with intelligence or education? I find that some of the wittiest people use irony quite often, especially when trying to make a point or to be dramatic, sometimes just to be a smarty pants. I think it mostly depends on the experiance a person has.
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07/19/2004 09:31:58 PM · #57 |
Originally posted by timganier:
Do any of you think that the understanding of irony in a subject has anything to do with intelligence or education? I find that some of the wittiest people use irony quite often, especially when trying to make a point or to be dramatic, sometimes just to be a smarty pants. I think it mostly depends on the experiance a person has. |
I think one of the major usages of irony is that fact that someone won't get it - or at least the people using it like to believe that, so that people who do get it feel 'in the know'
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07/19/2004 09:41:54 PM · #58 |
Bringing this thread back to the discussion of cultural differences.. I found that out with this entry for the 'Opposites' challenge.
A lot of people had no idea what the opposite was, but if you live in the UK or Australia.. the phrase is quite common.
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07/19/2004 09:45:41 PM · #59 |
Originally posted by dhare:
Bringing this thread back to the discussion of cultural differences.. I found that out with this entry for the 'Opposites' challenge.
A lot of people had no idea what the opposite was, but if you live in the UK or Australia.. the phrase is quite common. |
Certainly a phrase I was immediately familiar with - I come across these sorts of idiomatic cultural gaps on a weekly, if not daily basis.
Stranger in a strange land...
Message edited by author 2004-07-19 21:46:02.
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07/19/2004 09:53:36 PM · #60 |
Originally posted by dhare:
Bringing this thread back to the discussion of cultural differences.. I found that out with this entry for the 'Opposites' challenge.
A lot of people had no idea what the opposite was, but if you live in the UK or Australia.. the phrase is quite common. |
This is somewhat similar with the offensive purple picture discussed last week, where a guy that had no ideea about some painful "blackface" related history in USA, just painted his model's face with black. Most people who don't live in US had no ideea that such thing can be considered offensive.
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07/19/2004 11:25:50 PM · #61 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
I think one of the major usages of irony is that fact that someone won't get it - or at least the people using it like to believe that, so that people who do get it feel 'in the know' |
[10/08/2003 05:05:31 PM]
irony [Gr] eironeia > dissembling, an antonym for alazon, a bully or braggart.
Whether deliberate or incidental, the author or speaker demands that the audience perceive a concealed meaning that lies beneath his surface statement.
This points toward an essential ingredient of subtlety for an ironic intent to succeed. The subtlety, as well, requires a capability on part of the audience to perceive the finesse.
On the classic Greek stage, this (also) was not always a given. When it was not, I speculate, the audience was ridiculed, which, in turn, points at a latent use of irony, namely the only means to defend a finer sense against a barbaric one.
Message edited by author 2004-07-20 00:36:17.
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