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06/17/2004 09:01:39 AM · #26 |
The best way to prevent this, or any kind of settings error is to check your tools before you shoot. Before I leave the house I check to verify that the date and time are set correctly. I started doing this when we had the last flurry of date related DQs. It takes me less than 20 seconds.
I verify my ISO, White balance and shooting mode. Maybe 45. All and all it's a little more than a minute to make sure that if I find something challenge worthy I don't have a date violation.
It was still an awesome shot, and don't forget that. :)
Clara
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06/17/2004 09:10:24 AM · #27 |
Just as result of reading these forums, I am always checking the date on my camera. Glad that DPChallenge has trained me into this habit.
Last week, just before going out to shoot my "Choices" pics I checked the date and lo and behold...wrong date. !
One of the kids had been using the camera and changed the settings.
Just check is all......Checking the settings is now part of my photo setup. Just as much setting aperture, iso and shutter speed.
Having said that, there'll be a time when I don't check and end up crying in my portfolio! |
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06/17/2004 09:37:51 AM · #28 |
i agree ecce, I looked that up too, it prolly wouldn't clear everything up but would at least remind people. |
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06/17/2004 09:58:01 AM · #29 |
I use the Nikon software and there is a setting in there that will sync my camera to the date/time of my computer everytime I download pictures. This is a very nice feature that is optional.
As long as your computer has the right date/time there shouldn't be any problems. |
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06/17/2004 10:33:32 AM · #30 |
It was a great pic, desreving of the ribbon. How about posting it in your portfolio so we can see it again?
Originally posted by md8speed: As far as I am concerned, I pretty much got screwed. ..........so people know what was going on. |
As for your reaction to the DQ, it appears that you are the one who needs to know what's going on. The discussion about date DQs has been prominent in these forums for several months including, if memory serves, another D70 owner losing a ribbon on the same basis as you. I don't understand how anyone can complain about the SC when they got an (expensive) new camera and didn't even bother to set the date in it. If you are feeling screwed... look in the mirror. No one who has been paying even the slightest bit of attention to these forums will have any sympathy. SC did their job, and did it in a manner consistent with precedent. |
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06/17/2004 10:36:34 AM · #31 |
Originally posted by candycorn: I use the Nikon software and there is a setting in there that will sync my camera to the date/time of my computer everytime I download pictures. This is a very nice feature that is optional.
As long as your computer has the right date/time there shouldn't be any problems. |
Maybe Nikon should make that feature enabled as the default. |
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06/17/2004 11:06:08 AM · #32 |
Originally posted by blemt: The best way to prevent this, or any kind of settings error is to check your tools before you shoot. Before I leave the house I check to verify that the date and time are set correctly. I started doing this when we had the last flurry of date related DQs. It takes me less than 20 seconds.
I verify my ISO, White balance and shooting mode. Maybe 45. All and all it's a little more than a minute to make sure that if I find something challenge worthy I don't have a date violation.
It was still an awesome shot, and don't forget that. :)
Clara |
I try to do the same thing (not so much caring about the date, more about custom functions on the camera) I'm fed up by the number of times I go to take a shot handheld, focus, compose, click the shutter and 'black' because I forgot to disable mirror lockup.
Now I try to go through the whole set of camera settings to make sure the camera is a 'known good state' prior to starting - ISO, white balance, meter mode, compensation, AF mode, custom functions. I should really do this prior to _stopping_ come to think of it...
Message edited by author 2004-06-17 11:06:22.
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06/17/2004 12:28:04 PM · #33 |
I am fully aware that the SC has been acting consistantly to the date issues. I do not blame them for that or for disqualifying my picture it was my own fault that the EXIF year was not correct. In my earlier post I was merely trying to show others that my picture did fit the challenge criteria even if it was rightfully disqualified on a technical note. I do not blame the SC for disqualifying my photo but was rather raising my frustration with the whole situation.
Originally posted by coolhar: As for your reaction to the DQ, it appears that you are the one who needs to know what's going on. .... I don't understand how anyone can complain about the SC when they got an (expensive) new camera and didn't even bother to set the date in it. If you are feeling screwed... look in the mirror. No one who has been paying even the slightest bit of attention to these forums will have any sympathy. SC did their job, and did it in a manner consistent with precedent. |
...Hmm, thanks for jumping on my back...
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06/17/2004 12:52:23 PM · #34 |
What a shame. But the rules are the rules. If the rules allowed for a review or appeal committee Then I am sure you would have prevailed. Do we have one? If not maybe we could suggest to the council members that an appeal process should be considered. (given these circumstances) Now that that pic was DQD how weird does the first and second place pics look standing next to each other.
Oh and Imangineer, give it up already, geez. |
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06/17/2004 12:56:40 PM · #35 |
I like that idea, I would vote for something of the effect of that if you photo was disqualified but then was later shown to be valid, it would be placed at the very end of the challenge under a category of "disqualified but verified- theses photos were disqualified as per the DPChallenge stated rules but have been verified via other methods". The scores could be displayed or not, I don't think it would make a difference. |
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06/17/2004 01:31:50 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by Ecce Signum:
I suggest it should be changed to...
Yes, this photograph was taken with a digital camera on or between *Insert challenge date* AND I HAVE CHECKED THE EXIF DATE ON THE ORIGINAL THAT I STILL HAVE
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It also has a box that says something like: Yes, I have read the rules.
In those rules it says:
"To avoid the possibility of disqualification, be sure to check that the date and time on your camera are set correctly before taking any pictures you may use as challenge entries. We will no longer accept this an excuse. You have been forewarned."
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06/17/2004 01:38:13 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by slingshot: ...maybe we could suggest to the council members that an appeal process should be considered. |
How are you going to proof that the proof is trustworthy?
Let's say you've got something on paper that proofs that you were there at the date you say you were.
Will you sent in a scan of the paper? A scan can be edited...
Will you sent it in by snailmail? That might take a while, especially with SC-members that can drill a hole trough the earth and wave at eachother.
Lets keep things simple for the SC and ourselves. Wrong date, your problem.
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06/17/2004 01:46:25 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Maybe Nikon should make that feature enabled as the default. |
It only would work if you download directly from the camera. Which is slower than heck. :)
Clara
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06/17/2004 02:51:26 PM · #39 |
Hello all! I am new to this photography group but why give so much emphasis on the exposure dates? Everyone in here has integrity of course but it is so easy to hack into that EXIF header and change the exposure dates. Why not just do away with the dates and just focus on the photo quality?
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06/17/2004 02:56:23 PM · #40 |
Because the date restriction is what makes DPC different from all the other photo contest sites that are all over the internet.
And just so you know, we've disqualified and suspended people for editing EXIF data. It may be "so easy" for you to "hack into that EXIF", but it has been "so easy" for us to tell that the EXIF has been "hacked" too. So I guess if you have no integrity and feel you have to cheat and modify the EXIF data to compete in a contest that has no real prizes, then you take your chances of being "caught"...
Message edited by author 2004-06-17 14:58:18. |
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06/17/2004 03:25:31 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by md8speed: I do not blame the SC for disqualifying my photo but was rather raising my frustration with the whole situation.
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Mike - too bad about your DQ, but I wouldn't sweat it - looking at the quality in your portfolio, you'll get a ribbon again real soon. You are a talented photographer.
Dave
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06/17/2004 03:36:22 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by gabrielrjr: Hello all! I am new to this photography group but why give so much emphasis on the exposure dates? Everyone in here has integrity of course but it is so easy to hack into that EXIF header and change the exposure dates. Why not just do away with the dates and just focus on the photo quality? |
refer to this thread > EXIF validity |
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06/17/2004 03:43:56 PM · #43 |
Why not automate this check of EXIF headers upon challenge submission?
Since the EXIF data needs to be present in the submitted photo, it should be possible to have the server automatically check the date upon submission, and reject it if outside the challenge dates?
That should be a relatively simple function to add, using jhead or any similar tool. That level of automation would prevent an image with incorrect headers to even enter the challenge, and thus saving ourselves from this type of discussions in the future.
Or are there problems with this approach that I am not aware of?
/M
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06/17/2004 03:51:45 PM · #44 |
Because when using something like Photoshop's "Save for Web" feature, any EXIF data (if any was present before editing started) is stripped off to maximize the filespace devoted to image data.
As nice as it might be to have, adding the requirement that "original EXIF data must be preserved on your entry" would really complicate the submission requirement.
The requirement to submit your original when you submit your entry has also been brought up many times. That puts undue burden on the people on dial-up, not to mention the server resources required to store the large (and, more and more frequently, RAW) files.
Our current process of requesting the original on the top-placing images and any that are "questioned" by voters seems to be a nice "middle ground", even though it has its own drawbacks.
Message edited by author 2004-06-17 15:52:48. |
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06/17/2004 03:52:31 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by mijak: Why not automate this check of EXIF headers upon challenge submission?
/M |
Unless you submit the orig/unaltered image the exif data will not be there.
edited cos is was said (and much more eloquently) above ;)
Message edited by author 2004-06-17 15:54:00.
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06/17/2004 03:57:59 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by Ecce Signum: I think it has been suggested before (maybe even by me as well). when you submit a picture you are asked
Yes, this photograph was taken with a digital camera on or between Jun 1 2004 and Jun 30 2004.
I suggest it should be changed to...
Yes, this photograph was taken with a digital camera on or between *Insert challenge date* AND I HAVE CHECKED THE EXIF DATE ON THE ORIGINAL THAT I STILL HAVE
Maybe then we won't have this problem? imho this mistook is almost as bad as submitting (say) a poor shot. I know is gutwrenching when this happens but at least you know your talent was acknowledged.
A problem I suffer is boosting the ISO settings up and forgetting I've done this next time I start to shoot. Now when I turn the cam on the first button I hit is 'info' I check all my settings (including the date) before I hit the shutter. |
Good suggestion (rewording of checklist before submitting). I hope the SC would look at this and implement this as this serves another clear checkpoint and reminder.
Regarding ISO settings, it happened to me last night. I usually take my daylight pictures in high ISO. Last night, I decided to take my June free challenge pics - city lights and such - Chicago is beautiful during the night. Lots of great opportunities. Was shooting till 10:30 PM (there were two others shooting the same scenes I was shooting - made me wonder if they were DPC shooters too). If you were, you know who you are. Came home and downloaded about 300 pics. All of course were grainy. Totally forgot to reset the ISO. Will go back again next week I guess. |
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06/17/2004 07:21:42 PM · #47 |
No sweat about he DQ, it was bummer but it was my own fault for not double checking. Anyway, it might simplify a lot of the challenges if there was a EXIF checker like at //www.digitalphotocontest.com that checks the validity of the EXIF data before the picture can be submitted.
Also, One note of interest to d70 owners, if you have autorotate selected, then many EXIF readers cannot decode the EXIF information for pictures that have been rotated, something to keep in mind when submitting for challenges. I don't know which programs this site uses, but it isn't worth the risk of having it DQ'd. |
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06/17/2004 07:37:12 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by slingshot: What a shame. But the rules are the rules. If the rules allowed for a review or appeal committee Then I am sure you would have prevailed. Do we have one? If not maybe we could suggest to the council members that an appeal process should be considered. |
We discussed this extensively, and based on our experience of allowing a couple of photos to be "proved on appeal" we discarded the idea as cumbersome and useless, as the "proof" could be forged as easily as the original.
We've worded the rules on dates very clearly. In order to submit your photo, you check off a box that states you've read and agree to abide by those rules. If you are in the habit of checking-off boxes on contractual documents you haven't read or don't understand, I'd like to refer you to this fabulous website I just found: more_money_for_me.com |
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06/17/2004 07:40:32 PM · #49 |
This is really wrong DPCHALENGE SUCKS.
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06/17/2004 07:43:57 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by abreul: This is really wrong DPCHALENGE SUCKS. |
Because we run a contest where people have to follow the rules? |
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