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05/24/2004 02:12:45 PM · #26 |
| If we have to use "that" chair, then you have to use "that" frog, and "that" egg. |
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05/24/2004 02:21:22 PM · #27 |
just pretend I'm not here :)
Message edited by author 2004-05-24 14:21:39. |
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05/24/2004 02:37:07 PM · #28 |
I'm trying to see what you see frum..... I had similiar thoughts about the topic myself but didn't like any of my shots enough to enter them, however one I shot for Centered went into Habits. To me what you are calling the elements that make it stand out are dictated by the topic, not anything that makes it a masterpiece. I've seen the unnatural treatment many times, whenever I use a cheap teleconverter that vignettes excessively on the last half of my zoom range. The only "history" that chair says to me is that no one wants it anymore. With no disrespect to your taste or the photogs talent, that photo just doesn't do anything for me. I rated it lower than any of the others posted in this thread so far.
I do argee that sometimes the ones voters here seem to go for in droves are not always that good, but I still can't see scrap as masterpiece.
But these are only our opinions, yours and mine, both are valid even if neither of us agree with the final authority-- the voters. They say it is 26 out of 240, 90th percentile, much lower than you would put it and much higher than I would. |
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05/24/2004 02:45:41 PM · #29 |
by dsidwell
This is the pic that I feel was underated. The contrast and definition are outstanding. For the life of me I can't explain how it finished 90th.
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05/24/2004 02:50:10 PM · #30 |
exactly I respect your opinion, too bad my opinions are ment to attack and demolish. This is the part that I really don't understand. Why any time someone says he doesn't like a certain shot on this site there is immediately the feeling that he's attacking even if I tried to argument my opinion and make it as constructive as possible. I mean I prefere people that tell stuff they don't like about my shots than those that say they like them. I try to listen constructive negative comment and re analise my shots acording to the comment. At the end if I still don't agree I respect the man's opinion and taste, but certainly I wouldn't feel attacked if someone said it nicely polite and civilised.
Again english is not my language so if I said anything that hurt anyone's feelings, I apologise, even if words are the same in translation sometimes they weight more in a language than in the other. Again if this is the case I apologise, that whas not my intention. It's the 2'nd time I try to debate some things with people here and they take my words as offensive without that even being my intention, so I better shoot more and talk less here. Lesson learned. End of story from me. |
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05/24/2004 03:01:27 PM · #31 |
I thought this one would do better. I love how the focus and editing make it look like a toy tree, crisp and clear against the soft focus background. One of my top choices.
drg |
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05/24/2004 03:06:53 PM · #32 |
No need to apologize Cristi ... this has been the most entertaining thread all day :) Of course, in the future, maybe comparing ribbon winning photo's to work that could be done by small children isn't the way to go ... but I did enjoy it :)
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
exactly I respect your opinion, too bad my opinions are ment to attack and demolish. This is the part that I really don't understand. Why any time someone says he doesn't like a certain shot on this site there is immediately the feeling that he's attacking even if I tried to argument my opinion and make it as constructive as possible. I mean I prefere people that tell stuff they don't like about my shots than those that say they like them. I try to listen constructive negative comment and re analise my shots acording to the comment. At the end if I still don't agree I respect the man's opinion and taste, but certainly I wouldn't feel attacked if someone said it nicely polite and civilised.
Again english is not my language so if I said anything that hurt anyone's feelings, I apologise, even if words are the same in translation sometimes they weight more in a language than in the other. Again if this is the case I apologise, that whas not my intention. It's the 2'nd time I try to debate some things with people here and they take my words as offensive without that even being my intention, so I better shoot more and talk less here. Lesson learned. End of story from me. |
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05/24/2004 03:21:51 PM · #33 |
| Its easy to put a frog in an egg. Frogs are cold blooded, just cool the frog in the frig. for a little while and stick it in the egg to warm it back up. Van |
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05/24/2004 03:52:48 PM · #34 |
This is a classic nature shot: rich saturated colors, near perfect focus, and seems to fit into the southwestern style very nicely. It reminds me of stuff from folks like Tom Till and David Muench. I gave it a 10, and I hope that someday I'll be able to take a shot like this one. It is a classic shot, but it retains its uniqueness well.
This is another classic photo. I love how it celebrates its own decrepit subject. By boldly centering this sofa, the photo seems to posit it as an all important artifact from which we can understand much. Yet the photo contains irony, too, in that this all important artifact is only a beat up couch. To me, the artist is playing with my intellect and emotions, and I love it. In our postmodern world, all artifacts are taken to be valid, and this photo seems to use this paradigm and laugh at it at the same time. Add to this complexity the perfect tones and marvelous exposure, and it is a great work of art. I gave it a 10, too.
The third photo didn't affect me as much, even though I love abstracts. I wish I had more information by way of helpful critique for the artist.
That said, there are always photos in every challenge that, to me, should have done better. When I win a ribbon, I feel this most especially when I see a photo behind mine that is better. But I'm not the only judge here, and we all vote!
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05/24/2004 05:27:02 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by Konador:
Whats the difference in pointing a camera at a frog and pointing a camera at a chair? I would say the chair was easier to do. |
I would have to say that it is far more difficult to make the chair look interesting.
By subject alone, many would agree that a frog in an egg is subjectively more intriguing than a battered piece of furniture. However, in this image it has a voyeuristic quality that renders the viewer at odds with the subject - ie, it shouldn't be engaging really (it's just a chair) yet many in this thread have 'favourited' the pic having found something intriguing in the composition, textures, lighting, technique, etc.
I do believe that one can find any number of deeper meanings in most art (incl. photography) that the artist never intended - it's what naturally occurs when people are asked to criticise something - but for me an image is art if I'd hang it. I [i]would hang the chair, but not the still lifes because for me there's more to engage me beyond the presentation of a blatantly appealing subject - however efficient it may be. |
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05/24/2004 05:29:25 PM · #36 |
I think this one is underated but that's just me.
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05/24/2004 06:42:36 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
I'm preety sure if I put my macro on and set a 2.0 aperture and give the cam to my 3 year old niece and tell her to point to a dandy, frog, fish, insect or whatever, one of the shots would probably ribbon. While ofcourse you need a certain amount of inteligence, eye, vision and everything to take a shot like that armchair |
Firstly, I'd like to say that was highly insulting. Secondly, you are stating that a picture of a frog in an eggshell under studio lighting can be shot by a three-year-old but an image of a broken chair in the street requires much more intelligence? One is a moving and living creature with a mind of its own and the other is an inanimate object. Both require the skill necessary to operate and understand the camera functions as well as the necessary photographic know how of composition or just pure luck. Both express different things and work for their specific intention.
For you to call one 'art' and the other 'garbage' is certainly your right to an opinion, and it's perfectly fine to prefer one over the other, but belittling photographers and their talent and likening them to a three year old is quite insulting. There are people behind the screen names and the photographs and hurtful words can still hurt so think hard before you start getting personal about people and their talent or lack thereof.
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05/24/2004 06:51:20 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by moodville:
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
I'm preety sure if I put my macro on and set a 2.0 aperture and give the cam to my 3 year old niece and tell her to point to a dandy, frog, fish, insect or whatever, one of the shots would probably ribbon. While ofcourse you need a certain amount of inteligence, eye, vision and everything to take a shot like that armchair |
Firstly, I'd like to say that was highly insulting. Secondly, you are stating that a picture of a frog in an eggshell under studio lighting can be shot by a three-year-old but an image of a broken chair in the street requires much more intelligence? One is a moving and living creature with a mind of its own and the other is an inanimate object. Both require the skill necessary to operate and understand the camera functions as well as the necessary photographic know how of composition or just pure luck. Both express different things and work for their specific intention.
For you to call one 'art' and the other 'garbage' is certainly your right to an opinion, and it's perfectly fine to prefer one over the other, but belittling photographers and their talent and likening them to a three year old is quite insulting. There are people behind the screen names and the photographs and hurtful words can still hurt so think hard before you start getting personal about people and their talent or lack thereof. |
damn straight!! dont' mess with the dandy queen people!!!
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05/24/2004 06:58:37 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by Britannica:
Why? Just out of curiousity, what is it you like about it? In the comments and here it is just 'It is art!' and a lot of talk about noise and the halo, but not much of anything about the subject. What is it you are bring with you to the viewing?
I see a lot of talk degrading other photos in an attempt to make this one appear better, but there is very little being said about this photo itself -- perhaps that is all there is to say about it.
David |
I'd wager that (for example again) anything you could say about the top three shots in this challenge you could also say about the chair shot - because it's all a matter of opinion.
Of the winning shots one could say "cute subject, lots to look at, textured, well composed, well lit, unusual view... etc.".
Of the chair one could also say this, but also: "it's mundanity is no longer ordinary, it's textures are a shock of variety and its ruin tells of man's abandon and disposal of material things - and I wonder how many more like it there must be in the world... etc.". You may even start to consider where all your old furniture may end up - yet another landfill site or at the end of a camera lens perhaps? |
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05/24/2004 07:35:08 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by StevePax:
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
I did say it before and I say it again, all this is IMHO, i called them childish because basicaly any child with a medium or advanced camera can easily take them, and I no way consider them any good, because at any of them I look I could not imagine anyone talking about them for more than 30 seconds personaly the only coment I have in mind is "haha cute" and similarities.
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I would like to see you duplicate any of the ribbon winners in the Centered Composition challenge. I would say you have a "medium or advanced" camera, so I say it's time to put up or shut up. And, you wouldn't even have to come up with the idea, which is most of the work. |
Since I live on the edge of downtown Chicago, frogs are rather difficult to come by.
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05/24/2004 07:37:29 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by achiral:
damn straight!! dont' mess with the dandy queen people!!! |
I wasnt even talking about myself, and Konador has shot more dandelions than me or were you talking about him? :P
To get a ribbon one day and then get attacked in the forum the next by having your photographic achievement likened to that of a three year old is certainly demoralizing and takes away from them winning the ribbon.
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05/24/2004 07:47:13 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by moodville:
To get a ribbon one day and then get attacked in the forum the next by having your photographic achievement likened to that of a three year old is certainly demoralizing and takes away from them winning the ribbon. |
I couldn't have said this any better. Everyone's entitled to their opinions but do we have to put someone down to elevate someone else? I would hope not. |
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05/24/2004 08:00:18 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by moodville:
Originally posted by achiral:
damn straight!! dont' mess with the dandy queen people!!! |
I wasnt even talking about myself, and Konador has shot more dandelions than me or were you talking about him? :P
To get a ribbon one day and then get attacked in the forum the next by having your photographic achievement likened to that of a three year old is certainly demoralizing and takes away from them winning the ribbon. |
I think your photo speaks for itself. Well that AND the voters, who gave it such a high mark.
As far as the armchair. It finished very well with a 6.2 average and 26th of 240 entries. Thats pretty damn good. Not sure I understand why there is such an outcry. |
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05/24/2004 08:03:17 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by Riggs:
Originally posted by moodville:
Originally posted by achiral:
damn straight!! dont' mess with the dandy queen people!!! |
I wasnt even talking about myself, and Konador has shot more dandelions than me or were you talking about him? :P
To get a ribbon one day and then get attacked in the forum the next by having your photographic achievement likened to that of a three year old is certainly demoralizing and takes away from them winning the ribbon. |
I think your photo speaks for itself. Well that AND the voters, who gave it such a high mark. |
Not defending my shot, but the top three in the center composition challenge as per earlier posts in this thread. But thanks for what might be a compliment, I think! :)
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05/24/2004 08:31:40 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by moodville:
To get a ribbon one day and then get attacked in the forum the next by having your photographic achievement likened to that of a three year old is certainly demoralizing and takes away from them winning the ribbon. |
I wouldn't be too bothered about one person's opinion. The fact that it got a ribbon proves that not too many people around here agree with that.
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05/24/2004 08:36:24 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by frumoaznicul:
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
I had this one pegged for top-10
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Indeed that's a masterpiece, however nothing seems to beat frogs, birds, and flying motorcycles on this site... and especially any sort of insect macro. Many people here can't distinguish art from "postcard material". |
Yeah...I'm getting discouraged with the somewhat pedestrian taste of a great many of the voters on this site. I see so many excellent photos that seem to go ignored in favor of greeting card images. I generally think the ribbon winners are pretty deserving (I can think of a few exceptions but I'll keep that opinion to myself) but I see some shots that should never have scored as high as they did considering they beat out far superior work. I'm not talking about my own work, incidently, although I do believe my scores suffer because I come from a very different asthetic background than the majority of users on this site. I base this on perusing the portfolios of other users, particularly the stuff that doesn't get entered into the challenges.
I've been making it a point to save my comments for after I vote so I can vote on all the images. I've missed some good images in the past. I actually failed to do this for the Centered challenge so I missed voting on some good shots.
My theory is that many of the people in this forum have only come to photography through the digital age and aren't familiar with master works of traditional photography. A lot of digital photography buffs seem to favor photos like those wretched duotone images. I think that's the term for the desaturated images with one area of color left in--- cheesy no matter how skillfully it is done. I know I'll get some flak for so blatently revealing this bias but I feel strongly about it. Those shots remind me of the SNL sketch with Alec Baldwin where he plays a talentless photographer whose nephew (with the aid of Photoshop of course) will place the the subject, be it baby, car, rose, or kitten inside a brandy snifter. "... even a brandy snifter inside a brandy snifter. Wrap your head around that."
I'm glad for this site because it's got me thinking more about my own work but I'm seriously thinking of moving on after I've developed some good habits. I really like the two photos that are in challenges right now; the Unusual Viewpoint and Banana. Neither would have been made without the structure of the challenges. One was conceived rather on the fly (but I put thought into how I would make the shot) and the other was planned more carefully. I'm still happy with them despite the beating they've been taking. 4.29 with 47 votes/0 comments, and 4.84 with 92 votes/1 comment (the comment was simply "9" ---thanks to Fire Red Mustang whose 2 highest scoring shots, ironically, are macros of insects---LOL!) I've come to the conclusion, "&#@*% the ribbon and just be glad you're taking pictures again."
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05/24/2004 08:42:17 PM · #47 |
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05/24/2004 09:04:08 PM · #48 |
I did not vote in this challenge but the chair would not get a great vote from me, probably a 7! I just find it grainy! If it had a cat living in it?
Message edited by author 2004-05-24 21:06:17. |
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05/24/2004 10:15:30 PM · #49 |
I think ellamay's Just Dandy is underrated, it's far better than scrap.
She's my choice for Dandy Queen! |
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05/24/2004 10:42:21 PM · #50 |
I guess I just didn't understand this challenge from looking at the winners. And from the looks of it, I didn't understand the challenges that are being voted on right now.
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