Border legality and rules. - DPChallenge Forums

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

06/19/2014 03:16:18 PM · #77

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by P-A-U-L:
I won't ask about circular and triangular shaped borders:)

Oh, go ahead and ask ... ;-)

Validated. ...I'm seeing a pattern here...

MattO

Nikon D4

06/19/2014 03:16:40 PM · #78

Originally posted by MattO:

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by MattO:
You duplicated the shadow. How is that ANY different.

I created a shadow in the border, which is not subject to that rule (otherwise a border itself would be a created element that wasn't part of the capture). In the other example, the outside area is make to look like part of the image with an inline border and the reeds [illegally] cloned out.

Where does it say that you can create or duplicate objects in the border even if they become part of the image? It says you cannot duplicate any element. It doesn't say *except on border*

So I'm still not clear on this and it has not been answered. If we can't put clipart, text or portions of other images, but we can add elements to an image sticking into it? That makes no sense, and also doesn't say that any of that is allowed. In fact it specifically says you can't duplicate any part of the image, it doesn't say *except on the border.

Message edited by author 2014-06-19 15:23:58.

Mike

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Tamron SP 24-70mm f/2.8 Di VC USD Canon Mount

06/19/2014 03:29:34 PM · #79

i think its clear..

we have a new prevailing law, now its time to test it.

aliqui

Nikon D300s

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

06/19/2014 03:35:52 PM · #80

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by P-A-U-L:
I won't ask about circular and triangular shaped borders:)

Oh, go ahead and ask ... ;-)

06/19/2014 03:35:52 PM · #81

Originally posted by giantmike:

I was just about to write "Ah, so borders are basically expert editing, while everything else falls under the selected ruleset."

I'm glad I understand this better now.

Aside from using parts of other photos, which is legal in Expert, yes, that seems about right.

Message edited by author 2014-06-19 15:39:28.

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

06/19/2014 03:45:23 PM · #82

Originally posted by MattO:

In fact it specifically says you can't duplicate any part of the image

It says you can't do that on the photograph (image area). It doesn't say anything about the frame around the photograph (border area).

MattO

Nikon D4

06/19/2014 03:47:43 PM · #83

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by MattO:
In fact it specifically says you can't duplicate any part of the image

It says you can't do that on the photograph (image area). It doesn't say anything about the frame around the photograph (border area).

But it also doesn't say you can do it in the You May section. I think this needs to be amended if its going to be allowed.

Yo_Spiff

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

Olympus 12-100mm f/4.0 M.Zuiko ED IS PRO

06/19/2014 04:02:40 PM · #84

I had a request for validation on the border of this one. Never received a definitive answer and I think the issue was finally forgotten about and allowed to stand. It made no difference with such a mediocre score.

The subject and border did not overlap at all, it was just a jaggy border, distinct as a border.

Kelli

Canon EOS-D60

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

06/19/2014 04:21:31 PM · #85

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by kirbic:
in Kelli's entry there was no clip art of any type in the border. She made a selection for "cropping" her entry - a complicated one, no doubt - and the process by which she made that selection should not matter.

She used another photo as a mask in Photo/Graphic Edges. That's why some rough edge borders have been DQ'd while others have been validated. I don't like it, but them's the rules.

I can't figure out why you think there's another photo involved. AFAIK, it's simply a mask over a transparent layer. Of course, I don't work for PaintShop so don't know their coding and if you do could you please point me to where it explains how the different borders work in it. I just clicked a button for a border.

eta: While it's no big deal now for me, since I've since learned how to do this manually, it would be nice to clear up for the people who still use PSP.

Message edited by author 2014-06-19 16:27:41.

06/19/2014 04:37:28 PM · #86

Originally posted by MattO:

But it also doesn't say you can do it in the You May section.

It says you can add a border. What's in that border is up to you aside from the noted restrictions. People have opted for drop shadows, inlines, faded image area, rough edges, etc. As long as you don't use clip art, text, other photos, or fake image area to circumvent other rules (and you don't care about harsh votes), it'll probably be fine. You can always ask if you have doubts.

Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 EX DG APO IF for Pentax

06/19/2014 04:38:42 PM · #87

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

I had a request for validation on the border of this one. Never received a definitive answer and I think the issue was finally forgotten about and allowed to stand.

We voted 5-3 to validate (suspected clip art again), but never pushed the button. Not sure why, but it happens sometimes.

Nobody

Pentax K-S2

06/19/2014 05:16:37 PM · #88

I will first say that I love the photo - marked it as a favorite. Excellent.

I think that the border really made the photo, as it added an interesting dimension that just wouldn't have been there if all we saw was the outline of the door opening.

That is also why I thought it would've been DQ'd. My understanding of the "spirit" of the border rules were that they were could be used, but shouldn't substantially change the photo. In this case, it struck me that the border was for all practical purposes an added element, and probably # 2 only to the cat/lynx/feline thingy...

I think this should stand, as it sounds as if it meets the letter of the law as it is written. We might want to consider looking at clarifying the rules a bit though to make intent a bit more clear.

Sony FE 200-600mm f/5.6-6.3 G OSS

06/19/2014 07:16:51 PM · #89

Originally posted by Nobody:

In this case, it struck me that the border was for all practical purposes an added element

ALL borders are added elements, and what is the intent if not to enhance or pop the image?

vawendy

Sony Alpha 1

06/19/2014 07:43:40 PM · #90

Only read the beginning -- but I was surprised, as well, that the original image mentioned was validated. A year or two ago I asked an sc (in a private PM) whether this one would be most likely validated or not:

and they thought it was unlikely.

Art Roflmao

Canon EOS-6D Mark II

Nikon AF-S DX 18-105 f/3.5-5.6 ED VR

06/19/2014 08:52:33 PM · #91

Originally posted by Nobody:

I think this should stand...

There you have it - Nobody thinks this should stand.

jomari

Nikon D7000

06/19/2014 09:13:05 PM · #92

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

The drop shadow's not an issue for me because we're regularly allowing canned "creative" borders with the rough edges, the "fake photo emulsion" look, and so forth. A lot of those result in an irregular border.
..... borders created from clip-art designs and such .. is not allowed, explicitly.

Help me out here. What is the difference?

(I, too, was sure Shannon's entry would be DQ'd)

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S24 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

06/19/2014 09:23:03 PM · #93

Originally posted by vawendy:

Well sure: that's not a border! That's an element added within the image itself, and the image continues right to the edge on all four sides.