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11/08/2012 01:05:58 PM · #351 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
well to start, how is it unfair? (im not saying it isnt, just how do you think its unfair?) |
It's unfair because the rich have the power to game the system in their favor. The fact that investment earnings are taxed at a much lower rate than earnings from actually working is a glaring example of this, whether you want to see that or not. Mitt Romney's tax rate is half of mine, and while I do okay and don't begrudge paying taxes, it's clearly unfair. Social mobility in this country is at historic lows, and is lower than nearly every other industrialized country, including those wasteful European countries that have a proper social safety net. So while it's theoretically possible for someone to become Russell Simmons, he's an outlier. The norm in this country is for people to stay pretty much where they started.
You're also comparing your apparently middle class upbringing and choices, with the upbringing and choices of poor people who haven't had the opportunities that you have had, and not surprisingly, finding them lacking.
I think you're also getting wealth and worth to society mixed up, but that's a different argument. |
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11/08/2012 01:08:00 PM · #352 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
You do realize, don't you, that that's because we've done away with all that "wasteful government spending" that used to pay the people who checked up on the job seekers. The requirement to look for work is still there, but the people that used to check up on you? They're collecting unemployment too.
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11/08/2012 01:18:55 PM · #353 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
i still don't see how its unfair.
so far you've just said thats its easy for the rich to keep making money.
so what is stopping say my kids or your kids or anyone from being wealthy? isn't that the point? that anyone can be wealthy? nobody has an unequal opportunity, some may have to work harder than others, but its not like i couldn't be extremely wealthy if i chose to. |
Prove it. Do it. Buying a winning lottery ticket does not count.
The problem is, while it is theoretically possible for "anyone" to become wealthy, it is impossible to have a society where everyone is wealthy, or even well-off. It is not possible to have an economy with ultra-rich without the existence of an extensive underclass.
Do you really think the daughter of a black single mom has an "equal opportunity" to become wealthy as the son of a couple of Harvard Med School grads, or the children of the (Sam) Walton clan?
BTW: The Romney/Ryan tax plan was to cut capital gains taxes to ZERO -- that's right, the rich wouldn't have to pay any income taxes on their "unearned" (IRS term) income. Sounds "fair" to me (not) ....
Message edited by author 2012-11-08 13:21:05. |
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11/08/2012 01:28:24 PM · #354 |
Originally posted by Kelli:
As for SSDI, the only people I personally know that have it/or had it have all deserved it. My father in law (who's been gone for some time) worked 2 & 3 jobs his whole life, until he got run over by a mack truck crushing his legs. He went on SSDI. My grandfather who was struck by a high pressure hose from his liquid hydrogen truck and had massive injuries also received it for a few years until his normal SS kicked in. My aunt who is so deformed from a crippling disease she can't move receives it (SSI). My cousin who had her first open heart surgery when she was 10 received it from when she was 18 until she was 30 (also SSI), when she started a part time job at Ross. She now makes a little more money but has no medical insurance and major heart problems. And myself, who after working 27 years (also sometimes 2 & 3 jobs at once) had two heart attacks, one massive that caused a lot of damage. I don't think any of us are/were gaming the system. I have days I can't get out of bed. Days when I struggle to get down or up the stairs. And all I seem to read about is the anger over so many freaking people that you and others believe are frauds without a shred of evidence. Maybe you know them, I certainly don't. And if I did, I'd turn them in. You already said you wouldn't, so you are as much a problem as they are. |
So, let me see here, Father in law had his legs crushed, but that left an upper body that was functioning perfectly, there are a large number of jobs available to you if your hands and brain work.
Grandfather, what sort of massive injuries? Isn't this what health insurance and workers compensation is for? I'm unclear as to why SSDI/SS is the correct choice for this.
Besides that, SS/ SSDI is a dying beast, I've paid in all my life, but know that it will be gone before I am likely to need it.
Auntie, honestly can't move? Yep - there's a deserving recipient, I fully support her need.
Cousin seems to have demonstrated the problem with our system well: By trying to improve her circumstances, and getting a job, she has effectively lost ground in her battle, by trading a few more dollars for a lot less benefit - clearly if I was her I'd get back on SSDI asap - one medical bill and she's bankrupt.
As for you, and I don't mean to be overly harsh, but I'm not convinced that you can't work - I understand that you have bad days, but are you honestly telling me that you're incapable of performing any work? I honestly don't mean to beat you up, but I think you might be one of the folks I'm actually talking about - I understand that you have pain, and that you suffer - but why shouldn't you be working as you are able? You would seem to be a PERFECT case for a system of working welfare that honestly works. Would you not enjoy having a job you could do and contribute to society with? Do you not miss it?
.. But yeah, let me tell you about my experiences:
My dad is my example of what a person can do if they choose: The most poignant example is the time he fell off a 12ft ladder, breaking both ankles (screws are awesome medical devices), and returned to work the next day in two casts. He wore off so many casts that the doctors, while horrified, were very impressed and amused at his determination.
He's been in six severe car accidents, one of which he was the sole survivor, and has been injured so many times that basically the guy is a giant walking scar. Had a heart attack two years ago, and was back at work in two days. ... That's what American means to me, drive, grit, determination.
Contrast this with my mother, who has done everything she can to scam, cheat, lie etc. Honestly, she's so unimaginably egregious that it's hard to describe her. She's qualified for SSDI, simply because she's so horrible that she can't keep a job for more than a week before being fired... Which apparently qualifies you to be taken care of. I'm very genuinely disgusted by her, and her kind.
The list is large, but a few examples that I'd love to hear your thoughts on are: my ex who has kids with two different guys who left, and now gets a nice three bedroom house on a state-sponsored 30 year mortgage @ $125 a month payment. Or how about the two Army buddies who are 100% disabled, yet are employed in cash and one makes more than I do? Or how about the pill-popper Linda who's a friend of my mother's, she has chronic fatigue syndrome, and is 100% disabled because of it - I'm sure it didn't have anything to do with the 10 Valium she ate every day for 20 years. Or what about the family I used to work for, three generations, all on 100% disability, including the 14 year old kid who ate more pills than I could count.
I could go on, honestly my list isn't even CLOSE to exhausted, but I think that gives you some scope of what I have personally seen, and am connected to. I respect my father, the rest of them are below contempt IMO.
There are people who deserve it - unfortunately, they are outnumbered, in my personal experience, by those who do not.
Message edited by author 2012-11-08 13:28:34. |
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11/08/2012 01:36:44 PM · #355 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Do you really think the daughter of a black single mom has an "equal opportunity" to become wealthy as the son of a couple of Harvard Med School grads, or the children of the (Sam) Walton clan?
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i do, however the likelihood is less for a variety of reasons.
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11/08/2012 01:39:25 PM · #356 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
The problem is, while it is theoretically possible for "anyone" to become wealthy, it is impossible to have a society where everyone is wealthy, or even well-off. It is not possible to have an economy with ultra-rich without the existence of an extensive underclass.
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so what do you want a entire class of people where no one is well off yet equal? that sure sounds like a great place to live, you know with everyone striving to be mediocre and all. |
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11/08/2012 01:40:15 PM · #357 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Kelli, i dont think anyone is saying we get rid of all safety nets, they obviously have their place, but lets not act as if people who get a government handout are willing to just get off of it.
example, i know it isn't welfare, its insurance, but same scenario, but i know a few people on unemployment, NJ has extended the claims to 2 yrs form what was it maybe 6 months! i know people who just sat back and collected, no looking for a job, nothing, and then when it got to the end they magically found jobs right away.
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
In Louisiana when you are on unemployment (first of all it takes a while to get that 1st check) You have to be able to prove that you are looking for jobs. You phone in once a week and have to state where you have applied. You have to have atleast one per week. Mine was easy I was applying to 10 to 15 a day all over the world.
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11/08/2012 01:43:53 PM · #358 |
Once you have given something "for free". It is much harder to stop giving. Look what's happening in Greece right now....If we don't start to get people off of assistance we are going to have the same problems.
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11/08/2012 01:48:20 PM · #359 |
Originally posted by cowboy221977:
Originally posted by mike_311:
Kelli, i dont think anyone is saying we get rid of all safety nets, they obviously have their place, but lets not act as if people who get a government handout are willing to just get off of it.
example, i know it isn't welfare, its insurance, but same scenario, but i know a few people on unemployment, NJ has extended the claims to 2 yrs form what was it maybe 6 months! i know people who just sat back and collected, no looking for a job, nothing, and then when it got to the end they magically found jobs right away.
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
In Louisiana when you are on unemployment (first of all it takes a while to get that 1st check) You have to be able to prove that you are looking for jobs. You phone in once a week and have to state where you have applied. You have to have atleast one per week. Mine was easy I was applying to 10 to 15 a day all over the world. |
this is the way it used to be. but hey why bother checking up on people when they are so many and i'm sure they are honest. how about make the other unemployed check up on them, in fact give them a bonus to find the frauds.
people should be embarrassed to be on unemployment now its accepted behavior to milk the system. seriously when people openly brag about how they are waiting to look for work until the employment runs out, its a problem.
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11/08/2012 01:51:37 PM · #360 |
yeah it was an embarassment for me to be on unemployment...That's why I applied to soo many jobs and in possibly not so goo places like Madagascar, and Alaska (alaska would be great except I dont like the cold)
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11/08/2012 01:55:49 PM · #361 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
You think being unemployed is so great, that it's "easy money"? I'm telling you right now you're full of shit. It sucks. There's nothing good about getting laid off because one of the "job creators" decides to eliminate your job along with a few thousand other little people so he can "create" a new job just like it overseas.
You paint people on unemployment as bums just sitting back and collecting fat checks and livin' large on the unemployment teat?
People like you should experience it sometime, it would give you the perspective and compassion you clearly lack.
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11/08/2012 02:04:22 PM · #362 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by mike_311:
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
You think being unemployed is so great, that it's "easy money"? I'm telling you right now you're full of shit. It sucks. There's nothing good about getting laid off because one of the "job creators" decides to eliminate your job along with a few thousand other little people so he can "create" a new job just like it overseas.
You paint people on unemployment as bums just sitting back and collecting fat checks and livin' large on the unemployment teat?
People like you should experience it sometime, it would give you the perspective and compassion you clearly lack. |
+1000
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11/08/2012 02:04:58 PM · #363 |
Spork, I don't think mike intended to call unemployed people "bums". He was referring to the fact that some places have made it too easy to just collect a check and people have taken advantage of that. And yes it is tough to be laid off...Its happened twice to me
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11/08/2012 02:12:09 PM · #364 |
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by Kelli:
As for SSDI, the only people I personally know that have it/or had it have all deserved it. My father in law (who's been gone for some time) worked 2 & 3 jobs his whole life, until he got run over by a mack truck crushing his legs. He went on SSDI. My grandfather who was struck by a high pressure hose from his liquid hydrogen truck and had massive injuries also received it for a few years until his normal SS kicked in. My aunt who is so deformed from a crippling disease she can't move receives it (SSI). My cousin who had her first open heart surgery when she was 10 received it from when she was 18 until she was 30 (also SSI), when she started a part time job at Ross. She now makes a little more money but has no medical insurance and major heart problems. And myself, who after working 27 years (also sometimes 2 & 3 jobs at once) had two heart attacks, one massive that caused a lot of damage. I don't think any of us are/were gaming the system. I have days I can't get out of bed. Days when I struggle to get down or up the stairs. And all I seem to read about is the anger over so many freaking people that you and others believe are frauds without a shred of evidence. Maybe you know them, I certainly don't. And if I did, I'd turn them in. You already said you wouldn't, so you are as much a problem as they are. |
So, let me see here, Father in law had his legs crushed, but that left an upper body that was functioning perfectly, there are a large number of jobs available to you if your hands and brain work.
Grandfather, what sort of massive injuries? Isn't this what health insurance and workers compensation is for? I'm unclear as to why SSDI/SS is the correct choice for this.
Besides that, SS/ SSDI is a dying beast, I've paid in all my life, but know that it will be gone before I am likely to need it.
Auntie, honestly can't move? Yep - there's a deserving recipient, I fully support her need.
Cousin seems to have demonstrated the problem with our system well: By trying to improve her circumstances, and getting a job, she has effectively lost ground in her battle, by trading a few more dollars for a lot less benefit - clearly if I was her I'd get back on SSDI asap - one medical bill and she's bankrupt.
As for you, and I don't mean to be overly harsh, but I'm not convinced that you can't work - I understand that you have bad days, but are you honestly telling me that you're incapable of performing any work? I honestly don't mean to beat you up, but I think you might be one of the folks I'm actually talking about - I understand that you have pain, and that you suffer - but why shouldn't you be working as you are able? You would seem to be a PERFECT case for a system of working welfare that honestly works. Would you not enjoy having a job you could do and contribute to society with? Do you not miss it?
.. But yeah, let me tell you about my experiences:
My dad is my example of what a person can do if they choose: The most poignant example is the time he fell off a 12ft ladder, breaking both ankles (screws are awesome medical devices), and returned to work the next day in two casts. He wore off so many casts that the doctors, while horrified, were very impressed and amused at his determination.
He's been in six severe car accidents, one of which he was the sole survivor, and has been injured so many times that basically the guy is a giant walking scar. Had a heart attack two years ago, and was back at work in two days. ... That's what American means to me, drive, grit, determination.
Contrast this with my mother, who has done everything she can to scam, cheat, lie etc. Honestly, she's so unimaginably egregious that it's hard to describe her. She's qualified for SSDI, simply because she's so horrible that she can't keep a job for more than a week before being fired... Which apparently qualifies you to be taken care of. I'm very genuinely disgusted by her, and her kind.
The list is large, but a few examples that I'd love to hear your thoughts on are: my ex who has kids with two different guys who left, and now gets a nice three bedroom house on a state-sponsored 30 year mortgage @ $125 a month payment. Or how about the two Army buddies who are 100% disabled, yet are employed in cash and one makes more than I do? Or how about the pill-popper Linda who's a friend of my mother's, she has chronic fatigue syndrome, and is 100% disabled because of it - I'm sure it didn't have anything to do with the 10 Valium she ate every day for 20 years. Or what about the family I used to work for, three generations, all on 100% disability, including the 14 year old kid who ate more pills than I could count.
I could go on, honestly my list isn't even CLOSE to exhausted, but I think that gives you some scope of what I have personally seen, and am connected to. I respect my father, the rest of them are below contempt IMO.
There are people who deserve it - unfortunately, they are outnumbered, in my personal experience, by those who do not. |
Cory, you really are [something]. There are more to circumstances then you seem to want to allow for. My father in law was disabled in the late 60's. There was not a job out there that would hire him with his injuries. Period. My grandfather had his arm almost completely ripped off along with massive head injuries. It was a wonder he survived at all. Workers comp only lasted so long. My cousin has much much more wrong with her than I could ever list. And my aunt is so bad it would make you cry if you met her. As for me, I don't need to prove myself to you. I went right back to work after my first heart attack as well. Within 2 weeks I had the second one. I also have many other medical problems that I didn't list. Things I worked around for years. With the final blow, yes, it became too much. Guess what. With the doctors reports, medical tests, hospital stays, etc. I didn't even need a lawyer to get it. My records speak for themselves. And I certainly don't need to justify it to you.
Message edited by frisca - edited to remove personal attack.. |
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11/08/2012 02:15:00 PM · #365 |
Originally posted by Kelli:
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by Kelli:
As for SSDI, the only people I personally know that have it/or had it have all deserved it. My father in law (who's been gone for some time) worked 2 & 3 jobs his whole life, until he got run over by a mack truck crushing his legs. He went on SSDI. My grandfather who was struck by a high pressure hose from his liquid hydrogen truck and had massive injuries also received it for a few years until his normal SS kicked in. My aunt who is so deformed from a crippling disease she can't move receives it (SSI). My cousin who had her first open heart surgery when she was 10 received it from when she was 18 until she was 30 (also SSI), when she started a part time job at Ross. She now makes a little more money but has no medical insurance and major heart problems. And myself, who after working 27 years (also sometimes 2 & 3 jobs at once) had two heart attacks, one massive that caused a lot of damage. I don't think any of us are/were gaming the system. I have days I can't get out of bed. Days when I struggle to get down or up the stairs. And all I seem to read about is the anger over so many freaking people that you and others believe are frauds without a shred of evidence. Maybe you know them, I certainly don't. And if I did, I'd turn them in. You already said you wouldn't, so you are as much a problem as they are. |
So, let me see here, Father in law had his legs crushed, but that left an upper body that was functioning perfectly, there are a large number of jobs available to you if your hands and brain work.
Grandfather, what sort of massive injuries? Isn't this what health insurance and workers compensation is for? I'm unclear as to why SSDI/SS is the correct choice for this.
Besides that, SS/ SSDI is a dying beast, I've paid in all my life, but know that it will be gone before I am likely to need it.
Auntie, honestly can't move? Yep - there's a deserving recipient, I fully support her need.
Cousin seems to have demonstrated the problem with our system well: By trying to improve her circumstances, and getting a job, she has effectively lost ground in her battle, by trading a few more dollars for a lot less benefit - clearly if I was her I'd get back on SSDI asap - one medical bill and she's bankrupt.
As for you, and I don't mean to be overly harsh, but I'm not convinced that you can't work - I understand that you have bad days, but are you honestly telling me that you're incapable of performing any work? I honestly don't mean to beat you up, but I think you might be one of the folks I'm actually talking about - I understand that you have pain, and that you suffer - but why shouldn't you be working as you are able? You would seem to be a PERFECT case for a system of working welfare that honestly works. Would you not enjoy having a job you could do and contribute to society with? Do you not miss it?
.. But yeah, let me tell you about my experiences:
My dad is my example of what a person can do if they choose: The most poignant example is the time he fell off a 12ft ladder, breaking both ankles (screws are awesome medical devices), and returned to work the next day in two casts. He wore off so many casts that the doctors, while horrified, were very impressed and amused at his determination.
He's been in six severe car accidents, one of which he was the sole survivor, and has been injured so many times that basically the guy is a giant walking scar. Had a heart attack two years ago, and was back at work in two days. ... That's what American means to me, drive, grit, determination.
Contrast this with my mother, who has done everything she can to scam, cheat, lie etc. Honestly, she's so unimaginably egregious that it's hard to describe her. She's qualified for SSDI, simply because she's so horrible that she can't keep a job for more than a week before being fired... Which apparently qualifies you to be taken care of. I'm very genuinely disgusted by her, and her kind.
The list is large, but a few examples that I'd love to hear your thoughts on are: my ex who has kids with two different guys who left, and now gets a nice three bedroom house on a state-sponsored 30 year mortgage @ $125 a month payment. Or how about the two Army buddies who are 100% disabled, yet are employed in cash and one makes more than I do? Or how about the pill-popper Linda who's a friend of my mother's, she has chronic fatigue syndrome, and is 100% disabled because of it - I'm sure it didn't have anything to do with the 10 Valium she ate every day for 20 years. Or what about the family I used to work for, three generations, all on 100% disability, including the 14 year old kid who ate more pills than I could count.
I could go on, honestly my list isn't even CLOSE to exhausted, but I think that gives you some scope of what I have personally seen, and am connected to. I respect my father, the rest of them are below contempt IMO.
There are people who deserve it - unfortunately, they are outnumbered, in my personal experience, by those who do not. |
Cory, you really are [something]. There are more to circumstances then you seem to want to allow for. My father in law was disabled in the late 60's. There was not a job out there that would hire him with his injuries. Period. My grandfather had his arm almost completely ripped off along with massive head injuries. It was a wonder he survived at all. Workers comp only lasted so long. My cousin has much much more wrong with her than I could ever list. And my aunt is so bad it would make you cry if you met her. As for me, I don't need to prove myself to you. I went right back to work after my first heart attack as well. Within 2 weeks I had the second one. I also have many other medical problems that I didn't list. Things I worked around for years. With the final blow, yes, it became too much. Guess what. With the doctors reports, medical tests, hospital stays, etc. I didn't even need a lawyer to get it. My records speak for themselves. And I certainly don't need to justify it to you. |
I expected as much. You see how you perceived all of that as an attack on you and yours? You apparently missed my point, because you were so busy being defensive and misreading what I wrote. And, just to be clear, while I enjoy you calling me [something], name calling is against the rules, even in PM's apparently, and especially in the forums.
Message edited by frisca - edited to remove personal attack. . |
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11/08/2012 02:16:49 PM · #366 |
[something] for sure.
Message edited by frisca - edited to remove name-calling. |
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11/08/2012 02:22:19 PM · #367 |
I like how both of you somehow seem to think that by calling me [something], you've somehow fixed our problem...
Well done.
Yet, meanwhile, the numbers depending on this system are increasing, and the numbers supporting it are decreasing. Enjoy the rapidly approaching collapse of what you so vigorously defend, you [people with differing opinions/experiences from mine].
Message edited by frisca - name calling removed. |
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11/08/2012 02:27:40 PM · #368 |
| let's try this without calling names. I'm sure we can do it. |
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11/08/2012 02:27:50 PM · #369 |
Originally posted by Cory:
I like how both of you somehow seem to think that by calling me [something], you've somehow fixed our problem...
Well done.
Yet, meanwhile, the numbers depending on this system are increasing, and the numbers supporting it are decreasing. Enjoy the rapidly approaching collapse of what you so vigorously defend, you [people with differing opinions/experiences from mine]. |
I'll be dead in 10 years, give or take a year either way. It won't much matter to me after that now would it.
Message edited by frisca - you know what, you know why. |
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11/08/2012 02:30:41 PM · #370 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
Originally posted by mike_311:
unemployment used to be a burden, you used to have to look for work and report where to put applications, call in your claim every two weeks, now its cake, you never have to look for work meaning they dont check up on you you hop online and hit a few check boxes and boom a check shows up. |
You think being unemployed is so great, that it's "easy money"? I'm telling you right now you're full of shit. It sucks. There's nothing good about getting laid off because one of the "job creators" decides to eliminate your job along with a few thousand other little people so he can "create" a new job just like it overseas.
You paint people on unemployment as bums just sitting back and collecting fat checks and livin' large on the unemployment teat?
People like you should experience it sometime, it would give you the perspective and compassion you clearly lack. |
you're right i have no idea what its like, oh wait! i do! my wife lost her job last year, company shut down, outsourced. she spent time sitting back on unemployment and going back to school, never go into the medical program even though she worked her but off she could have collected for another year before i told her she needed to go back to work not sitting at home collecting money for nothing even though she wanted to, now she is back to work making less than when she was on when she was on unemployment (imagine that!) and if she wants to get into the medical program if she decides to reapply this year she wont get any benefits and we'll have to suffer through her not working for a year or more, not sure what we plan to do, but we are saving just in case she goes that route.
so you know instead of bitching and crying how life in unfair and how the man is keeping us down by taking her jobs and how unfair the admission board was, we thought about it and came up with a game plan, its not ideal and its going to set us back, but that the decisions we make.
so no i have no compassion for anyone who is too lazy, lacks initiative, wants what they didn't earn but feels they are entitled to, or whatever act as if this country owes you anything, its doesn't. you get what your earn. so the game isn't fair, life isn't fair, you just deal with it. blaming someone else for your problems gets you nowhere.
so yeah i have no idea what im talking about, i love how you just assume i am out of touch becuase you can't understand my "lack of compassion" clearly i can separate my emotions from my philosophy unlike a lot of people here.
i just choose not to whine like a [edited out name calling] how "the "job creators" decides to eliminate your job along with a few thousand other little people so he can "create" a new job just like it overseas."
Message edited by author 2012-11-08 14:33:23. |
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11/08/2012 02:31:00 PM · #371 |
It seems that many of us believe that everyone has the right to be average or above average, while I realize that the math doesn't add up like that.
Some people must "fail", that's just the harsh reality of this world, and I realize that you don't like it - but so what? What you like doesn't concern me, my concern is saved for those things that actually matter.
And I honestly just want to say that I find you atrociously foolish for calling me an (naughty word edited out for Frisca) for suggesting that these programs and benefits should be saved for only the most deserving. I am most certainly aligned against you, as I think people who think like you are a huge portion of the problem with the world today.
Cheers.
Message edited by author 2012-11-08 14:31:44. |
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11/08/2012 02:32:50 PM · #372 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
The problem is, while it is theoretically possible for "anyone" to become wealthy, it is impossible to have a society where everyone is wealthy, or even well-off. It is not possible to have an economy with ultra-rich without the existence of an extensive underclass.
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so what do you want a entire class of people where no one is well off yet equal? that sure sounds like a great place to live, you know with everyone striving to be mediocre and all. |
Not at all ... but I also don't think we need a situation where there are millions of undernourished and under-educated kids, while a couple thousand individuals have billions ... if someone can't afford to support their family in grand style on a couple of hundred million ... |
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11/08/2012 02:34:57 PM · #373 |
Originally posted by Kelli:
I'll be dead in 10 years, give or take a year either way. It won't much matter to me after that now would it. |
Sure, of course, why care about the future, or anyone else, when I can think about me right now instead?
Perhaps you'd be better served thinking about what you want to do with those last ten years to leave the world a better place.
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11/08/2012 02:36:45 PM · #374 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by mike_311:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
The problem is, while it is theoretically possible for "anyone" to become wealthy, it is impossible to have a society where everyone is wealthy, or even well-off. It is not possible to have an economy with ultra-rich without the existence of an extensive underclass.
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so what do you want a entire class of people where no one is well off yet equal? that sure sounds like a great place to live, you know with everyone striving to be mediocre and all. |
Not at all ... but I also don't think we need a situation where there are millions of undernourished and under-educated kids, while a couple thousand individuals have billions ... if someone can't afford to support their family in grand style on a couple of hundred million ... |
fair point, and again im not again revising the tax code, bu just taxing them more becuase we can is stealing. you cant just take what someone else has.
we are blaming the wrong people, we should be blaming the government for slowly allowing the the job creators to seek elsewhere for cheaper labor. and we arent expecting more of ourselves, we expect that what we do is good enough in an evolving world where we choose not to evolve. |
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11/08/2012 02:38:40 PM · #375 |
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by Kelli:
I'll be dead in 10 years, give or take a year either way. It won't much matter to me after that now would it. |
Sure, of course, why care about the future, or anyone else, when I can think about me right now instead?
Perhaps you'd be better served thinking about what you want to do with those last ten years to leave the world a better place. |
Cory, you know nothing about me or my family or the way I've lived my life. So just shut up already. If you ever get your medical degree and end up on the SSDI board, I'll be sure to consult with you. Until then, go butt into the people's lives you know are cheating the system. Be a man and turn them in or shut the hell up. |
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