Pricing of photo licence for Huge Concert

10/11/2011 11:19:33 AM · #1

I have a phone meeting in 10 minutes with the guy producing the a huge concert (giant, giant international acts, millions of online viewers). He wants to license my photo. I have no idea which one or where he will use it yet (I assume online). I know that's not a lot of information to go on and I know it's super short notice, but can someone please help me come up with a ballpark figure or link me to those calculators? I'm so excited that I'm having trouble finding any of those links! Thanks guys!

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 17-35mm f/2.8D IF-ED

10/11/2011 11:36:48 AM · #2

Ok, I just talked to him so I have some more info.

The concert is on Saturday and he is hoping to get everything squared away within the next few hours.

He wants to use my image in a video during the concert (17k audience members in person, more online). The concert will later be re-broadcast on TV (unknown number of viewers). The image will also be used on the homepage of the website for the non-profit foundation (internationally known figure leads the foundation) for one year, with the opportunity to re-up on the license.

Since the concert is put on by a non-profit, all of the performers are donating their time. The guy I talked to said that he doesn't want to offend me with a number, but their budget is very low. He said I would get credit for the use of my image.

Any advice you guys have for me would be beyond helpful. Thanks guys!

tanguera

Nikon D750

10/11/2011 11:42:15 AM · #3

One of those case by case calls, I'm afraid. I think

Skip would probably argue for no-pay, no-play, but then there is the great-exposure/credit side. It really is up to you. Is it a charity you would support? You may be able to write it off if it's a non-profit organization.

10/11/2011 11:46:24 AM · #4

Skip is definitely one of those people I'm hoping will see this within the next hour or so : ) I'll send him a PM too, just in case.

10/11/2011 12:21:54 PM · #5

I found some of those calculators, but their perimeters don't really mesh well with what I need. Would this be advertising (they're advertising their non-profit, kinda), corporate (I don't think so, but...), or editorial (kinda, but not really)? No idea. The non-profit part is totally throwing me off. And the part that they want to use the image on the web for a year. Why don't these calculators have web-use!?

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G DX VR

10/11/2011 12:58:55 PM · #6

I'm open to advice from anyone on this. I feel like I'm totally floundering. Would $300 be totally low-balling myself, even though it's a non-profit? Would $1,500 lose me the placement?

myqyl

Nikon D3100

10/11/2011 01:09:09 PM · #7

Disclaimer : In my experience, people that take my advice usually regret it eventiually... That said...

He said he didn't want to offend you with a number. Personally I would ask him to go ahead and offend me :) See what ballpark he is thinking of. Tell him you want to support his cause (assuming you do) and ask him if he knows anything about writing off a portion of the "market value" (and ask what the free market value might be) and explain you'd be willing to take whatever they can realistically afford in cash (to cover expenses) and the rest in a charitable deduction. Consider backstage oppurtunities in the future as well. Cost him nothing and could get you some priceless images.

This is a bad practice (IMO) when dealing with businesspeople, but likely a safe route to take with non-profit do-gooders.

... but that's just me

Message edited by author 2011-10-11 13:11:45.

tanguera

Nikon D750

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 17-35mm f/2.8D IF-ED

10/11/2011 01:12:07 PM · #8

I agree with myqyl.

myqyl

Nikon D3100

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G DX VR

10/11/2011 01:14:55 PM · #9

Originally posted by tanguera:

I agree with myqyl.

You mean the part that people regret taking my advice? :)

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S24 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

10/11/2011 01:15:46 PM · #10

Don't be thrown by the "non-profit" aspect, it's still a business and it still makes a profit, or what would be the point? The thing about a non-profit is, the name's a misnomer; there IS a profit, but the profits go to something tax-deductible.

You can be 100% sure that the PR people are getting paid, the web designers are getting paid, the expenses of the musicians are being paid, hotels are being arranged, road crews are being compensated, and so forth and so on. They may be billing at less-than-usual rates, but they are getting paid. So you don't want to completely undersell yourself.

The figure $500.00 had crossed my mind when I read your first post...

R.

Skip

Canon EOS-1D X

Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM

10/11/2011 01:36:39 PM · #11

DAMMIT!!! just spent 10 minutes typing a response and some crap backspace combination wiped it all out. flippin typical.

don't have time to retype it all :(

anyway, a similar royalty-free image would run them about $600/yr and a similar rights-managed image would run them about $16,000.

it would be nice to know how many images/photographers they are dealing with and what they're paying everyone else (even nicer would be for them to have a standard pay-scale!) is your image a centerpiece image, or just part of the rotation. same question is true for using on their home page. the higher the visibility, the more they should pay.

also, there is no 'charitable deduction' for photography. you can only deduct the actual cost of a tangible good (ie, the cost of the CD the image is on, but not the value of the imagery).

$500 is probably fair, but as myqyl suggested, as them for a number. if it's reasonable, take it; if it's too low, tell them you were thinking a bit higher and see how much they can come up. if they won't, then pass on it. bono can afford to work for free, but the rest of us working schlepps got bills to pay.

also, don't go into this believing or expecting that you will get exposure out of it...it typically just doesn't happen.

good luck!

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

10/11/2011 01:48:15 PM · #12

Originally posted by myqyl:

He said he didn't want to offend you with a number. Personally I would ask him to go ahead and offend me :)

Great negotiating advice. You always want the other person to make the first bid. They naturally know what they are doing so they are trying to make YOU make the first bid. Maybe they were prepared to pay $1,000, but if you come in at $300 then they will consider themselves lucky.

If you feel compelled to make the first bid, I'd use the numbers Skip gave you ($600/yr, $16,000) and then come back with, "$16,000 seems crazy to me, so I thought we could work on this together. What were you thinking?" Now, they are in the position to make the first bid, but even though $16,000 is obviously more than you are going to get it psychologically affects the conversation and their first offer will tend to be a little higher than they were originally going to do. (See an excellent book: "Predictably Irrational: The Hidden Forces That Shape Our Decisions")

Message edited by author 2011-10-11 13:51:06.

10/11/2011 02:06:48 PM · #13

Thanks so much for the advice guys!! I knew I could count on you : )

He came at me with a very low number. I asked him to double it. He said he'd talk with his production team and get back to me. He also mentioned the exposure bit. I know it rarely happens that something like this will actually get me enough exposure to get me another job, but the thought of a few million people seeing my image is still pretty awesome.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

10/11/2011 02:10:15 PM · #14

My guess was he was going to come in with fifty bucks... Not any reflection on you, but more on the general feeling people have to the value of a picture.

Message edited by author 2011-10-11 14:10:26.

10/11/2011 02:17:32 PM · #15

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

My guess was he was going to come in with fifty bucks... Not any reflection on you, but more on the general feeling people have to the value of a picture.

That's pretty dang close. He said mine looked the most professional of the bunch though.

Semi-related question. Should I sharpen normally or a little extra considering this thing is going to be on a huge (digital) screen? Since it's still a digital screen, I'd guess normal sharpening, but I figured I'd ask just in case.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

10/11/2011 02:25:15 PM · #16

ya, I'd just sharpen as per usual for the size of the file.

alanfreed

Nikon Z9

10/11/2011 04:00:24 PM · #17

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

The figure $500.00 had crossed my mind when I read your first post...

R.

For what it's worth, I was thinking the same.

Art Roflmao

Canon EOS-6D Mark II