Street Portraiture, a blank expression?

07/06/2010 10:24:15 AM · #26

Lot's of overthinking going on in this thread.

Formal portrait is pretty simple and clear.

07/06/2010 10:31:14 AM · #27

Originally posted by klkitchens:

Lot's of overthinking going on in this thread.

Formal portrait is pretty simple and clear.

That's low average thinking, as a shooter, an artist or as a viewer. Stick yourself in a box like that, ya kinda lose air but to each his own. Via con dios...

07/06/2010 10:38:15 AM · #28

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by klkitchens:
Lot's of overthinking going on in this thread.

Formal portrait is pretty simple and clear.

That's low average thinking, as a shooter, an artist or as a viewer. Stick yourself in a box like that, ya kinda lose air but to each his own. Via con dios...

There's nothing low or average about such thinking.

There is simply READING THE ASSIGNMENT and shooting accordingly.

Scoring should be likewise.

Panasonic Lumix G VARIO 12-35mm F2.8 ASPH Mega O.I.S

07/06/2010 10:42:11 AM · #29

Originally posted by klkitchens:

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by klkitchens:
Lot's of overthinking going on in this thread.

Formal portrait is pretty simple and clear.

That's low average thinking, as a shooter, an artist or as a viewer. Stick yourself in a box like that, ya kinda lose air but to each his own. Via con dios...

There's nothing low or average about such thinking.

There is simply READING THE ASSIGNMENT and shooting accordingly.

Scoring should be likewise.

Via con dios...dude!

wetland

Panasonic Lumix DMC GH3

07/06/2010 10:44:49 AM · #30

Obviously not wanting to give anything away...but I do not think we can second guess in this one whether or not there was any prior contact/knowledge of the person (i.e., were they strangers) just by their expression in the shot. Need to assume that everyone was ethically honest and followed the rules. I approached several people and got very different reactions (and photos) from each. Some were surprised and showed little to no expression, some thought it was funny and sorta gave a strange awkward expression, and some responded to the word "portrait" and provided a nice pose (generally with a smile BTW). No question that this would be easier as a candid shot, but that was expressly excluded by the rules so I voted accodingly.

07/06/2010 10:47:17 AM · #31

Originally posted by wetland:

It wasn't the "rules" it was the challenge "theme". But you're right. People could use any subject they wanted and who would know. The photos should be judged on their quality AND if they met the theme of a formal portrait.

There's no need for over analysis of the photographer's intent or such nonsense. Look at the result.

LevT

OM System OM-1

07/06/2010 10:49:23 AM · #32

The word "formal" bothered me in the challenge description from the very beginning. I was afraid that some people would latch on it and judge this challenge as a senior portrait session... seems to be happening...

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

07/06/2010 11:00:45 AM · #33

Originally posted by LevT:

I agree. It's a freaking drag and kinda depressing that people go there...and makes things suck BUT most (a very high percentage) of the images as far as I can tell are straight forward in a good way. As I saw it the word was an attempt to show engagement...no more no less, as opposed to an easy candid, passed off as something it's not. I should also add that a good deal of the images DON'T look like Senior Portraits so, most people got it.

I was in a good mood until I realized people are stinking things up trying to define something fairly simple in intent BUT I should have known. Bummer.

Message edited by author 2010-07-06 11:02:22.

Yo_Spiff

07/06/2010 11:21:45 AM · #34

Originally posted by pawdrix:

I don't think Kevin was being low thinking or in any kind of a box. I felt his observation was just the opposite, saying "take it for what it is".
I think I agree that the word "formal" is part of the confusion because it implies something not present in a street photography environment. Most of the entries seem to fit my understanding of the challenge.

Message edited by author 2010-07-06 11:22:44.

07/06/2010 11:33:37 AM · #35

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by klkitchens:

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by klkitchens:
Lot's of overthinking going on in this thread.

Formal portrait is pretty simple and clear.

That's low average thinking, as a shooter, an artist or as a viewer. Stick yourself in a box like that, ya kinda lose air but to each his own. Via con dios...

There's nothing low or average about such thinking.

There is simply READING THE ASSIGNMENT and shooting accordingly.

Scoring should be likewise.

Via con dios...dude!

That's how I live everyday... (John 3:16-17)

Except it's "vaya con Dios".

Message edited by author 2010-07-06 11:54:42.

07/06/2010 11:34:19 AM · #36

Originally posted by LevT:

Yeah... annoying like when they say "Flowers" and people take photos of "flowers".

07/06/2010 11:35:59 AM · #37

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by LevT:
The word "formal" bothered me in the challenge description from the very beginning. I was afraid that some people would latch on it and judge this challenge as a senior portrait session... seems to be happening...

I agree. It's a freaking drag and kinda depressing that people go there...and makes things suck BUT most (a very high percentage) of the images as far as I can tell are straight forward in a good way. As I saw it the word was an attempt to show engagement...no more no less, as opposed to an easy candid, passed off as something it's not. I should also add that a good deal of the images DON'T look like Senior Portraits so, most people got it.

I was in a good mood until I realized people are stinking things up trying to define something fairly simple in intent BUT I should have known. Bummer.

Ironic... it's you that coming up with all sorts of loopholes and complications (no offense, but really). Formal Portrait *IS* simple. No need to muddy the waters. Unless you like Muddy Waters. He's pretty good.

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM

07/06/2010 11:38:50 AM · #38

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

I think I agree that the word "formal" is part of the confusion because it implies something not present in a street photography environment. Most of the entries seem to fit my understanding of the challenge.

As I'm looking at the images...I'd say maybe...maybe a small handful of shots, at best are borderline which ain't bad. Which makes me believe everyone pretty much got it.

Again, as the guy who authored the Challenge...and posted many examples in a few different Challenge discussion threads...it doesn't seem to be an issue based on the entries, by those who went out and shot for this. How "formal" does formal need to be....seems to be a silly question and again, by looking at the entries almost everyone got it right. I just hope people don't jam something in there that wasn't in the ballpark of my intent...without having to write a one paragraph description to head off crazy notions.

Timosaby

Canon EOS-7D

07/06/2010 11:41:49 AM · #39

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Sorry that's just a lame comment to make.

I personally think all the babble you've written about street portraits is pretentious

BUT HEY

VIA CON DIOS DUDE...

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 28-300mm f3.5-5.6G ED VR

07/06/2010 11:54:09 AM · #40

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

I think I agree that the word "formal" is part of the confusion because it implies something not present in a street photography environment. Most of the entries seem to fit my understanding of the challenge.

As I'm looking at the images...I'd say maybe...maybe a small handful of shots, at best are borderline which ain't bad. Which makes me believe everyone pretty much got it.

Again, as the guy who authored the Challenge...and posted many examples in a few different Challenge discussion threads...it doesn't seem to be an issue based on the entries, by those who went out and shot for this. How "formal" does formal need to be....seems to be a silly question and again, by looking at the entries almost everyone got it right. I just hope people don't jam something in there that wasn't in the ballpark of my intent...without having to write a one paragraph description to head off crazy notions.

Well, you should learn to be clear with your desires... and succinct.

I looked at the entries and felt most did NOT get the theme as the site posted. They don't take necessarily suggestions verbatim. And if they did in this case, the "intent" can only be conveyed by the challenge description -- which then gets interpreted by the photographer and voter.

NikonJeb

Nikon D850

07/06/2010 01:43:42 PM · #41

Originally posted by klkitchens:

I looked at the entries and felt most did NOT get the theme as the site posted. They don't take necessarily suggestions verbatim. And if they did in this case, the "intent" can only be conveyed by the challenge description -- which then gets interpreted by the photographer and voter.

Read this and tell me how you're *not* doing the same thing.

Vote and comment as you see fit, but bear in mind you just did the very thing you're griping about.

I find it amusing that you're busting the chops of one of the people who is most well versed in street photography about.......street photography.

Since he not only is accomplished at street photography, but also teaches it, maybe you could look at what he has to say and learn something.

His little "seminar" about a month ago was one of the most awesome experiences I've had as a photographer in a long time. I was awed and delighted with what Steve brought to the table......and took a lot of his time and effort to put together. I don't think I'm alone on that count.....

Yo_Spiff

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

Sony Sonnar T* 35mm F2.8 ZA

07/06/2010 01:45:54 PM · #42

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

His little "seminar" about a month ago was one of the most awesome experiences I've had as a photographer in a long time.

How did I manage to miss this?

salmiakki

Apple iPhone 16 Pro

07/06/2010 01:47:23 PM · #43

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

His little "seminar" about a month ago was one of the most awesome experiences I've had as a photographer in a long time. I was awed and delighted with what Steve brought to the table......and took a lot of his time and effort to put together. I don't think I'm alone on that count.....

Not alone Jeb.

hihosilver

Nikon D200

Nikon AF-S Zoom-Nikkor 28-70mm f/2.8D IF-ED

07/06/2010 01:47:55 PM · #44

Stats: You have rated 89 of 94 images (95%) in this challenge.
You have commented on 1 images (1%) in this challenge.
You have given an average score of 6.3708.

A fun challenge to vote! Well done, Everyone!

NikonJeb

Nikon D850

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 28-300mm f3.5-5.6G ED VR

07/06/2010 01:48:58 PM · #45

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

His little "seminar" about a month ago was one of the most awesome experiences I've had as a photographer in a long time.

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

How did I manage to miss this?

The NYC GTG.....

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

07/06/2010 01:51:51 PM · #46

Originally posted by NikonJeb:

Originally posted by klkitchens:
I looked at the entries and felt most did NOT get the theme as the site posted. They don't take necessarily suggestions verbatim. And if they did in this case, the "intent" can only be conveyed by the challenge description -- which then gets interpreted by the photographer and voter.

Read this and tell me how you're *not* doing the same thing.

Vote and comment as you see fit, but bear in mind you just did the very thing you're griping about.

I find it amusing that you're busting the chops of one of the people who is most well versed in street photography about.......street photography.

Since he not only is accomplished at street photography, but also teaches it, maybe you could look at what he has to say and learn something.

His little "seminar" about a month ago was one of the most awesome experiences I've had as a photographer in a long time. I was awed and delighted with what Steve brought to the table......and took a lot of his time and effort to put together. I don't think I'm alone on that count.....

I'm not "busting his chops". I just don't like when people try to unilaterally declare an interpretation of a challenge to be WRONG as he is doing. I said that people need to read the description and submit and vote as they interpret it based on the words used in the challenge.

He starts talking about HIS INTENT when he suggested the challenge and how all people should be following that intent if you don't do it HIS WAY then you're narrow minded and in a box.

And this theme was not street photography, but street PORTRAITURE. Two altogether different themes.

Yo_Spiff

Pentax DA 18-135mm F3.5-5.6ED AL [IF] WR DC

07/06/2010 02:03:24 PM · #47

Originally posted by klkitchens:

if you don't do it HIS WAY then you're narrow minded and in a box.

And this theme was not street photography, but street PORTRAITURE. Two altogether different themes.

I think you are BOTH saying the other one is interpreting the topic too narrowly, and you are BOTH saying to be more open minded. This is an argument about semantics. You're using different words and you think you are disagreeing but you are not. I think. Maybe. I'm not sure at this point.

tnun

Ricoh GR III

07/06/2010 02:11:24 PM · #48

Calm down. "Formal portrait" is not really all that clear and simple. There are various conventions for formal portraits, and some formal portraits are more formal than others. I was, however, a little intimidated by the word "formal" in the description, but figured it was not so important an element in the challenge as the actual engaging with the subject; and indeed from there - from that engagement - we go to letting the portrayal speak on its own terms.

I do think it is just a matter of common sense NOT to expect street portraits to follow the conventions of studio portraits, but to allow the conventions to be redefined as needed.

The seat of one's pants flight. I babble. I pretend. I enjoy. Viva Pawdrix.

07/06/2010 02:21:06 PM · #49