Why would my desktop startup be tripped a GFI?

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

01/17/2010 08:10:14 PM · #1

Often when I start my computer in the AM it trips the GFI on the circuit. I can't easily find the wattage of the power supply (it's not wimpy), but I suspect a problem with the GFI rather than an actual overload on the circuit. Any opinions? It's annoying and I'm afraid I'm going to fry something one of these times.

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

01/17/2010 08:13:51 PM · #2

Does anything else plugged into the same circuit trip as well?

Covert_Oddity

Nikon D700

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

01/17/2010 08:18:55 PM · #3

I'm no electrician but aren't GFI's supposed to detect an earth leak or short rather than load? Does it happen exactly as you turn the system on or at some point after?

My first guess would be a fault with the PSU itself that has some sort of leak during either power up or the initial high load. If you want to check if it's just overload on the circuit just remove the computer and plug something much higher wattage in, such as a vacuum cleaner or hair dryer.

But like i said, I'm not an electrician so take anything i say as guess!

Yo_Spiff

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

Olympus 12-100mm f/4.0 M.Zuiko ED IS PRO

01/17/2010 08:23:00 PM · #4

I had a faulty GFI socket in my bathroom that was randomly tripping with loads that should not have affected it. It was the socket itself that was at fault. I replaced it about 6 months back and it's been fine since. That would be an easy and cheap thing to try first.

Message edited by author 2010-01-17 20:23:33.

Spork99

OM System OM-1

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

01/17/2010 09:17:58 PM · #5

A GFI trips when the current in the hot is different from the current in the neutral, i.e. something is leaking current to ground. You can buy a cheap GFI circuit checker and test the circuit and make sure the GFI is functioning properly. If it's not, replace it. If it is, you might look at everything connected to the circuit protected by the GFI.

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 USM

01/17/2010 09:25:34 PM · #6

Ya, it's an odd circuit, because the GFI is in the kitchen, but the computer is in what should be the dining room. In the AM, not too much else is on. Certainly not high load things like the microwave or hair dryers. I think I'll try changing the GFI. Can't they get "worn out" from repeated tripping?

RayEthier

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

01/17/2010 09:34:08 PM · #7

You might want to read this LinkDoc.

The advise provided by Spasmo is spot on.

Ray

Canon RF 24-70mm f/2.8 L IS

01/17/2010 09:46:14 PM · #8

Thanks for the link Ray. The two things that jump out:

The Capacitor on a single phase motor (for a "fan", etc.) sometimes causes a GFCI to trip. Commercial Grade GFCIs are better suited to this application.

A noise filter or surge protector in the circuit after the GFCI bypasses high frequency noise to ground. This unbalances the current in the hot and neutral, tripping the device.

So, the computer is plugged into a power strip which does have a surge protector. However, I tried a different power strip and the same thing happens. Could it be the fact there is a surge protector at all? (I admit the sentence above about "high frequency noise to ground" is greek to me.) Now, it only trips on start-up. Once I repeat at start it again and it works, the circuit is fine and never trips "just because".

The power supply, of course, has a fan, but something tells me a fan in a desk to isn't exactly a high amp draw on start-up. Could I be wrong?

Message edited by author 2010-01-17 21:47:11.

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

01/17/2010 09:52:47 PM · #9

Jason,
As you suspect, the fan in a computer has a really low-power motor. In addition, it's DC, not AC, so the "capacitor start" does not apply.
Try plugging the computer in without any surge suppressor. It is possible that's the issue, but I doubt it. If it still happens with no surge suppressor in the circuit, then you can eliminate that hypothesis.
Is the GFCI protection provided by the outlet, or is it incorporated in the breaker (at the electrical box)?

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

01/17/2010 10:35:23 PM · #10

Well, I plugged the desktop straight into the wall and left everything else on the strip. It worked 3 for 3 which is promising. We'll see if it holds up in the AM.

Either that or having gone to Home Depot and having a new GFI sitting on the counter scared away the bad hoo-doo...

Covert_Oddity

Nikon D700

01/17/2010 10:36:54 PM · #11

Perhaps your GFI just gets morning syndrome like the rest of us!

Message edited by author 2010-01-17 22:37:06.

Canon RF 24-70mm f/2.8 L IS

01/17/2010 10:41:50 PM · #12

Originally posted by Covert_Oddity:

Perhaps your GFI just gets morning syndrome like the rest of us!

I'll try pouring some coffee in it...

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

01/17/2010 11:42:56 PM · #13

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

Ha!
So it seems that the surge suppressor may indeed be the bad actor. Well, that's really no big deal, because I'd recommend that you ditch it anyway. If you really want to protect your computer equipment, get a UPS. In addition to providing power through a short blackout (dependent on the size of the UPS used) it can trigger an automatic, proper shutdown of the PC. UPSs are also much more effective at eliminating power irregularities, since the output is essentially independent from the input (at least on better units). In short, a good UPS will provide:
- Line regulation
- Surge suppression
- Complete immunity to short blackouts (seconds to a minute or so)
- Automated shutdown during longer blackouts

01/18/2010 01:04:36 AM · #14

I'm really only using the strip as an extension cord/extra plugs. They all seem to come with surge protection these days.

Sony FE 200-600mm f/5.6-6.3 G OSS

01/18/2010 11:29:43 AM · #15

Well, dang, it happened again this morning. Nothing else was on that I could see on the circuit. How odd. I hate intermittent problems.

PapaBob

Sony Alpha a7 IV

01/18/2010 11:51:02 AM · #16

Is it a GFCI or an Arc Fault outlet? Typically GFCI's are found in Kitchens, bathrooms, exterior and gargaes and Arc Faults are found in newer homes in the bedrooms. Arc Faults work a little differently, they look for arcing between poles where GFCI's look for power lost to ground. Resets for Arc faults are normally found inside the main panel and are used in most newer homes, GFCI resets are typically on one of the outlets although some older homes have them in the panel.

If it is an Arc fault this is a fairly common problem, computers like clean power but tend to create noise which Arc faults read and tend to trip. There can also be problems with a shared common feeding noise from more than one device back to the breaker. I have heard cheaper UPS's feed power straight from the outlet so they do not help but some of the higher end UPS's do help. Searching the web shows this is fairly common problem.

Message edited by author 2010-01-18 12:38:50.

MelonMusketeer

Nikon D7000

Nikon MF 50mm f/1.4

01/18/2010 11:52:38 AM · #17

If you have an outside receptacle or light that just happens to be on the line with the gfi, that could be causing the problem. It happened at my mother's place one time, and it took us a while to figure out what was causing it. Trip the gfi with the test button, and try everything within 30 ft of the gfi to see if there is another receptacle or light that may be tripping the gfi. Mom's gfi would trip when it rained a lot because an outside receptacle was getting water in it.

Sony FE 200-600mm f/5.6-6.3 G OSS

01/18/2010 01:07:19 PM · #18

I'm fairly sure it's GFCI. It's in the kitchen (although the computer is in the dining room). It has the classic "test" and "reset" buttons. I think I'm going to try to switch it out today and see if it happens tomorrow.

PapaBob

Sony Alpha a7 IV

01/18/2010 01:43:03 PM · #19

Originally posted by DrAchoo:

Yes that will be GFCI (you would be surprised how many people get them confused). Possible it is just getting weak but they still respond negatively to noise. Cheapest solution would be to try a new GFCI outlet and maybe get a different brand.

How far from the sink is the outlet? If it is further than six feet from water sources and the outlets near the sink are not wired to that GFCI outlet you could possibly get away with replacing it with a normal outlet. Only recommended as a last resort but if nothing is going to be placed close to a water source you should be fine. Appliance cords are typically 6 feet so that used to be the standard minimum for a required GFCI.