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12/02/2009 04:31:37 PM · #51 |
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
... all the undeserved flak and fall-out that accompanies that. |
Tiger's made about $900 million endorsing products -- essentially holding himself out as "someone we should all hold in high esteeem ans strive to emulate" ("I want to be like Mike" is another variation), so I'm not so sure exposure of any faults or failings is completely irrelevant or undeserved. |
I'm sorry, but anyone that elevates ANYone to a status of "someone we should all hold in high esteem" because they endorse commercial products, or plays a mean game of golf (or hockey or football or acts in movies or whatever), is setting themselves up for a lifetime of disappointment. |
I wasn't saying we should hold him in high esteem, but that he (and the companies which pay him) are promoting him as someone worthy of our trust, and by reference that we should feel confident in buying their products. We are all influenced by the opinions of well-known people whether we like (or realize) it or not -- think of the currently-debated scientific and economic issues for example -- and thus have some right to know about the honesty, integrity, and trustworthiness of the advocates. Personally, I'm less concerned with any alleged infidelity than his (possibly) lying about it; as we learned from Richard Nixon, the crime is almost always less serious than the cover-up. |
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12/02/2009 04:31:42 PM · #52 |
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
I'm sorry, but anyone that elevates ANYone to a status of "someone we should all hold in high esteem" because they endorse commercial products, or plays a mean game of golf (or hockey or football or acts in movies or whatever), is setting themselves up for a lifetime of disappointment. |
Not to mention the weird optics of apparently centring a system of morality on something entirely amoral. |
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12/02/2009 04:43:47 PM · #53 |
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?!
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12/02/2009 04:53:00 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?! |
Elin. |
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12/02/2009 04:56:51 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
1: It's not quite that black and white. People can have astounding morality for certain things, but not for others. I person that shoplifts won't necessarily do anything else wrong, and so it goes with people that cheat on their spouses. Trust, or lack thereof, belongs between the people that are involved. |
Ah, but yes it is.
I stated that it was in my view.
If the dude has no compunction about cheating on his wife, then any representation of him being any kind of example of civilized behavior goes right out the window for me.
If you're going to fall back on the poor man just couldn't resist that animal impulse, then maybe he's no better than an animal in other things.
Like it or not, when you're a public figure, you *do* get held to a higher standard, everyone knows this, and you are under more scrutiny.
That is just more reason to behave sensibly, because with that scrutiny, if you behave like a pig, you're going to get caught.
Thing is.....if my kid asks me if he's a good role model, I'm going to say no.
To me, honesty and trust *is* black and white, because I'm certainly going to tell her that if her boyfriend or husband were to cheat on her, then no, he is neither.
Same with shoplifting.....it's stealing, period, and just because a thief may decide he won't cheat on his wife doesn't make him a role model, either.
I'm sorry, but I just don't have a sliding scale of honesty.
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12/02/2009 04:57:28 PM · #56 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?! |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Elin. |
SNAP!
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12/02/2009 05:01:20 PM · #57 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
1: It's not quite that black and white. People can have astounding morality for certain things, but not for others. I person that shoplifts won't necessarily do anything else wrong, and so it goes with people that cheat on their spouses. Trust, or lack thereof, belongs between the people that are involved. |
Ah, but yes it is.
I stated that it was in my view.
If the dude has no compunction about cheating on his wife, then any representation of him being any kind of example of civilized behavior goes right out the window for me.
If you're going to fall back on the poor man just couldn't resist that animal impulse, then maybe he's no better than an animal in other things.
Like it or not, when you're a public figure, you *do* get held to a higher standard, everyone knows this, and you are under more scrutiny.
That is just more reason to behave sensibly, because with that scrutiny, if you behave like a pig, you're going to get caught.
Thing is.....if my kid asks me if he's a good role model, I'm going to say no.
To me, honesty and trust *is* black and white, because I'm certainly going to tell her that if her boyfriend or husband were to cheat on her, then no, he is neither.
Same with shoplifting.....it's stealing, period, and just because a thief may decide he won't cheat on his wife doesn't make him a role model, either.
I'm sorry, but I just don't have a sliding scale of honesty. |
You know, that explains a lot about, well, a lot. |
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12/02/2009 05:09:24 PM · #58 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Same with shoplifting.....it's stealing, period ....
I'm sorry, but I just don't have a sliding scale of honesty. |
I'm sure Jean Valjean would be disappointed to hear that ... |
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12/02/2009 05:55:44 PM · #59 |
| Having sex outside of marriage does not entitle one to be labeled a "pig". That's a shocking attitude. |
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12/02/2009 06:03:57 PM · #60 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?! |
Elin. |
Exactly.
Is she posting here? Even a member of DPC?
Why do people, who are not directly involved, care so much about this kind of stuff? Is it just a way to feel better about their own lives by reveling in the dirty laundry of others? Are their lives so dull that this kind of thing takes the place of "excitement" in their their lives? I really don't understand. |
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12/02/2009 07:06:22 PM · #61 |
Check this out. Scary stuff. I'm a fan of Tiger, but this is...incredible.
First Church of Tiger Woods |
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12/02/2009 07:21:54 PM · #62 |
I guess thats better than Ron L Hubbard being God. |
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12/02/2009 09:15:43 PM · #63 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?! |
Elin. |
Exactly.
Is she posting here? Even a member of DPC?
Why do people, who are not directly involved, care so much about this kind of stuff? Is it just a way to feel better about their own lives by reveling in the dirty laundry of others? Are their lives so dull that this kind of thing takes the place of "excitement" in their their lives? I really don't understand. |
almost as dull as the ones who are so bored as to search the forums for topics they have no interest in and continue to post !!! LOL... No one here is taking it personal.. it's not as if today I woke up, found out about this and then said to myself, wow, I'm so happy this happened and I feel so much prettier today... We're just talking.. That's all.. If we were standing next to a water cooler, then it would be... what do they call that, oh.. water cooler talk.. :-) |
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12/02/2009 09:22:13 PM · #64 |
OH, and just one last little itty bitty thingy about Tiger Woods and this whole role model thing... This is supposively a quote from him..
âI think it's an honor to be a role model to one person or maybe more than that. If you are given a chance to be a role model, I think you should always take it because you can influence a person's life in a positive light, and that's what I want to do. That's what it's all about.â
Tiger Woods quotes
this is a cool site... fun for searching for quotes..
for the record, after thinking about this today... I wondered what Tiger's teen years were like, his early 20's and then on.. Remember the days most of us spent being irresponsible and careless... I bet he never had a day like that in his life.. Maybe after his father passed or as soon as he got out from under his watchful eye, he sorta went a little girl crazy... Now, don't get me wrong, I don't ever agree with any reason to cheat on your pregnant wife TWICE and carry on a relationship while married, but maybe he just never got to be a normal dude.. this was his way of bucking the system of always being TIGER WOODS.. |
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12/02/2009 10:52:23 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by kandykarml:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
At the end of the day, WHO CARES?! |
Elin. |
Exactly.
Is she posting here? Even a member of DPC?
Why do people, who are not directly involved, care so much about this kind of stuff? Is it just a way to feel better about their own lives by reveling in the dirty laundry of others? Are their lives so dull that this kind of thing takes the place of "excitement" in their their lives? I really don't understand. |
almost as dull as the ones who are so bored as to search the forums for topics they have no interest in and continue to post !!! LOL... No one here is taking it personal.. it's not as if today I woke up, found out about this and then said to myself, wow, I'm so happy this happened and I feel so much prettier today... We're just talking.. That's all.. If we were standing next to a water cooler, then it would be... what do they call that, oh.. water cooler talk.. :-) |
I'm not interested in the topic of this thread, but I am rather fascinated by what motivates those who choose to gossip and follow such events as if they were important. So, why talk about this and not something important? Why not talk about some art you've seen or a photo you've made or something else of substance? |
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12/02/2009 10:58:36 PM · #66 |
yadayadayada! At the end of the day with all these high profile marriages, it ususally just comes down to money. Most of those wives would'nt even flinch under a normal marriage act. Because at the end of the day, it's usually about getting paid. If she really took the club to him, I'm guessing PRENUP. And if there was no prenup, I'm guessing no problem.
Your welcome to take your pitchforks to me now :) |
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12/02/2009 11:13:48 PM · #67 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
why talk about this and not something important? |
It's entertaining. |
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12/03/2009 12:40:34 AM · #68 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
why talk about this and not something important? |
It's entertaining. |
Why? What's entertaining about another person's difficulties in their life?
Message edited by author 2009-12-03 00:41:16. |
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12/03/2009 12:58:00 AM · #69 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
why talk about this and not something important? |
It's entertaining. |
Why? What's entertaining about another person's difficulties in their life? |
wow.. so, we can't discuss the current affairs of our favorite sports stars.. I mean, we would be discussing Tiger right now if he just played the most amazing 18 holes.. if he just broke another golfing record..At least, I would.. Just because right now, the topic is unpleasant, doesn't mean we ALL have to pretend it's not happening and put tape over our mouths and not talk about it.. If it makes you uncomfortable, you certainly don't have to participate, but don't misunderstand.. I talk about Tiger all the time, not just right now.. |
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12/03/2009 01:09:25 AM · #70 |
Originally posted by kandykarml:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
What's entertaining about another person's difficulties in their life? |
wow.. so, we can't discuss the current affairs of our favorite sports stars.. I mean, we would be discussing Tiger right now if he just played the most amazing 18 holes.. if he just broke another golfing record..At least, I would.. Just because right now, the topic is unpleasant, doesn't mean we ALL have to pretend it's not happening and put tape over our mouths and not talk about it.. If it makes you uncomfortable, you certainly don't have to participate, but don't misunderstand.. I talk about Tiger all the time, not just right now.. |
Well, to be fair, you *don't* talk about Tiger in here much at all, none of us do. I don't recall, for example, any thread about Tiger's amazing U.S. Open win on a broken leg... The reason *this* thread exists is because he is a mega-star athlete who's been laid low by a scandal of his own making, and people are gossiping about it, plain and simple.
So the question Spazmo's posing is a legitimate one; *why* are people so interested in this? Don't they have anything better to do than fixate on someone else's problems? And I don't have the answer to that, except to note that since time immemorial, humans have been avid spectators when the mighty fall. There's something fundamental about it... it's like, *Biblical* or something...
R. |
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12/03/2009 07:54:32 AM · #71 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
So the question Spazmo's posing is a legitimate one; *why* are people so interested in this? Don't they have anything better to do than fixate on someone else's problems? And I don't have the answer to that, except to note that since time immemorial, humans have been avid spectators when the mighty fall. There's something fundamental about it... it's like, *Biblical* or something...
R. |
I believe the media is pumping away at it and nobody would really care all that much if they left it alone. The more they push it the more people get sucked in whether they care about it or not. Same exact thing with the Whitehouse Crashers.
Sadly, the news networks are in the business of fueling and creating stories instead of reporting on things that are newsworthy.
I still have no clear idea on what's happening with Healthcare or separating the lies, half-truths and all the info coming from the lobbying blitz. It odd how CNN will run an interview or program making claims and then follow by two Ads that say the opposite of what we'd heard. |
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12/03/2009 07:55:44 AM · #72 |
Originally posted by kandykarml:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
why talk about this and not something important? |
It's entertaining. |
Why? What's entertaining about another person's difficulties in their life? |
wow.. so, we can't discuss the current affairs of our favorite sports stars.. I mean, we would be discussing Tiger right now if he just played the most amazing 18 holes.. if he just broke another golfing record..At least, I would.. Just because right now, the topic is unpleasant, doesn't mean we ALL have to pretend it's not happening and put tape over our mouths and not talk about it.. If it makes you uncomfortable, you certainly don't have to participate, but don't misunderstand.. I talk about Tiger all the time, not just right now.. |
How many threads on DPC have been created to highlight Tiger's achievements, charitable acts, and the good things he's done?
I never said you can't gossip, just that I don't really see the entertainment value in another person's difficulties. You've just taken offense, without really addressing my question. |
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12/03/2009 08:07:58 AM · #73 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
I never said you can't gossip, just that I don't really see the entertainment value in another person's difficulties. You've just taken offense, without really addressing my question. |
Totally OT now, but I read something about this a while back. Here's a link;
//www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=the-science-of-gossip
Extract;
"Why does private information about other people represent such an irresistible temptation for us? In his book Grooming, Gossip, and the Evolution of Language (Harvard University Press, 1996), psychologist Robin Dunbar of the University of Liverpool in England suggested that gossip is a mechanism for bonding social groups together, analogous to the grooming that is found in primate groups. Sarah R. Wert, now at the University of Colorado at Boulder, and Peter Salovey of Yale University have proposed that gossip is one of the best tools that we have for comparing ourselves socially with others."
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12/03/2009 10:08:32 AM · #74 |
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by kandykarml:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
why talk about this and not something important? |
It's entertaining. |
Why? What's entertaining about another person's difficulties in their life? |
wow.. so, we can't discuss the current affairs of our favorite sports stars.. I mean, we would be discussing Tiger right now if he just played the most amazing 18 holes.. if he just broke another golfing record..At least, I would.. Just because right now, the topic is unpleasant, doesn't mean we ALL have to pretend it's not happening and put tape over our mouths and not talk about it.. If it makes you uncomfortable, you certainly don't have to participate, but don't misunderstand.. I talk about Tiger all the time, not just right now.. |
How many threads on DPC have been created to highlight Tiger's achievements, charitable acts, and the good things he's done?
I never said you can't gossip, just that I don't really see the entertainment value in another person's difficulties. You've just taken offense, without really addressing my question. |
I'm not sure where you or Bear got from my message that I even indicated that I spend my time talking about Tiger ON THIS SITE.. Obviously, it doesn't happen very often...And, I can only speak for myself.. For me, the thread was created, the topic had been discussed and I was included, there was an update in the story, so I posted it... It's not as glamorous as maybe some think, but that really was the jist of it... I wasn't taken offense to what you said, I was taken aback.. I was surprised although, I shouldn't be...
I guess my question is, why when there is a subject someone doesn't care for in these forums, do they feel the need to question the people taking part in it, and then try to play that off as "they're just wondering" or this is some new scientific study they are conducting on human behavior.. As much as you wonder why we're bothering to talk about Tiger, I wonder why you're bothering to talk about this when it's clearly a subject you want no part in.. My point to you when I responded before was, we're just talking..My tone, although it can't be heard wasn't one of offense, I was being playful and not offended at all.. Can't people just talk & there not be a deep rooted, biblical or mythical, scientific or homeopathic or evil reason behind it.. ? Just wondering !!! :-)
Message edited by author 2009-12-03 10:09:47. |
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12/03/2009 10:18:54 AM · #75 |
Originally posted by kandykarml:
My point to you when I responded before was, we're just talking..My tone, although it can't be heard wasn't one of offense, I was being playful and not offended at all.. Can't people just talk & there not be a deep rooted, biblical or mythical, scientific or homeopathic or evil reason behind it.. ? Just wondering !!! :-) |
Right, gotcha. I didn't mean to imply you were being inconsistent or hypocritical or anything. I just wanted to make the point, which the spaz has underscored in response, that his issue is, the ONLY time we're talking about this particular (or most other) train(s) is when they go off the track. And I was trying to address why that's so.
Interesting read linked by JH on gossip as "social grooming"...
R. |
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