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04/21/2009 02:17:13 PM · #51 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by glad2badad:
When all is said and done, the photos that meet the "criteria" of 'Candid' for MOST people that are voting, and are well captured (composition, all the technicals, etc...), will be the top scorers. Like it or not, that's the way it is. In your comfort zone, or out of it, doesn't matter. |
Doesn't that kinda suck and make it all kinda useless? |
Not if your photo is one of the ones that meet the criteria of 'Candid' for the majority of voters. :-D
And no, it doesn't have to "suck". It's just the way DPC is. If you want to score high, shoot for what the audience (DPC voters) want. It is a contest site. |
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04/21/2009 03:21:18 PM · #52 |
To be unaware of the camera/photog, don't you first have to be able to be aware of it? So, a candid shot is taking a picture of someone who knows you are doing it, but forgot.
I'm not comfortable with the blanket statement that all little kids are incapable of being aware that their picture is being taken. It depends on if one of their parents is a photographer.
I'm wondering, if the use of the word candid could be extended to include the photographer. So that if the photographer can get far enough outside her routine as to loose conscious awareness of taking the picture, could that be considered a candid shot? Un-posed? of a flower? Not because the flower didn't pose but because the photographer didn't pose it?
Nobody can tell, just by looking at the finished print, where the photographer was with respect to her comfort zone at the time she pressed the shutter. The finished print might be a studio shot of a spotted pup in a red wagon & no threat to you but the photographer may be terrified of all dogs. Not even the most astute critic can make that determination just by looking at the print.
From reading these discussion, it seems most of the people voting will be locked in their own iodiomatic interpretation of the challenge & photography & voting down anything that doesn't measure up. The people most likely to vote are probably interested in voting because it suits a judgemental frame of mind. Some photography is never going to do well in a voting environment as it offers too many judgemental opportunities, but (as has been pointed out before) that won't stop it from being well-received elsewhere. |
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04/21/2009 04:24:35 PM · #53 |
| I hope 'kid shots' aren't looked down on in the challenge, I don't shoot people and I've never shot a child so its not my 'comfort zone', but I did submit one and am hoping to get some good feedback though! |
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04/21/2009 04:30:16 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
As far as I'm concerned, the concept "candid" pretty much presupposes the concept "unaware"; if your subject is aware of your presence, as a photographer, the image stops being candid. The only exception to this I can think of offhand is when the "candid moment" itself constitutes the subject's reaction to the sudden awareness that s/he is being photographed :-)
Take all this with a grain of salt BTW, I'm not being dogmatic, just musing...
R. |
Not to be argumentative but subjects can be aware of the camera and you can still get candid moments from them. |
I didn't explain myself well. You're right, of course; people can be aware there's a photographer in the room and still go on about their business as you go about yours. What I meant was, when the subject becomes aware that that s/he is in the process of being photographed and begins to interact with the photographer, then "candid" no longer applies. That's my general sense of it, anyway. With the exception as above noted.
R. |
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04/21/2009 04:33:01 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
As far as I'm concerned, the concept "candid" pretty much presupposes the concept "unaware"; if your subject is aware of your presence, as a photographer, the image stops being candid. The only exception to this I can think of offhand is when the "candid moment" itself constitutes the subject's reaction to the sudden awareness that s/he is being photographed :-)
Take all this with a grain of salt BTW, I'm not being dogmatic, just musing...
R. |
Not to be argumentative but subjects can be aware of the camera and you can still get candid moments from them.
I've shot candids at weddings, as a back-up and that's a good example of an exception but there are also many other situations where where cameras are shooting all over the place and candid moments can be captured. Candid moments are even captured on The Red Carpet.
I suppose another great example would be the lunch table at the Germany (Munster) GTG where there was nothing but camera activity, yet tons of genuine candid moments were recorded.
I agree that animal candids are a cop out but on the flip side animals do occasionally pose (in their way, of course) but still, very weak IMO as a candid choice. Babies, as well are a bit of a cheap out..IMO. I'll put it this way if you were trying to demonstrate your amazing skill as "Candid Photographer" animal and baby shots wouldn't win much attention or praise from me. Add, Sports to that list...but that's just me judging the essence of a candid as I see it.
I would give the dog shot posted above a 1, 2 or a 3 depending on my mood or how many animal shots I see. I tend to get agravated at that stuff after a while and my votes skew. Capturing a quality candid of a human being requires a good degree of skill, where capturing an animal "unscripted" is well...all they're about, morning, noon and night.
Here a primo candid moment and I'm sure the little girl was aware of the camera.
and a few of mine if you're interested
All for now... |
I agree. In my opinion the subject can be aware of the camera and even react to it so long as you the photographer is not directing any of it. I don't see how that is any different than the same subject reacting to something else while you're capturing it out of sight. In both instances the subject is just reacting to their environment in their own way.
Message edited by author 2009-04-21 16:34:23. |
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04/21/2009 04:33:07 PM · #56 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
From reading these discussion, it seems most of the people voting will be locked in their own iodiomatic interpretation of the challenge & photography & voting down anything that doesn't measure up. The people most likely to vote are probably interested in voting because it suits a judgemental frame of mind. Some photography is never going to do well in a voting environment as it offers too many judgemental opportunities, but (as has been pointed out before) that won't stop it from being well-received elsewhere. |
Well, I come to the challenge to see, and vote on, "candid photographs", right? And I'm gonna respond most favorably, in that context, to the ones that best fit my particular definition of "candid", right? I fail to see a problem there. It's the nature of the challenge: you throw at me what you think's a great candid, and I'll vote on whether I agree...
R. |
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04/21/2009 04:40:40 PM · #57 |
Well, the definition of a good model (to me) is someone who can work in front of the camera as though it wasn't there, even while interacting with the photographer, taking direction, remembering to not blink, etc. It's the people who have a kind of a horrified fascination with the camera, that want to mug for the camera, or keep their best side turned to the camera, that make a candid shot impossible. [eta] responding to  yanko.
Bear--yep, me too. People post their best shot & I give it my best shot in voting.
Message edited by author 2009-04-21 17:09:26. |
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04/21/2009 04:53:18 PM · #58 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
To be unaware of the camera/photog, don't you first have to be able to be aware of it?
From reading these discussion, it seems most of the people voting will be locked in their own iodiomatic interpretation of the challenge & photography & voting down anything that doesn't measure up. The people most likely to vote are probably interested in voting because it suits a judgemental frame of mind. Some photography is never going to do well in a voting environment as it offers too many judgemental opportunities, but (as has been pointed out before) that won't stop it from being well-received elsewhere. |
Talk about a blanket statement. :>)
However, it's also very true, but not everybody can be critically neutral in evaluating images in this type of competition format due to personal bias towards one type of image over another. Given the volume of images and the disparate personalities contributing in one way or another on DPC, any given image will typically score at or around the average just because of the nature of the rating system. Watch the comment threads for any particular challenge and it's very instructive - most are concerned about scores in the hundredths and thousandths of points in their spread rather than wholesale changes from 5 to 6 to 7 and back again. It's also an indicator that more is going on in the voting process than a fair and level playing field, but that's a subject for another thread.
To bring this back around to the subject of Candid, to be perfectly frank, candid means what ever the author of any particular image thinks it means. It's one of those more nebulous concepts in the English language because it can encompass so many different meanings. In this context, I think it would be safe to say that the subject matter (after flipping open my Oxford Dictionary of The Engligh Language) should follow the following definition: "2. informal or natural; especially caught off guard or unprepared; 3. openly straightforward and direct without reserve or secretiveness."
And that's how I'm going to approach rating and commenting on this challenge - candidly and openly straightforward. :>)
Later,
Tom
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04/21/2009 05:04:34 PM · #59 |
| I always take for granted that each photographer met the challenge to the best of their ability, so I vote as though every shot met the challenge. I do not necessarily advise this point of view for anyone but me, though. |
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04/28/2009 03:57:25 PM · #60 |
| I'm voting on the current Candid challenge. I have a feeling there are many first-time entries from students who joined DPC as a class assignment. :-/ |
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04/28/2009 04:11:51 PM · #61 |
Originally posted by pixelpig:
I always take for granted that each photographer met the challenge to the best of their ability, so I vote as though every shot met the challenge. I do not necessarily advise this point of view for anyone but me, though. |
I look at it this way - if it was entered, then the author had to believe in it in some fashion which means it automatically gets a 4 for participation. :>)
In the past couple of challenges though, there have been some images that, well to put it politely, were obviously only there to gather the fewest votes possible. :>)
Later,
Tom |
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04/28/2009 04:12:58 PM · #62 |
Originally posted by citymars:
I'm voting on the current Candid challenge. I have a feeling there are many first-time entries from students who joined DPC as a class assignment. :-/ |
Well, there goes that idea. :>)
I was thinking about that for a couple of classes I teach in high school and community college.
Maybe it's a bad idea. :>)
Later,
Tom |
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04/28/2009 04:22:07 PM · #63 |
Originally posted by Teafran:
Originally posted by citymars:
I'm voting on the current Candid challenge. I have a feeling there are many first-time entries from students who joined DPC as a class assignment. :-/ |
Well, there goes that idea. :>)
I was thinking about that for a couple of classes I teach in high school and community college.
Maybe it's a bad idea. :>)
Later,
Tom |
I actually think it's a good idea. Of course, under your direction, these kids should have a careful eye to detail, and might clean house around here. It's always fun to see some new points of view. |
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04/28/2009 06:24:47 PM · #64 |
| Candid: Capture a scene wherein at least one (alive) subject is unaware of the fact that the shutter is about to be clicked. |
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