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04/04/2009 12:06:22 PM · #1951 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Vaclav Havel, prize-winning playwright, was elected President of the Czech Republic after the breakup of the Soviet bloc. |
You're just proving my point.....
Playwright=literate!......8>)
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04/04/2009 12:13:32 PM · #1952 |
Shakespeare was an actor, who wrote plays so his troupe would have material to perform. As always, sterotyping ultimately doesn't ever quite work out.
FWIW, California also contributed Richard Nixon, who was considered quite literate ... |
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04/04/2009 12:35:32 PM · #1953 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Shakespeare was an actor, who wrote plays so his troupe would have material to perform. As always, sterotyping ultimately doesn't ever quite work out.
FWIW, California also contributed Richard Nixon, who was considered quite literate ... |
I'm not going to touch that one with a sixteen foot Czechoslovakian!
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04/04/2009 06:59:54 PM · #1954 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
Also, did you know that anti-gay hate crimes are way up in California because of Prop 8? That's what we're dealing with here folks. By whipping up fear and anger to deny me rights, you've also significantly increased the violence against my peers. You should read the gay news. It's a litany of beatings, killings, and property destruction. Good job, conservatives!
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Hmmm... this is unfortunate. I heard from a friend in LA though that crime is up in general due to the economy going so poorly there. Just last week his whole street and 6 others had every single car tire slashed, he's heard of more muggings, etc. Not saying the gays have anything to do with the economy but perhaps if there are some down on their luck people out there looking for someone to blame, the gays are an easy target in this political climate.
I'm glad about the good news you mentioned. I don't understand how these supposedly more conservative states are allowing gay marriage and California... well it really surprised me. I expected it here in Florida but not there. |
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04/06/2009 06:36:35 PM · #1955 |
| There are a lot of farmers in California. It's a really big state with two tiny little urban hotbeds. :) |
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04/06/2009 06:43:26 PM · #1956 |
| When thinking about how liberal California is think of the presidents elected form our state, Herbert Hoover, Richard Nixon and Ronald Regan. |
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04/07/2009 02:00:46 AM · #1957 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
There are a lot of farmers in California. It's a really big state with two tiny little urban hotbeds. :) |
tiny and little? lol. |
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04/07/2009 02:04:22 AM · #1958 |
so somehow I got engaged in a youtube fight over being gay and this 26 year old person doesn't even know how to form a sentence and has already compared gay relationships to incestuous ones and NAMBLA (man boy love) to the gay rights movement. Oh and this gem of a sentence? Can I even call it that?
"its being in love with your lust because the only reason why your with another woman is because you love pussy.. of course you can have love
for each other but how in the hell can you go before God and get marry and God has said its a sin for same sex to be together"
Why do I get myself into these "debates"? I think its because I can't wrap my brain around where these people COME from? Can anyone tell me? |
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04/07/2009 02:29:54 AM · #1959 |
My ol pappy used to tell me not to piss into the wind. Well not really, but you get the point. Save your breath.
When people start talking about "them gays" or to use your lovely quote "how in the hell can you go before God..." (I think that there is two sins, cussing and using the Lord's name in vain) you have to realize you are digging in rocky soil.
I care less about where they come from than how to keep them far, far away from my home and family.
I was in a march a few years ago protesting something or other (There were so many in the heady days of King George the W) I forget what it was for, or rather against, and there were some loud angry looking counter demonstrators along the parade route, and a pack of media ready to record the hoped for violence. The demonstration leaders set up a chant of "Ignore them, they're stupid, ignore them, they're stupid" drowning out the offensive language the small group were spouting, and diffusing the tension in the parade. Now when I get into disussions with folks who I can see are not open to debate, I stop trying and short cut my rising anger with a little internal mantra. Ignore them, they're stupid, ignore them, they're stupid. |
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04/07/2009 09:55:33 AM · #1960 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
My ol pappy used to tell me not to piss into the wind. Well not really, but you get the point. Save your breath.
When people start talking about "them gays" or to use your lovely quote "how in the hell can you go before God..." (I think that there is two sins, cussing and using the Lord's name in vain) you have to realize you are digging in rocky soil.
I care less about where they come from than how to keep them far, far away from my home and family.
I was in a march a few years ago protesting something or other (There were so many in the heady days of King George the W) I forget what it was for, or rather against, and there were some loud angry looking counter demonstrators along the parade route, and a pack of media ready to record the hoped for violence. The demonstration leaders set up a chant of "Ignore them, they're stupid, ignore them, they're stupid" drowning out the offensive language the small group were spouting, and diffusing the tension in the parade. Now when I get into disussions with folks who I can see are not open to debate, I stop trying and short cut my rising anger with a little internal mantra. Ignore them, they're stupid, ignore them, they're stupid. |
Oh yes. I understand your point completely. I just seem to have this disease of wanting to understand people, even really dumb people. That's why I majored in psychology but even though I'm not going forward with it as a career I still study people every day in my life, out in public, via the internet, etc. And when i come across people I just can't understand, I keep poking and prodding further just to see what comes out. I just always wonder... how did you get this way? And then I just feel sorry for them a little. But more sorry for the people that actually have their lives impacted by raging idiots like that. |
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04/07/2009 12:53:32 PM · #1961 |
Originally posted by escapetooz:
Oh yes. I understand your point completely. I just seem to have this disease of wanting to understand people, even really dumb people. That's why I majored in psychology but even though I'm not going forward with it as a career I still study people every day in my life, out in public, via the internet, etc. And when i come across people I just can't understand, I keep poking and prodding further just to see what comes out. I just always wonder... how did you get this way? And then I just feel sorry for them a little. But more sorry for the people that actually have their lives impacted by raging idiots like that. |
I'm like that, too, and it saddens, perplexes, and angers me that some people can be so stupid and hurtful.
It scares me how much power the people who are afraid have, and how badly some of them twist their version of science and theology to support their point of view.
What I don't get is that whole thing about how some treat same sex attraction as some sort of evil and/or contagious condition, and I will forever be flabbergasted that some people genuinely believe that being gay is a choice.
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04/07/2009 12:58:44 PM · #1962 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
In other news, Vermont has overwhelmingly passed gay marriage laws in both houses, unprompted by the courts, and has only a little more review and a possible Governor's veto to pass before it becomes law. Even with a veto, there's a really good chance of it passing anyway! The numbers in both houses are fantastic.
Vermont House Passes Same-Sex Marriage Bill 95-52
So, despite my mixed feelings about the political limbo my own marriage is in, it's a banner year for equal rights so far! |
Update to the Vermont issue, The Governor vetoed it and the house and senate in that state overturned the veto.
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04/07/2009 01:11:33 PM · #1963 |
Good news! The Vermont legislature just overrode the Governor's veto, and gays now have equal marriage rights by law!
Vermont Legalizes Gay Marriage
I'm incredibly happy about this! I was born and raised in Vermont, 21 years, and it's wonderful to see my first home repeatedly lead this country in the realm of social justice. Vermont has lived up to my fondest memories!
Of note, this time around it was the legislature that secured equal rights, not a court case or 'activist judges'. It's not the first time this has happened, similar laws have been passed twice in California, only to be vetoed by Governor Arnold, but this is the first time it's ever stuck!
Frankly, I think California should feel a little embarrassed that the fourteenth colony, a tiny little patch of independent (in the truest sense of the word), live-and-let-live pragmatists has now shown them up twice. Once with civil unions, the first in the country, and now with honest to god pro-marriage-equality laws, again first in the country! Vermont is truly in my heart, I am so proud to have grown up there. I'm not a joiner, it's really hard to get me going for a pep rally, my skepticism and sarcasm often get the better of me... but if there's any banner I would gladly wave all day, it's for my beloved Vermont. Cows! Cheddar! Ben & Jerry's! Maple syrup! Autumn! Cows! Church Street! Skiing! Mt. Mansfield! Almost a Great Lake Champlain! Cows! And gay marriage! Now if they could only do something about that snow. It's too bad the plan to dome Winooski never took off!
Between Iowa's support for equality in the heartland and Vermont's principled stand, I hope the pressure's really on the California Supreme Court! |
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04/07/2009 01:19:13 PM · #1964 |
A pretty amazing week folks! This just in, not a moment later:
D.C. Council Votes to Recognize Other States' Gay Marriages
"The D.C. Council voted today to recognize gay marriages performed in other states, on the same day that Vermont became the fourth state to legalize same-sex unions.
Domestic partnerships are already legal in the nation's capital, and gay couples married in other states are recognized as domestic partners when they move to the city. But today's legislation, billed as an important milestone in gay rights, explicitly recognizes them as married couples.
The initial vote was 12-0."
Iowa, VT, DC. They almost make my fear about having my marriage taken away bearable!
Message edited by author 2009-04-07 13:20:39. |
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04/07/2009 01:33:58 PM · #1965 |
| I hope we aren't painting everybody opposed to gay marriage with the broad strokes of "stupid", "really dumb people", "stupid and hurtful", and "raging idiots"... |
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04/07/2009 01:47:05 PM · #1966 |
| I'm not, DrAchoo... are you? |
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04/07/2009 01:50:52 PM · #1967 |
I don't think we are, just the type of people escapetooz was referring to from youtube.
eta; and that type ARE stupid, doesn't matter what they're arguing.
Message edited by author 2009-04-07 14:19:13. |
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04/07/2009 01:57:33 PM · #1968 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
I'm not, DrAchoo... are you? |
Of course not. I do note none of that language came from you Mousie.
Stupid people do exist, but they tend to fall on both sides of an agenda and rarely make up an entire side. |
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04/07/2009 02:30:01 PM · #1969 |
Be a little wary 'tooz of that link with the six biblical passage. While I'm not saying it's an opinion held by nobody, there are holes that you can drive the proverbial truck through. The writer obviously has as much of an agenda as anybody else and one needs to be wary in that regard.
Message edited by author 2009-04-07 14:49:53. |
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04/07/2009 04:40:40 PM · #1970 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I hope we aren't painting everybody opposed to gay marriage with the broad strokes of "stupid", "really dumb people", "stupid and hurtful", and "raging idiots"... |
Nope, just the folks (and they exist on the edges of of any issue) who are not open to reason or different approaches to an issue. While I disagree with some people's assumptions on this issues, as long as people are willing to listen to the other side, and engage in an argument that can shed light and increase understanding, then it is worth continuing the discussion. Since this thread is on page 80 now, and you are among the few who is still brave enough to be willing stand up for what is still the majority viewpoint in this country if not this thread, I don't think anyone is trying to paint you with a broad brush.
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04/07/2009 04:50:13 PM · #1971 |
| Thanks Brennan. It was a nice way to tell people to behave. The obtuse contingents of either side should probably just be ignored rather than provoking them or calling them names and causing collateral insult to the well meaning portion. |
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04/07/2009 05:04:05 PM · #1972 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I hope we aren't painting everybody opposed to gay marriage with the broad strokes of "stupid", "really dumb people", "stupid and hurtful", and "raging idiots"... |
My stupid and hurtful comment was aimed at people who act like same-sex attraction is something evil and/or contagious.
I probably should have used the word ignorant as opposed to stupid as it shows a woeful amount of ignorance to entertain such concepts.
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04/07/2009 05:36:31 PM · #1973 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
I hope we aren't painting everybody opposed to gay marriage with the broad strokes of "stupid", "really dumb people", "stupid and hurtful", and "raging idiots"... |
My stupid and hurtful comment was aimed at people who act like same-sex attraction is something evil and/or contagious.
I probably should have used the word ignorant as opposed to stupid as it shows a woeful amount of ignorance to entertain such concepts. |
Contagious? For sure. Evil? I'm guessing there could be opinions that would amount to this that are not "ignorant". Are you really saying that everybody who disagrees with you is "ignorant" on this issue? That's usually putting yourself out on a limb ready to be sawn off. |
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04/07/2009 10:32:22 PM · #1974 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Contagious? For sure. Evil? I'm guessing there could be opinions that would amount to this that are not "ignorant". Are you really saying that everybody who disagrees with you is "ignorant" on this issue? That's usually putting yourself out on a limb ready to be sawn off. |
Doc, I'm not going to argue with you and submit to your baiting.
You know perfectly well I'm not, nor *DID* I say that anyone who doesn't agree with me is ignorant, so knock it off.
If you have somne legitimate proof that homosexuality fits any valid definition of evil, fine, let's see it.
And don't even try to play semantics on valid, either.
And contagious????? Please!
You're a doctor, you know better.
ETA: I guess what pisses me off the worst is that I recanted somewhat in deference to your taking umbrage......I see that as a mistake now.
Message edited by author 2009-04-07 22:33:22.
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04/07/2009 11:30:59 PM · #1975 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
And contagious????? Please! |
I think you misunderstood me. I was agreeing with you on this front. Anybody who would consider homosexuality as "contagious" would be "for sure" ignorant. |
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