Fitna: Islam video - DPChallenge Forums

Nikon AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.4D IF

04/01/2008 08:00:20 AM · #1

This is a 15 minute video someone asked me to watch. It's on the 'extremist' side, but still very mind-blowing. I don't know if there are any Muslims on DPC who would care to comment on this video or correct anything. I know all religions have violent histories, but carrying them into the present in such a way is beyond me. I'm more curious as to what everyone else thinks (Without this turning into a rant)

WATCH ME!!

shalrath

Nikon D200

04/01/2008 08:27:46 AM · #2

Watch it if you will... but it's a very one sided view of the issue. I felt that it deliberately tried to persuade its audience that Islam was the root of this... there are and have been wars raged by extremists of every religion... I personally will kick back and enjoy life with those around me, regardless of race or creed... this film felt like propaganda, not like a balanced look at an issue.

My 2c

photodude

04/01/2008 08:37:39 AM · #3

Originally posted by heavyj:

I'm more curious as to what everyone else thinks (Without this turning into a rant)

WATCH ME!!

I can't tell you what I think without this being turned into a rant. And even then, there would be one member of the thought police (Site Council) that would take it upon themselves to deem my opinion non politically correct, or they dont agree and delete it or lock the thread (like this Previous Thread - I clearly violated "Goodwins Law" which much to my chagrin I couldnt find in the TOS).

I will say this, we are in a war of civilizations and we better start fighting like we are in a war.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

04/01/2008 09:14:51 AM · #4

Originally posted by shalrath:

I'd like to see the other side.

Quasimojo

Canon EOS-30D

04/01/2008 09:34:40 AM · #5

I watched 3-5 minutes of it before I closed it. Why? I found it to be nothing but pure Islamophobia. Now, I'm completely against any form of terrorism, and indeed some of the interpretations of the Koran by extremists, but the extended 911 footage killed the film integrity for me. Basically the message at that point that I took was "Islam encourages terror (quoting the Koran)" and then proceeded to link to 911 footage.

911 was a terrorist act carried out by a minority of nutters. Not all muslims are terrorists, although I would concede that there are a large number of muslims who are not actively involved in terrorist activity but who do not condone the actions of those who do.

But back to that film - it is irresponsible to make films like that, which is nothing more than hate from what I saw before I turned it off prematurely. It's like saying anyone from Belfast is a terrorist and we should all hate the Irish, on the grounds that in the 70s and 80s we were subject to repeated terror attacks by the IRA. It's not fair and it's not right.

Meeting hate with hate is wrong. Using intelligence and education is the key, not spreading more hateful images and messages.

N

HighNooner

Canon EOS-60D

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

04/01/2008 09:44:39 AM · #6

I am a Muslim and I am proud of My Faith. Do I think the criminal actions or vengeance reactions shown in the film could have been done by Muslims or people claiming the Faith? Some of them may as well be. But does the true face of Christianity reveal itself in Hitler's or the KKK's actions? I think not, or may be it does with the slaying of hundred of thousands of Muslims and Jews in the Spanish inquisition era? I still don't think so, and not even in the extermination of the many human soles in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, furthermore, are the Waco Siege or the retaliation by Timothy McVeigh a good Christian acts, they're definitely not.

Islam is a religion of mercy and understanding and coexistence, and the acts done by few twisted minded people shown in the film do not reflect on the true goodness and reality of this great religion.

I think the film maker has a personal stake in going against immigrants going into his country, because he cites terror acts examples and then jumps to population increase issues as his conclusion.

Makes you wonder!!

Have a good day all.

Message edited by author 2008-04-01 09:48:16.

AmeedEl-Ghoul

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

04/01/2008 10:09:31 AM · #7

Good day,
I find this post encourage hate and promote for all the bad feelings that we try to escape in life and come to DPC for pure joy and peace of mind.
I am totally against posting such Films in DPC, as I am moderated person that hates to involve politics and religious in my hobbies.
I am sure there are millions of sites this post would be fitting at. But not at a photography site.
I request this post to be removed.
Please keep DPC crap free.
Thanks.

smardaz

04/01/2008 10:30:57 AM · #8

Originally posted by EL-GHOOL:

Please keep DPC crap free.
Thanks.

Amen and Amen

inshaala

Canon EOS-7D

Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 EX DC HSM for Canon

04/01/2008 11:07:51 AM · #9

"We will show courage by watching it and acknowleding its fundamental truth."

Only truth i see in there is your (ie author's) truth... chinese proverb: There are three truths, my truth, your truth and the truth.

So yeah - without going into too much detail and "ranting"... take whatever you see with a pinch of salt and remember that every piece of footage you see is there for a reason, and that is the domain of the author's own views, in this film as it is with others.

04/01/2008 11:43:29 AM · #10

Originally posted by EL-GHOOL:

That's why I posted in General Chat. If you don't like politics, don't read or post. It's not about the hate being preached in the video, but trying to understand why. Engaging in a topic like this can be put to rest by locking it, but I don't see a line being crossed.

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

04/01/2008 12:00:46 PM · #11

Originally posted by EL-GHOOL:

Yes, ignorance is bliss, isn't it?

AmeedEl-Ghoul

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

04/01/2008 12:01:43 PM · #12

Originally posted by heavyj:

Itâ��s not really based on facts or reliable sources. Itâ��s basically a desperate attempt to prove the evil in Islam .This Movie is not discus worthy! Itâ��s the same crap Wilders have been telling us in the past. Fact is people find peace in religion, be it Islam or Buddhism. Religion is a personal thing, discussing it causes friction between people.
But what is really funny is, trying to understand politics/religious in a photography site!!!
regards,

idp

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

04/01/2008 12:14:02 PM · #13

We already know that people on this site can fall out about dnmc's and comments on models and other relatively trivial stuff.

How much more can we fall out about something like this ?

And how overwhelmingly weighted towards one side of the argument is the membership of this site ?

I am choosing to bite my tongue about what has already been said because I do not wish to perpetuate this discussion or cause offence, and because I am so incensed by some of what has been written that I would have difficulty making a temperate response.

There are plenty of sites on the internet where matters such as this can be discussed without damaging a pleasant community.

This ought to be a site where all are welcomed without their views on world politics being questioned or alluded to in any way.

Please can we lock this thread before the poison it contains spills out into the rest of the forums ?

04/01/2008 12:18:06 PM · #14

Originally posted by EL-GHOOL:

Originally posted by heavyj:
That's why I posted in General Chat. If you don't like politics, don't read or post. It's not about the hate being preached in the video, but trying to understand why. Engaging in a topic like this can be put to rest by locking it, but I don't see a line being crossed.

Itâ��s not really based on facts or reliable sources. Itâ��s basically a desperate attempt to prove the evil in Islam .This Movie is not discus worthy! Itâ��s the same crap Wilders have been telling us in the past. Fact is people find peace in religion, be it Islam or Buddhism. Religion is a personal thing, discussing it causes friction between people.
But what is really funny is, trying to understand politics/religious in a photography site!!!
regards,

It is not discuss worthy by whose standards? I was asked to watch this and hoped that someone would chime in on the topic. I see plenty of NON-photography discussions being done here. Why can't this be one of them? I think the DPC community has a wide spectrum of individuals from various backgrounds/religions and can give a more informative opinion on the subject than a site dedicated to ending a religion or encouraging aggression. I respect the opinions of those here, and therefor posed the question.

EDIT - If this is an uncomfortable topic, then by all means lock it. I didn't realize that it would get to a point where it couldn't be discussed. I didn't realize there were taboo topics when it came to religion or politics.

Message edited by author 2008-04-01 12:24:22.

04/01/2008 12:19:28 PM · #15

Originally posted by thelobster:

Why?

Is this thread special because it relates to islam?

Why should this thread be treated any differently than any of the other DPC threads on politically sensitive topics?

It might be better placed in rant, but locked and deleted?

There's an "Ignore Thread" button available for a reason.

idp

Canon EOS-30D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

04/01/2008 12:21:20 PM · #16

This thread is special because of the harm it can do and the hurt it can cause.

HighNooner

Canon EOS-60D

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

04/01/2008 12:33:07 PM · #17

I say keep it, I see no harm in that.

Message edited by author 2008-04-01 12:41:32.

citymars

Nikon D700

04/01/2008 12:44:04 PM · #18

Originally posted by Spazmo99:

There's an "Ignore Thread" button available for a reason.

So there is! I hadn't realized one could ignore an individual thread, I thought one could only choose whether certain sub-forums would show on their front page or not.
Anyway, this is not meant to be snide, but I'll test it starting with this thread. Just can't stomach it today. :-)

04/01/2008 12:44:10 PM · #19

Originally posted by HighNooner:

I say keep it, I see no harm in that.

Unfortunately I think the debate of keeping it and locking it has ended it without really locking it.

04/01/2008 12:46:10 PM · #20

Originally posted by thelobster:

This thread is special because of the harm it can do and the hurt it can cause.

How?

How is it any more so than any other DPC thread on any other sensitive topic?

WHere were you when the topic was Atheism vs. Christianity or any of the other numerous such discussions?

HighNooner

Canon EOS-60D

04/01/2008 12:47:41 PM · #21

Originally posted by heavyj:

Originally posted by HighNooner:
I say keep it, I see no harm in that.

Unfortunately I think the debate of keeping it and locking it has ended it without really locking it.

So no one can see it now!? But they can post to it?

04/01/2008 12:52:30 PM · #22

I mean that we've already divereted from what the original topic was meant to be about and it doesn't matter if it goes on or gets locked. It's now a fight for what is deemed suitable and unsuitable for DCP.

UrfaK

Canon EOS-650/T4i Rebel

04/01/2008 02:02:06 PM · #23

Personally speaking I don't think deleting or locking this thread is necessary. DPC has a lot of non-photography related, political threads though they're most often then not in the rant section. I wouldn't have seen this video [okay, so I killed my sound drive and didn't get to see it properly but I can pretty much guess] if this hadn't been posted here.

This video is just another opinion and not quite as ground breaking as they claim it to be. At least it doesn't pretend to be anything other then what it is. I was assigned a project on comparison on women yada yada in class once and I got the most amazingly insane information about muslim women which I knew was incorrect. The website claimed to be an authentic muslim website telling muslim men how to treat women and stuff.. I traced it back and it was linked to a very obviously non-muslim religious organization [bordering on seriously weird!].. At least the video maker has guts to express their opinion on your face...