| Author | Thread |
|
|
10/29/2007 03:52:32 PM · #1351 |
Jeb, I am sure I speak for the majority of Team Suckers when I say that we really do not want you to leave. You are a huge asset to this team and your insights and thoughts would be greatly missed.
I think the point Mary and I were trying to make is that most of us will never see the scores you are complaining about. To me at least, I muddle by with mid 5's and never make a single complaint. Of course that is just me and I don't wish to say that my way is right for everyone.
Please do not leave Team Suck, there is room here for all. I am sorry if my words came out in a hurtful manner. That was not my intention at all. |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 04:43:36 PM · #1352 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM  krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 04:49:07 PM · #1353 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Edited because among other things I can't do for sh*t is type. |
duuuuuuuuude - then stay here and practice your typing!
come on, you know how it goes here with scores. in general, your pic has to conform to a certain style, and occasionally, some breakout styles get faved, and they seem to often come from this group.
so you should just stick around and work on a way to get the voters to really dig YOUR style. btw - i think score is relative; it's really the percentage that counts :p
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 04:53:13 PM · #1354 |
Jeb, you might have reached a plateau that I sometimes think I've reached, other times not.
When a naif first arrives at DPC, there are any number of things s/he can do to get better at photography, and those same things will improve DPC scores. Therefore, one feels a certain sense of order and goodness to the world. Eventually, however, the Plateau is reached. The most basic skills are learned (or in my case, a subset of those skills), and the photographer is trying to grow beyond that.
At this point, the things you learn may not have any effect on your score. They might even have a negative effect. Does this invalidate your growth as a photographer? NO! But it means that DPC can no longer be used as a measuring tool for that growth.
Learning to score high at DPC is a limited skillset. Some are very happy in these narrow confines, but for the rest of us, we need to use other indicators. That's what OOBIEs are for, but that's just one example. More important are comments, learning how you personally touched someone. Beyond that is favorites, "Posthumous ribbons". The main idea is the same: look at individual connections instead of mass numbers. |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 04:55:07 PM · #1355 |
| oh and I forgot Side Challenges!!! but I shouldn't have to mention that to you! :) |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 05:38:00 PM · #1356 |
Originally posted by BAMartin:
Jeb, I am sure I speak for the majority of Team Suckers when I say that we really do not want you to leave. You are a huge asset to this team and your insights and thoughts would be greatly missed.
I think the point Mary and I were trying to make is that most of us will never see the scores you are complaining about. To me at least, I muddle by with mid 5's and never make a single complaint. Of course that is just me and I don't wish to say that my way is right for everyone.
Please do not leave Team Suck, there is room here for all. I am sorry if my words came out in a hurtful manner. That was not my intention at all. |
Barbara, absolutely on no level whatsoever was anything you said wrong, hurtful, unpleasant, or construed as such.
You have always been decent and kind, and your request was reasonable.
I just don't like getting attacked and it felt that way to me.
Mary, damn that came across harshly, and I just don't need a kick in the teeth with how screwed up my life is right now.
Not that you necessarily have to have any reason to know that, but it my life kinda sucks right now.
ESPECIALLY when I went out of my way to express my angst over whining at all, and that it was NOT about the score, but first the implication that my techniques were suspect by the validation request, and then the steady slide downward.
I AM NOT WHINING ABOUT THE SCORE!!!!
I am whining 'cause my hopes were dashed, because my score has done nothing but continuously go down, and because I can't help but be bummed about it EVEN THOUGH IT IS A GOOD SCORE!!!
And I specifically stated that.
I really thought that here was where I could have people read between the lines, and what I actually wrote, and understand that.
I mean, JEEZ!!!!!
I understand exactly what Jeffrey was talking about when he started a thread about hitting a wall, and I know EXACTLY how he feels and I don't think I'm anywhere near as consistently good as he.
I am used to a score stabilizing after a certain point, and honestly, I would assume that having my shot validated would have at least had that effect if not have it rise somewhat.
But no.....it kept going down, so I turned off the score and posted out of sheer frustration.
I tried my level best to state that it was whining, and to ask for it to be ignored if you want.
I know that this is virtual, I know this is supposed to be fun, and in the big picture it doesn't mean anything, but this stuff is important to me, photography is a passion of mine, and I have realized that I've probably reached the apex of my potential here.
Maybe it's a bad thing to have found my way here in the first place since in a way, it accelerated my rise to my own level of incompetence, but I have learned so much in the last year and a half, and I also feel that I am better than I would have been without all the help I've gotten. So I *am* grateful for the development that has gotten me to where I am.
Team Suck has been a haven because there is always a deeper look than the score, and that helps a lot.
One thing that is very real though is that the scores, and the ability to please a large group of people, who are photographers as well, is an index for gauging your own abilities, like it or not.
Catherine is a stellar example of what happens when the raw talent is combined with supreme dedication, natural talent, and good equipment.
I have neither the time or the money, or at this point, the talent to realisticly go any further. I have always harbored this hope in the back of my mind that naybe I could be a professional.
Dreams die hard, and yes, you have to take the good with the bad, the poetry of life and all, but I don't like it that my wife's parents are gone, I can't find a job, and I have to face that I've got little or no chance of photography being anything more than an expensive hobby for me. But I'm who I am, so periodically I will whine.
I am really excited and happy that Jeffrey and JuliAnne are getting due recognition and Svetlana's success being off the charts just fills me with happiness.
I guess this just means that I can't take criticism any better than I can accept my limitations.
So.....here it goes, I'll say it out loud. I am *NO* Larus, Librodo, or Shannon, I accept that and I'll never stop trying to learn to be that little bit better. I was just hoping that it was a little better than what it is. Is that so wrong?
ETA: STILL can't type.
BTW, this place is MUCH cheaper than a therapist, but if you guys really would rather I put a sock in it, I understand. I've been really down lately.
Message edited by author 2007-10-29 17:41:08.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 05:48:53 PM · #1357 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport. |
Okay.....I over-reacted.....sorry.
Besides, I don't have a passport.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:00:32 PM · #1358 |
Jeb... I haven't commented own your posts in the last several days, but...
I'll give you a little secret, most of the people here could easily have a business in photography and that includes you. Business is really about having a plan, implementing it, and improving on it. Sure the product (photos) you are selling matters but real aspect is your business savvy.
There are tons of really good and I mean superb photographers out there who don't make a dime because they have no business sense. Likewise there are numerous average photographers who are easily making a living. So if you really want to go into the business side of photography that is where you need to put your efforts, your photos are fine.
As for some aspect of your photography which I think are your high points are your controlled environment shots. Those of the piano player or the girls on the beach jumping are good examples. That type of shots you do well and I would concentrate on those. As for you candids, while good, I don't think it is your strong area and something you should focus on. Hey, that is my 2 cents.
There are different types of shooters on Team Suck, each having their own strengths. Some might not see it, but you can always learn something about your own photography from others, even those who don't necessarily score high or have style that is different from our own.
Cheers everyone and good shooting.
Message edited by author 2007-10-29 18:13:13. |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:02:59 PM · #1359 |
Yapp on, Jeb. I don't think you were ever meant to be a quiet person :)
FWIW I don't have a job either - I get government handouts and even some sort of assistance in looking for retraining sort of things, but they can't recognise me as being a carpenter on account of my paperwork doesn't match with that. If I just go out and look for casual work as a carpenter then I'm sort of breaking the terms of whatever it is that gets me a little sum in the bank account every fortnight, not to mention pension plans and all sorts, so I'm sort of stuck in limbo here. Have been for a couple or three years. Doc says depression. Whoopee doo.
Hey why don't we start a little thread of our own and drag each other down? Or not.
I think you're doomed to stay. Start planning Christmas :) |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:04:28 PM · #1360 |
I want to brag a little if that's okay... I'm SO proud of this photo. Photographer's comments have some detail about that.
And I wouldn't have been able to get the good focus with my old camera, so again, thank you Team Suck!!!!!!! |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:10:35 PM · #1361 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport. |
Okay.....I over-reacted.....sorry.
Besides, I don't have a passport. |
See, then you're stuck with suck. A passport is required to get out (at least that's what we tell the ones who want out; of course, they're never heard from again, but what would we know about that . . . nothing, nothing at all). I have a passport, but it has no pages left on which to stamp (much to the chagrin of the nice man at immigration when I went to the US last week, who was none too happy with me); no pages left. Hear that everyone? I'm not trying to get out, I'm staying *looks around nervously*
Stuck with suck.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:13:13 PM · #1362 |
Originally posted by raish:
Yapp on, Jeb. I don't think you were ever meant to be a quiet person :) |
I'm afraid that's not news. I'm afraid that I'm doomed to be a drama queen too, and I hate that.
Originally posted by raish:
FWIW I don't have a job either - I get government handouts and even some sort of assistance in looking for retraining sort of things, but they can't recognise me as being a carpenter on account of my paperwork doesn't match with that. If I just go out and look for casual work as a carpenter then I'm sort of breaking the terms of whatever it is that gets me a little sum in the bank account every fortnight, not to mention pension plans and all sorts, so I'm sort of stuck in limbo here. Have been for a couple or three years. Doc says depression. Whoopee doo. |
Yeah well......I don't want to get diagnosed......I'm afraid that if I went for a psych eval, they might not let me go home.
Funny about the paperwork thing......though I ran my own business for 17 years and weas moderately successful, it doesn't mean squat 'cause I have neither a high school diploma nor any trade accreditation that says that I can do what I've done my whole life.
Also, I really want to get out of the automotive industry anyway.
Originally posted by raish:
Hey why don't we start a little thread of our own and drag each other down? Or not.
I think you're doomed to stay. Start planning Christmas :) |
Thanks, Peter.....I needed a chuckle.
I really do try to stay upbeat......I've got so much more than so may people in this world, and something will happen given time and diligence; I have faith.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:14:50 PM · #1363 |
Don, this is the best description of the typical DPC arc that I have ever read, so I'm quoting the whole thing. It describes perfectly everything I believe about DPC and this new passion of mine (yes, even after 18 months, I'm a noob).
And Jeb, I've plateaued in terms of DPC scores only. I'm curious about how to push 'em higher here on DPC, but it's far from my only driver. Heck, look at some my entries that have most amused me (for example, point of view, Sept. '07 free study, fast food, procrastination), and you'll know that connecting is more important to me.
You have to choose what matters to you. If it's DPC scores, then study those. But if it's something else, go for that!
Originally posted by posthumous:
Jeb, you might have reached a plateau that I sometimes think I've reached, other times not.
When a naif first arrives at DPC, there are any number of things s/he can do to get better at photography, and those same things will improve DPC scores. Therefore, one feels a certain sense of order and goodness to the world. Eventually, however, the Plateau is reached. The most basic skills are learned (or in my case, a subset of those skills), and the photographer is trying to grow beyond that.
At this point, the things you learn may not have any effect on your score. They might even have a negative effect. Does this invalidate your growth as a photographer? NO! But it means that DPC can no longer be used as a measuring tool for that growth.
Learning to score high at DPC is a limited skillset. Some are very happy in these narrow confines, but for the rest of us, we need to use other indicators. That's what OOBIEs are for, but that's just one example. More important are comments, learning how you personally touched someone. Beyond that is favorites, "Posthumous ribbons". The main idea is the same: look at individual connections instead of mass numbers. |
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:20:03 PM · #1364 |
Originally posted by klstover:
I want to brag a little if that's okay... I'm SO proud of this photo. Photographer's comments have some detail about that.
And I wouldn't have been able to get the good focus with my old camera, so again, thank you Team Suck!!!!!!! |
GORGEOUS eyes!!!
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:21:19 PM · #1365 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
GORGEOUS eyes!!! |
Thank you! |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:29:55 PM · #1366 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport. |
Hey! How did I get dragged into this? :P |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:31:02 PM · #1367 |
Originally posted by levyj413:
Heck, look at some my entries that have most amused me, for example, fast food and you'll know that connecting is more important to me. |
Oh, I almost died laughing when I saw this!
I wished that I could have gotten a shot of deer running for that challenge, because a friend of mine calls them "Speed Beef".
But I didn't think about that 'til I saw your version of Fast Food! LOL!!!
Message edited by author 2007-10-29 18:40:56.
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:32:27 PM · #1368 |
Originally posted by krnodil:
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport. |
Hey! How did I get dragged into this? :P |
um... Scooter Libby gave me your name... |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:35:55 PM · #1369 |
Originally posted by klstover:
I want to brag a little if that's okay... I'm SO proud of this photo. Photographer's comments have some detail about that.
And I wouldn't have been able to get the good focus with my old camera, so again, thank you Team Suck!!!!!!! |
This is indeed a striking and beautiful image. :) |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:36:30 PM · #1370 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by krnodil:
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Consider this my resignation from Team Suck in any and all capacity, I won't whine here any more. |
Sorry, but your resignation has been rejected by the Suck Council. If you wish to appeal, please PM krnodil with details of your case and a copy of your last valid passport. |
Hey! How did I get dragged into this? :P |
um... Scooter Libby gave me your name... |
Wait...I have a cat named Scooter....HEY..... |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 06:42:39 PM · #1371 |
Originally posted by klstover:
I want to brag a little if that's okay... I'm SO proud of this photo. Photographer's comments have some detail about that.
And I wouldn't have been able to get the good focus with my old camera, so again, thank you Team Suck!!!!!!! |
Yes I noticed it earlier. Very impressive I thought. |
|
|
|
10/29/2007 07:26:41 PM · #1372 |
Originally posted by klstover:
I want to brag a little if that's okay... I'm SO proud of this photo. Photographer's comments have some detail about that.
And I wouldn't have been able to get the good focus with my old camera, so again, thank you Team Suck!!!!!!! |
STUNNING.
Oh - and it's a nice photo too
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 09:54:58 PM · #1373 |
Ok, levy owes me a new keyboard, or at least a coupon for cleaning diet coke out of the one I have now, the keys are starting to stick as I type. That is such a funny, refreshing, delightful take on fast food. Well done. :)
For Jeb, I think we all have been, and somewhat are in your shoes. My high score was one year ago (and not ribbon-worthy!) however I have reached the point where my scores are usually decent. My latest foray was to enter a photo that I liked, even though I knew it would get killed in the voting.  I am still happy with that picture, voters be damned. It is not usually my kind of style, so it was fun. Fun being the operative word.
I echo what levy said about there being lots of great photogs that fail due to lack of business sense, and the more successful ones are great at marketing themselves, not always the best photographers. The whole point is that self confidence goes a long, long way in this thing we call the photography business.
I have been half assed trying to get something going for years, but do not have the self confidence in my work to be able to feel good about marketing the heck out of it to be successful. I think I am getting closer though, thanks to realizing that being a good, or even a "great" photographer is a very relative thing.
Stick around Jeb, I like your work, and we cannot afford to lose another good Nikon shooter!
Ernie
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 09:58:49 PM · #1374 |
Hey everyone...I just have to climb to the top of the TS hill and shout "I am skipping work tomorrow afternoon to go and take pictures at a waterfall!!"
steps down off of hill. please resume normal activity. ;)
|
|
|
|
10/29/2007 10:09:44 PM · #1375 |
Originally posted by basssman7:
Hey everyone...I just have to climb to the top of the TS hill and shout "I am skipping work tomorrow afternoon to go and take pictures at a waterfall!!"
steps down off of hill. please resume normal activity. ;) |
have a great day Bassman7 wish i could do the same |
|
