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11/16/2006 12:35:25 PM · #26 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
I don't quite get why everyone says to get the kit lens, if you all expect it to be sold in a few weeks anyway. Particularly on a budget, why suggest they waste $50-$100 right at the start, so they can buy the same focal lengths again later ? |
I don't know of any other way of testing out the focal range.
... and I wasn't thinking a few weeks, more like a year. That's about a quarter a day. 12 cents a day if you sell it after the year.
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 12:36:37. |
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11/16/2006 12:46:42 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by hopper:
I don't know of any other way of testing out the focal range.
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Look at what they've shot before. Look at the subjects they like to shoot.
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11/16/2006 01:38:38 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by kirbic:
but on most items, |
I don't think it's a gross generalization.
What would be some of the "most items?" I didn't just pick something at random and throw out some numbers. I'm a serious price compare kinda guy. I look at just about every reputable online camera and accessory dealer, including Calumet, before I buy anything of substantial value. I have yet to spend one dime at Calumet because I find it cheaper elsewhere.
Right now I'm interested in buying a Canon 300mm F/4 IS and a 2x extender. Most places have them beat by $150+ and some by over $200. Maybe it's just the stuff I buy.
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11/16/2006 03:26:50 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
I disagree that the kit lens would blow away any point-n-shoot lens.
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I did not really mean any PnS lens, I meant most. I believe that most people moving to a DSLR for the first time are going to find the kit lens better than the lens on their previous camera. It has a nice combination of WA and TP, it is quiet and focuses quick enough. It may not have the best glass but if you learn to use the lens at its best, like shooting wide open at F8-F11, it is not a piece of crap. It is just not a $500 lens but that is not what the new user needs.
And I also agree with hopper, for a quarter a day it is a great way to test out focal ranges before you plop down $300 or more on a real lens. Then you can sell it and make back $50. At most it will cost you $50 for a lens that gives a good starting point. How can that be bad?
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 15:27:22. |
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11/16/2006 04:57:59 PM · #30 |
I have to disagree with Gordon's notion of not spending money on the kit lens. Up until a month ago I lived on the bargain basement DSLR set up. D50 kit lens 18-55, 50 mm 1.8D, and Nikon 70-300 mm cheapo zoom. Total cost of gear around $900. But you could get this same setup much cheaper as the prices drop, canon equivalent as well).For lighting I would use 500 watt worklights and a reflector made of aluminum foil. And before this I had a PnS. I doubt I would have learned anymore with a better lens, and I can now get the kit lens to do almost everything I want except through things out of focus without filling the frame and shoot in lowlight, but that is what the 50 mm 1.8 is for. My advice would be a similar canon setup and you can look on Fredmiranda to find a used 350D and still probably get an upgrade in lens' if you still had the desire to do so. Just my 2 cents.
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11/16/2006 05:02:03 PM · #31 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
...add a decent normal zoom, if you want to get a zoom... If you want a zoom get something like the 28-135 or similar. |
Keep in mind that a 28-135mm lens would be a normal zoom for a full frame camera. A better normal zoom for a 1.6 crop factor camera would be more like a 17-55, 17-85, etc.
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11/16/2006 05:17:59 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by TJinGuy:
And I also agree with hopper, for a quarter a day it is a great way to test out focal ranges before you plop down $300 or more on a real lens. Then you can sell it and make back $50. At most it will cost you $50 for a lens that gives a good starting point. How can that be bad? |
If you want to talk about the daily cost of ownership, why not spend $0.75/day and get a $300 lens? That's less than the cost of that candy bar you shouldn't eat anyway. Or drink a glass of water instead of the 20oz Pepsi from the vending machine and get a $500 lens?
Of course that's assuming that you only keep the lens 1 year. If you get a good lens and use it for 5 yrs, vs. the 1 year life of the kit lens, you actually will spend less/day than if you get the kit lens.
Message edited by author 2006-11-16 17:20:31. |
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11/16/2006 05:51:51 PM · #33 |
It is not that simple. I might have $100 to spend right now but I sure don't have $500 just burning a hole in my pocket. So you will say that I should wait to buy the better glass. Well I say screw that, I will spend the $100 right now, take pretty good pictures for many months while I save the $500. I might lose $50 in cash but I will have gotten to shoot for several months as a trade-off.
Here is my final thoughts:
- If you got the money to buy something better, then by all means buy something better.
- If you are really new to DSLRs then buy the kit lens and grow out of it.
- If you are poor and are trying to decide between buying a body +kit lens now or waiting many months to save for a body +nicer lens, then buy the kit lens and have fun with it while you save for something better. |
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11/16/2006 06:31:56 PM · #34 |
I would also get a circular polarizer, it is very useful.
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11/16/2006 06:54:47 PM · #35 |
I've said my peace ... i just thought I'd add for reference - the canon kit lens is sharper in the center than the 28-135 IS at all focal lengths and at all apertures. The edges stink, but the center is sharp (a trait also held by many popular sigma lenses). If a new dslr owner knows his/her images will be mostly for the web (downsized) and not printed ... you'll be hard pressed to see a difference in quality a lot of the time.
again, only my opinion ... and I respect the other opinions given, just don't agree. |
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11/16/2006 09:18:08 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by TJinGuy:
It is not that simple. I might have $100 to spend right now but I sure don't have $500 just burning a hole in my pocket. So you will say that I should wait to buy the better glass. Well I say screw that, I will spend the $100 right now, take pretty good pictures for many months while I save the $500. I might lose $50 in cash but I will have gotten to shoot for several months as a trade-off.
Here is my final thoughts:
- If you got the money to buy something better, then by all means buy something better.
- If you are really new to DSLRs then buy the kit lens and grow out of it.
- If you are poor and are trying to decide between buying a body +kit lens now or waiting many months to save for a body +nicer lens, then buy the kit lens and have fun with it while you save for something better. |
I was just highlighting the stupidity of the "quarter/day" cost justification.
Since image quality doesn't matter and cost does, you could save a bundle and make your first lens a homemade pinhole. I made one and I think it cost about $3 in materials. So, if you have that for a year, it will only cost you about a penny/day. |
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11/16/2006 11:16:29 PM · #37 |
is this an adult conversation or a sarcasm contest?
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by TJinGuy:
It is not that simple. I might have $100 to spend right now but I sure don't have $500 just burning a hole in my pocket. So you will say that I should wait to buy the better glass. Well I say screw that, I will spend the $100 right now, take pretty good pictures for many months while I save the $500. I might lose $50 in cash but I will have gotten to shoot for several months as a trade-off.
Here is my final thoughts:
- If you got the money to buy something better, then by all means buy something better.
- If you are really new to DSLRs then buy the kit lens and grow out of it.
- If you are poor and are trying to decide between buying a body +kit lens now or waiting many months to save for a body +nicer lens, then buy the kit lens and have fun with it while you save for something better. |
I was just highlighting the stupidity of the "quarter/day" cost justification.
Since image quality doesn't matter and cost does, you could save a bundle and make your first lens a homemade pinhole. I made one and I think it cost about $3 in materials. So, if you have that for a year, it will only cost you about a penny/day. |
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11/17/2006 12:17:07 AM · #38 |
Originally posted by hopper:
is this an adult conversation or a sarcasm contest?
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by TJinGuy:
It is not that simple. I might have $100 to spend right now but I sure don't have $500 just burning a hole in my pocket. So you will say that I should wait to buy the better glass. Well I say screw that, I will spend the $100 right now, take pretty good pictures for many months while I save the $500. I might lose $50 in cash but I will have gotten to shoot for several months as a trade-off.
Here is my final thoughts:
- If you got the money to buy something better, then by all means buy something better.
- If you are really new to DSLRs then buy the kit lens and grow out of it.
- If you are poor and are trying to decide between buying a body +kit lens now or waiting many months to save for a body +nicer lens, then buy the kit lens and have fun with it while you save for something better. |
I was just highlighting the stupidity of the "quarter/day" cost justification.
Since image quality doesn't matter and cost does, you could save a bundle and make your first lens a homemade pinhole. I made one and I think it cost about $3 in materials. So, if you have that for a year, it will only cost you about a penny/day. |
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Since the primary goal seems to be minimizing cost for a lens on a DSLR, I think the pinhole is a valid consideration.
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