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 11/09/2005 07:22:41 AM · #26
Then I guess I can be bitter that Peanut was robbed...ROBBED I say! ;)
 11/09/2005 08:25:57 AM · #27
Originally posted by laurielblack:
Then I guess I can be bitter that Peanut was robbed...ROBBED I say! ;)


Yes, you can! But I want to clear up my motives in posting about the winner. I'm sorry that I lost, but I'm not bitter at all about that.

I'm bitter that a crappy picture of a dog won, and in a "peculiar" way. The photo that was in the lead (dog with Santa Claus) was 100 times better than the winner.

I don't even recall seeing this photo in the top 10 until the last day when it surged up. It could have been there and I didn't notice it though. Does anyone remember?

But to take over the lead like that, it had to have risen at least 1 full point in the last 24 hours. As you know, it's difficult to stage a meteoric rise at the end, since you are fighting with all the previous votes.

I wrote them a note to check the data, and that's about all I can do. They don't let you see the post-decision stats, so it's impossible to see the final numbers.

Laurie, do you remember the circumstances of the win last week? Were you in first and then passed?


11/09/2005 09:57:24 AM · #28
The last time I looked at the voting when Peanut was in the running, he was in 2nd place (and had been there for like 3 days). Something's fishy over there, methinks. ;)
 11/21/2005 07:51:18 AM · #29
I am the owner of the Basset Hound who won the contest,fair and square, and was e-mailed by a friend about this post. I am frankly shocked at this post. This was an amateur photo contest, where the premise is to draw traffic to the site, by asking friends and family to vote for your dog. I voted 10s for the (2) dogs talked about in this post(lab with scully cap, and the beagle).My mom did too, infact the lab was her favorite picture. I am very innvolved in the Basset rescue community, and did not really start asking friends and family for votes until the last day.

And the dog isn't cute (at least it's hard to see that in the shot).

What kind of thing is that to say?
I'm bitter that a crappy picture of a dog won, and in a "peculiar" way. The photo that was in the lead (dog with Santa Claus) was 100 times better than the winner.
That dog's owner was soliciting online to vote "3s" for all the other dogs.

I am willing to bet that a large percentage of votes came in from the same IP. That should be easy for them to check anyway.
No the votes for my dog did not come from the same IP< and yes they can check, and do.

Funny thing is that I really was not that interested in the prize, and was actually going to offer it to who else, but the lab in the scully.

Just because your dog did not win, or my dog rose in the ranks, you draw the conclusion that there was cheating? I am surprised that a grown man would act in this manner.

I am a terrible photographer, but as I said the contest open to all amateurs included, it was for dog owners. That picture of my dog was taken (3) days after I got him, he was sleeping my office. It was the first time he had left my side and slept soundly since I got him. He came from rescue and was extremle sick, and had suffered from neglect/abuse, I have better photos of him but that was my favorite, it was a turning point for us.

I am so disappointed in what I have read here today, we won the contest fair and square and were very excited, and to read this is just crummy. I have forwarded a copy of this post to Photowow. Thanks alot.

Message edited by author 2005-11-21 08:16:13.
 11/21/2005 08:39:10 AM · #30
Thanks for sharing your concerns, Meredith.

You have to keep in mind that this is a discussion thread and all sorts of ideas and points of view pop up. People start these threads to generate discussion and also to vent.

As you know, this is a digital photography site. As such, the great majority of participants here are in the process of developing or already possess quite a bit of knowledge regarding the art of photography and as such, have some experience in judging images for their worth and accepting criticism. Most of the comments on the result of the above-mentioned Photowow challenge refer to the quality if the images that finished high. Most of these images are of very poor quality. Poor images have very little impact on the viewer, usually generating low scores. For an image to receive a high score from a voter, it must generate in that voter something that will compel him or her to give a high score. Just look at the winning images of the challenges here and you will understand what I`m talking about.

With this in mind, it is difficult for many of us to understand how the image of the basset hound won. It didn`t win on its photographic merit, so there MUST have been another reason. If a detailed bio of the image was available, you could say that the text accompanying the image could influence the voter, but that`s not the case here.

Another reason why the suspicions arose is that here at DPChallenge, most members, along with the site admins and volunteer site council, do their best to eliminate images from challenges that do not meet the fair-play standards that are described in the site's Registered User Agreement Registered User Agreement and Member Service Agreement. Being part of this community, it`s natural for us to reflect on the results of the Photowow competition that included photos from members of this site.

I may be overstepping my bounds here, but I do hope that you share this post as well with the managers of Photowow.com. I`m not bashing the site, just stating my point of view, that`s all.

Glad to see that you work hard to save dogs. Thanks for stopping by and sharing your point of view. Please drop by anytime to view and vote on images. Make sure to visit the Animals gallery.
 11/21/2005 09:03:11 AM · #31
It was not a professional photo contest, because a photo is of "poor quality" does not mean it does compel something in the viewer. It could be the dogs breed, the look, anything. I loved the boxer in the wig, because of his face, the image was blurry, but I was voting for the dog, as many people do. This is pure and simple case of sour grapes.
 11/21/2005 09:45:54 AM · #32
Originally posted by Merebeau:
It was not a professional photo contest, because a photo is of "poor quality" does not mean it does compel something in the viewer. It could be the dogs breed, the look, anything. I loved the boxer in the wig, because of his face, the image was blurry, but I was voting for the dog, as many people do. This is pure and simple case of sour grapes.


Did you read anything Beagleboy wrote? Yes, there are some sour grapes because we took the same standards we have here and took them over there so when a truly technically bad picture wins, especially at the last moment we question it. I saw the picture in question, I do rescue, I love Bassett Hounds and there was nothing about that picture that appealed to me technically or emotionally. That is what we look for when we look at photos, the technical and emotional impact on our senses. That photo meant a lot to you because you knew the story behind the shot, no one else did, so the question of questionable voting came up.

I put my Juniper in that same contest and he didn't even get into the top ten, but if you read his story posted to this picture: I bet he would have finished much higher.

Yes, it's amature hour over there, we are used to higher standards than that. DPC isn't a professional photo contest either but we still have standards, they evidently don't.

Deannda
 11/21/2005 10:15:25 AM · #33
Yes, it's amature hour over there, we are used to higher standards than that. DPC isn't a professional photo contest either but we still have standards, they evidently don't.

Your site is for photoraphy enthusiasts, whether it is professional or not. The photowow contest is for pet owners whether they are professional photographers or not. No one is holding themselves to photographic standards.

One did not need to know my dog's story to vote for him, or to be a friend of mine. It is conceivable to you that someone thought my dog was cute and voted for him? Just because no emotions were "stirred" in you, does not mean others did not like my dog. You should put your ego in check, as I stated this was just a fun contest and the analysis that is going on here is simply ridiculous.
 11/21/2005 10:17:15 AM · #34
Originally posted by Merebeau:
. You should put your ego in check,


Touche'

Deannda
Pot meet Kettle, Kettle meet pot :)
 11/21/2005 10:26:42 AM · #35
Originally posted by Merebeau:
...the analysis that is going on here is simply ridiculous.


I agree...it's almost as ridiculous as a person registering on a photography website with no interest in photography itself, simply to stir up a hornet's nest over a contest that the person won anyway.
 11/21/2005 10:32:35 AM · #36
I had to register in order to post.
And I did not come here to stir up a hornet's nest, only to defend myself and adress this issue. This is a public site, and I was basically accused of cheating on this public site, and told my dog was not cute. I never spoke badly about anyone's dog or their picture, unlike the posters here. Do not draw conclusions about my interest in photography either.

Message edited by author 2005-11-21 10:34:00.
 11/21/2005 10:38:39 AM · #37
It's not about winning or losing a photo contest. It's about winning or losing a popularity contest. Neil and Laurie, you guys just didn't beg up enough voters. To be honest, I'm a little surprised that either of you are surprised that the results of a contest that's based entirely on begging people to come vote for your photo don't reflect the photographic quality you expect. Time to get on the workplace listserv!
 11/21/2005 11:00:47 AM · #38
This week's winner:


All in good fun, all in good fun...
 11/21/2005 02:16:56 PM · #39
Originally posted by Merebeau:
I am the owner of the Basset Hound who won the contest,fair and square, and was e-mailed by a friend about this post. I am frankly shocked at this post. This was an amateur photo contest, ...snip..And the dog isn't cute (at least it's hard to see that in the shot).

What kind of thing is that to say?
I'm bitter that a crappy picture of a dog won, and in a "peculiar" way. The photo that was in the lead (dog with Santa Claus) was 100 times better than the winner.
That dog's owner was soliciting online to vote "3s" for all the other dogs.

I am willing to bet that a large percentage of votes came in from the same IP. That should be easy for them to check anyway.
No the votes for my dog did not come from the same IP< and yes they can check, and do.

Funny thing is that I really was not that interested in the prize, and was actually going to offer it to who else, but the lab in the scully.

Just because your dog did not win, or my dog rose in the ranks, you draw the conclusion that there was cheating? I am surprised that a grown man would act in this manner.

I am a terrible photographer, but as I said the contest open to all amateurs included, it was for dog owners. That picture of my dog was taken (3) days after I got him, he was sleeping my office. It was the first time he had left my side and slept soundly since I got him. He came from rescue and was extremle sick, and had suffered from neglect/abuse, I have better photos of him but that was my favorite, it was a turning point for us.

I am so disappointed in what I have read here today, we won the contest fair and square and were very excited, and to read this is just crummy. I have forwarded a copy of this post to Photowow. Thanks alot.


Meredith, I am sorry that I offended you. I think Denis (BeagleBoy) provided an excellent DPC perspective on the contest to help you understand where we were coming from, so I won't try to argue point by point. I am sure your dog is cute in person, or in a good photo, and has a terrific story. But none of that comes through when we vote, and as I said in my complete posts, I was just surprised and suspicious that your photo could win the contest where there were so many good photos and everyone was playing by the same rules of gathering friends to vote.

Yet, after reading the site instructions carefully, I could see a way one could clearly circumvent the voting restrictions. After seeing your photo and it's last minute rise, I just concluded that someone must have done that.

Again, the reason I posted about the results here was more related to exposing what I thought was a flawed contest methodology/site than to try and ridicule your photo. I did understand that it was not a regular photo contest, but even in the face of that, I had trouble seeing how someone could rise so quickly at the end of the contest period, given the incrementally lower effect each new vote has as the total number of votes rises. I wrote a note to the site admins suggesting they check IP addresses, but never received any reply.

Thinking more about it, one explanation for the quick rise could be that your photo didn't have many votes until the last day(s), and if that's the day your photo was hit most by family and friends, then you would have risen quickly. And of course, y views on your photo are simply my opinion, tainted by the "presentation". Others may have looked beyond the presentation side of it and simply voted for the "dog".

So once again, I apologize for any grief my remarks have caused you, and offer you my congratulations for your win.

11/21/2005 02:54:16 PM · #40
Mr. Shapiro,
I accept your apoligy , and am saddened that what is supposed to be a "fun contest" sparked any type of controversy. Your remarks did hurt my feelings, not a a photographer but as a dog owner. It is sad to me that you assume the worst about people, that is just not a good way to live. I am also a competitor, but an honest one. I did not cheat in any manner. I only voted once for my dog, and did not "low vote" other dogs, infact I gave your dog a 10,and posted the below in my Basset Hound forum I did however use strategy, I did not start really asking for votes unitl the last day, although we were in the top 10 from day 2. I did not want to be seen as a threat and thus get low votes. I figured we would be the dark horse, or dark Basset if you will. A "10" vote equalled .2, so it was easy to figure out what was needed to win. My Aunt actually cast the winning vote.
What I posted in my forum cut and pasted:

We have moved into 3rd place, we are in the home stretch, I'd say we need about 25 more "10s" to pull into 1st, but I can tell you right now, the lab with the scully should probably win, although Beau is my favorite and most of yours too, it is because you know us and know Beau, that picture of the lab is just perfect for the portrait and his owners(as far as I know) were not like the others who encouraged people to give other dogs low votes.[

I guess that is all I wanted to say.
after edit:
No I guess I have one more thing to say, yes I guess this contest was a "popularity contest", the whole premise is to drive traffic to the site. I asked for votes just as the members did here, should I be faulted because I got more votes?

I do not think my presentaion was "tainted". You may look at photos with a "photographers eye" but many people do not. Although you may be able to appreciate a photo on a deeper level, you may be mssing the simpler through all the technical flaws. Many Basset Hound owners, and dog owners alike have seen the photo I submitted, they see it with a "dog lovers view", they appreciate his ticking, his length, the size of his paws, the length of his ears and snout, his markings(particularly his heart shaped marking).

Message edited by author 2005-11-21 15:40:09.
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