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12/17/2004 01:22:18 PM · #1 |
I don't want this thread to turn into a film vs. digital debate, but I fear that it will.... Here it goes anyway:
I've been a very amateur digital photographer for close to 4 years now. I have two film SLR's that I almost never use. I find that I don't shoot with film because I don't want to 'waste' it. I've gotten so used to shooting with digital for so long that it is very hard for me to shoot with film. I've gotten used to being able to compose the shot, shoot it, make a small change, shoot it again, and so on...
I will often take 100-300 shots on an afternoon walk, but I find myself hesitating when shooting with film. Afterall, I only have 24 shots to a roll, and it seems so much more permanent. I can't just delete it and reshoot!
Has anybody else out there gotten too used to digital to go back to film? Do any of you film shooters process their own film? I'm taking my first B/W film photography class in January, and I don't know if I'll be able to get over my digital affliction!
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12/17/2004 01:29:52 PM · #2 |
I've been thinking about getting a film body for winter use to avoid some of the cold weather battery issues with digital. But, what's stopped me has been the very thing you mentioned. I've been trying to get my Dad to join me on outings with his Nikon FTn, but he won't come for the same reason you cite.
I also fear exposure... The meter is a great starting point, but the histogram tells all. I can tweak a slightly overexposed shot as soon as I see where it fell. That's tough to do without a histogram. Not always an issue, but sometimes it takes a few shots to get the histogram where you want it, especially when you're pushing the envelope on EV range.
I think it's difficult to go back to (or start using) film once you grow accustomed to digital's spoils, but I'd like to believe otherwise.
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12/17/2004 01:33:33 PM · #3 |
I just completed Photo 1 (bw film photography) at the community college, got an A, even though I processed a grand total of 2 rolls and enlarged about 8 photos. However, I have a fat portfolio of digital prints all taken with my D-Rebel. My professor's closing remarks when discussing my grade were along the lines of, "Don't bother with film, digital is the future and you've definitely got the hang of it."
Message edited by author 2004-12-17 13:34:42. |
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12/17/2004 01:37:36 PM · #4 |
Interesting point. I'm shooting my first wedding in many years in a couple of weeks. I'll be using my 10D, but have a Canon 650 film camera as backup. I want to use the 650 for a few of the shots, and have a roll of film in the camera now, to re-acquaint myself with the film experience before the main event.
It's tough. I know exactly what you mean. It seems that years ago I never had such a feeling. And, perhaps more than fear of wasting the film, I don't know if I'll be able to stand waiting to see the results...
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12/17/2004 01:40:00 PM · #5 |
I guess I'll find out. I have a good friend in my program at school with an Elan 7e, and naturally we've been taking a bit of shop. We're likely going to Barcelona next year for school, and with that we've planned to shoot both film and digital when we're there, trading off bodies. The idea is that we present a gallery showing of photos of Spain to the faculty when we get back. I was recently looking at getting a point-and-shoot, and yet worried that I'd not get the same quality as my 10D. I ended up buying a Contax TVS film camera with a 28-56mm Zeiss T* lens. It has aperture priority, something I almost always use. I also wanted a 28mm focal length, as I find wide to be better than tele for travel.
I find these days I shoot more with a film style than a digital one. I carefully consider shots and no longer shoot 200 photos in a casual (non-sports) outing. Also, I'm interested more and more in making large prints. This led me to consider film.
As my friend and I are likely to buy a negative scanner together, I figured that I'd get the quality and size needs covered with the Contax, with little compromise from either. My 10D is often too big to take everywhere but I anticipate that the Contax will go almost everywhere with me.
Message edited by author 2004-12-17 13:41:28.
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12/17/2004 01:41:19 PM · #6 |
I can shoot either way. The reason I prefer digital is not really because of 'waste' issues with film. I like the control I have over my digital images. If I had a darkroom and the skills to use it, I could produce the same results from film that I do from digital. It just takes longer and costs more money.
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12/17/2004 01:41:24 PM · #7 |
I took a nature photography class at a local community college a few months ago - the instructor wanted us to use slide film. I hadn't used film in maybe 4 or 5 years. My only non-digital camera is my dad's old Minolta Rangefinder he got in the 50s. It has no automatic anything, not even a light meter.
Anyway - it turned out to be great. I started paying a lot more attention to my framing and exposure - I learned a lot about photography and I think it has carried through to digital (though my DPC scores don't reflect it). With the rangefinder I was getting a MUCH better keeper % and even a "wow" or at least near "wow" shot from every roll.
So - I'd say for concentrating on photography basics it can be a good tool to go back to film, but for non-class - I'll take my D70 anyday. |
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12/17/2004 01:48:11 PM · #8 |
And if you really want to find out how you'd fare with film, it's easy to do. Take a piece of duct tape and stick it to your LCD! Wait until you get home to look at your photos. Post-processing doesn't count, they do that with film too. I think most digital shooters would be pleasantly surprised at their competence with negative film. The relatively narrow exposure latitude of a DLSR (especially when you're just shooting jpegs) is much more like slide film and we've been trained very well to pay careful attention to exposure.
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12/17/2004 01:55:23 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
And if you really want to find out how you'd fare with film, it's easy to do. Take a piece of duct tape and stick it to your LCD! Wait until you get home to look at your photos. Post-processing doesn't count, they do that with film too. I think most digital shooters would be pleasantly surprised at their competence with negative film. The relatively narrow exposure latitude of a DLSR (especially when you're just shooting jpegs) is much more like slide film and we've been trained very well to pay careful attention to exposure. |
Slide film naturally enhances color saturation much more than negative film. It post processes itself :)
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12/17/2004 02:00:21 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by Plexxoid:
"Don't bother with film, digital is the future and you've definitely got the hang of it." |
That's too funny :) |
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12/17/2004 02:17:28 PM · #11 |
Because I have been shooting loads with my 300D its made me want to shoot film again. I appreciate my film camera more now then when I bought it back in 1976. Ok its a bit bashed about but its still great to use and it does have a pin sharp f1.4 55mm lens. Looking through the viewfinder of the film slr took a bit of getting used to after using the 300D so much but you soon adjust.
//www.photosite.me.uk/44702.html
Message edited by author 2004-12-17 14:18:45.
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12/17/2004 02:31:10 PM · #12 |
I have 3 medium format cameras including a Holga and 2 35mm rangefinder cameras. They rarely get used. It's not a matter of quality but a matter of speedy results. I like to see what I just shot right after I shot it. I'm the "I want things now, not later" type. Like John mentioned earlier, I also like the fact that I have more control over my digital pics because I don't have a darkroom or even the desire to do my own processing, it just doesn't appeal to me. I also think of on a cost level. It doesnt cost me anything to shoot and process 300 digital pictures but it would cost me 175 USD to buy and develope 25 rolls 120 film which comes to the same amount of shots. That doesn't inlcude printing. Of those 300 shots only a handful are gonna be good so that's a lot of money wasted. I'm not very good at math but even I can see the better choice. With that said, I keep all my film cameras loaded and I take a shot or two with each every now and then, just for fun. Just my 2 cents.
June
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12/17/2004 03:18:51 PM · #13 |
Like others in this thread, I have recently completed a few courses at a local community college (one in color slide, the other in B&W). For the two years before taking these courses, since purchasing a D60, I had not shot any film at all.
Returning to film in a structured class environment was really refreshing. Like others here have mentioned, shooting film forced me to concentrate harder and pay more strict attention to composition and exposure. Not being trigger happy turned out to be a good thing.
As my first exposure to slide film, I was also amazed at how over-the-top colorful and contrasty films like Provia and Velvia are, and how they can bring scenes to life. I will be shooting slide film in another class (Wildlife) in the spring, and am looking forward to it.
Having said all that, I still prefer to shoot digital most of the time - I prefer that medium for the flexibility it offers me in producing images for print or the web.
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12/17/2004 03:21:50 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by cghubbell:
sometimes it takes a few shots to get the histogram where you want it, especially when you're pushing the envelope on EV range. |
I know that I've completely relearned to see EV levels differently with my 602. They are much, much narrower than I'm used to working with, which makes it that much more difficult for my beloved landscape shots :)
Originally posted by cghubbell:
I think it's difficult to go back to (or start using) film once you grow accustomed to digital's spoils, but I'd like to believe otherwise. |
agreed ! :) we'll see once I start rolling film through my cameras. |
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12/17/2004 03:26:03 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
I find these days I shoot more with a film style than a digital one. I carefully consider shots and no longer shoot 200 photos in a casual (non-sports) outing. Also, I'm interested more and more in making large prints. This led me to consider film. |
I've actually found that to be true as well. With time, I'm taking fewer shots, but those shots are closer to what I want when I start my Post Processing.
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
As my friend and I are likely to buy a negative scanner together, I figured that I'd get the quality and size needs covered with the Contax, with little compromise from either. |
Do you have experience with negative scanning? I've thought about gathering some of my old negatives and scanning them to work on them, but I just haven't done it yet. My dad has some kind of attachment for his HP scanner, but I haven't used it yet. |
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12/17/2004 03:31:04 PM · #16 |
I have a Nikon F100 sitting here and I never use it now. I learned enough about exposure using a film camera that I probably could do okay in most situations, but there were still a lot of photos I was unhappy with, or I had ruined, shooting film. And of course, I had to pay for them to be developed.
I do like the instant feedback with digital, to know I got the shot I wanted. I like knowing I have the picture, rather than just hoping. Especially on vacation, or somewhere where it could be a once in a lifetime opportunity. I don't want to come home from a trip, have my photos developed and find out I suck worse than I even feared.
Plus having a digital file right out of the camera opens the door to a lot more possibilities after the shoot to make it look even better. For me there just isn't any going back. |
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12/17/2004 03:31:40 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by joebok:
So - I'd say for concentrating on photography basics it can be a good tool to go back to film, but for non-class - I'll take my D70 anyday. |
I think that is my ultimate hope.. to not be so quick to get a shot, and spend a little more time getting the exposure and the compostion right the first time.
...and now I have to get a bigger bag for my digital and 35mm cams and lenses :) How evil is this! |
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12/17/2004 03:32:04 PM · #18 |
I kept trying to make film work, it was all I used for 20 years. But my digital photos kept looking better then my film one. I bought a film scanner, a DiMage Scan Dual III, and this help get some of the images to look better then what I got back from Costco but still not all that good. I finally bought a roll of 50 iso film, Velvia I believe, and did a shoot out between the digital and the film, the digital won. I have a friend who still shot film and felt that it could be better then my digital so we did a shot out, he has a better scanner, some Nikon thing. He used his best choice for film and we shot the same photo, he was using his favorite prime lens and I was matching with my zoom . We printed 8 x 10 from each camera and whereas it was close even he had to admit the digital looked better.
The only way I would ever shoot film again with be as large format, otherwise I can get every thing I need from my digital. I doubt that I will ever shoot film again.
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12/17/2004 03:34:32 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by jimmythefish:
And if you really want to find out how you'd fare with film, it's easy to do. Take a piece of duct tape and stick it to your LCD! Wait until you get home to look at your photos. Post-processing doesn't count, they do that with film too. I think most digital shooters would be pleasantly surprised at their competence with negative film. The relatively narrow exposure latitude of a DLSR (especially when you're just shooting jpegs) is much more like slide film and we've been trained very well to pay careful attention to exposure. |
I tried that for a while. The 602 has the option to not post-view the shot you just took. I tried that for a week, but it drove me nuts!
I agree about the EV range, though. I have a shot of my puppy that I got with my 35 last week that would have been impossible with my 602. I forgot how detailed shadows can be with 35mm :) Of all the thousands of puppy shots I took with the 602, this one film shot of my puppy is the only shot I have hanging on my cube wall at work! |
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12/17/2004 03:40:57 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by rscorp:
I don't want to come home from a trip, have my photos developed and find out I suck worse than I even feared.
Plus having a digital file right out of the camera opens the door to a lot more possibilities after the shoot to make it look even better. For me there just isn't any going back. |
well, a quick peek at your portfolio here shows that you don't have much to worry about with sucking! Those are some great Fall and portrait shots!
I haven't gotten into film B/W photography, ever, but I do like the medium. plus, that gives me the chance to work out the development out of the camera, kind of :)
....agreed though, I would never go 100% film, Ever! |
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12/17/2004 03:50:26 PM · #21 |
i am currently enrolled in a b&w photography class and love it. developing your own pictures is the best part, the waiting, the adjustments, the whole process is so much fun.
it is hard to make a transition from digital back to film. they are two completly different forms of photography. however, with film, you rarely find yourself taking snapshots, or poorly thought out shots. Every scene, and shot must have some though put into it to make it come out perfect.
just my thoughts...
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12/17/2004 03:52:53 PM · #22 |
my digital camera uses a new kind of rewritable film. i think it's called a CF card ;}
honestly though - i shoot about 1/100th the shots on film as on the digital these days.
i mainly use the film for BW - and can develop them myself.
Message edited by author 2004-12-17 15:53:17.
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12/17/2004 04:27:51 PM · #23 |
I prefer shooting film than digital, as the B&W tends to be nicer and developing your own prints is infinitely more fun than sitting down in front of a computer screen.
Having said that, I need to edit most of my images - so in order to get half decent shots the majority have to be tweaked in photoshop so digital wins.
One day I really would like to return to B&W film, and develop some of my own shots like I used to back in college.
I would suggest keeping your digital, and using that to aid your film shots. I know a few film lovers who shoot in digital to check everything before going in with the film shot.
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12/17/2004 04:49:32 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by jonpink:
I would suggest keeping your digital, and using that to aid your film shots. I know a few film lovers who shoot in digital to check everything before going in with the film shot. |
Wow...I had this exact thought this past weekend! That's a lot of equipment to have around my neck!
One or two bags, two cameras... lenses...yikes. I'll need a dude just to stand there with a bunch of stuff so that he can hand me things when I need it :) |
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12/17/2004 04:50:15 PM · #25 |
| Thanks all..it is good to know that I'm not just paranoid :) |
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