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05/25/2004 05:08:08 PM · #1 |
I'd love to be able to use 'perspective' and lens correction tools in challenges. I got a response from a Site Council member (EddyG) in an earlier thread. He indicated that it might be legal in advanced rules, but not basic. I was hoping more people might chime in and give a definitive ruling.
I'm not looking to create any cool effects. I just want to remove the problems most normal lenses have, and to make straight lines come out straight. Think of it as a smarter rotate.
When shooting buildings without a tilt/shift lens, 'perspective' correction really makes a difference.
Sorry to be a pest, but I promise I won't ask again for a long time... :^)
Thanks,
Ara
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05/25/2004 05:43:12 PM · #2 |
Sounds like your question was answered by EddyG several days ago.
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05/25/2004 06:03:13 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by StevePax:
Sounds like your question was answered by EddyG several days ago. |
Thanks. But, I'm also trying to see what other SC members think lest his opinion ends up being in the minority.
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05/25/2004 08:31:38 PM · #4 |
I think pin cushion and barrel distortion correction and the like should be legal under the advanced editting rules. Surely if it is legal to clone out unwanted elements, giving something a natural looking 'perspective' should also be legal.
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05/25/2004 09:24:44 PM · #5 |
I can't see something being DQ'd under advanced editing rules for distortion or 'perspective' correction. The rules prohibit copying/cloning of elements, and discourage removal of major elements. They are mute regarding correction of distortion.
The basic editing rules are something different. Under the current rules, the criteria has been "were pixels moved relative to other pixels?" If the answer is "yes", the technique is not allowed. I'd like to think of 'perspective' and distortion correction as "preserving photographic integrity", however that's not the current interpretation. I'm just one voice on the SC, but you now have my opinions. I will bring the thread to the attention of the SC, however.
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05/25/2004 11:02:55 PM · #6 |
With about 40% of the SC weighing in so far, the opinion is... 'perspective' and/or distortion correction is legal under advanced editing, but not legal under basic editing.
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05/26/2004 01:40:22 AM · #7 |
Lenses are available that offer "'Perspective' Control" technology. It is legal to adjust for 'perspective' inside the camera, but these features are pretty worthless for a digital photographer. So I also think it should be allowed in the basic rules. How many times can the SC vote on the same issue??? Just keep voting until sombody gives in. ;)
OH, better yet, I request a re-vote; only because there are new SC members that may sway the vote. :P
(Congratulations by the way, to the new Site Counsel members)
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05/26/2004 01:51:04 AM · #8 |
Lense induced aberrations are annoying.
Lense aberration correction is similar to noise reduction and noise reduction software is allowed in basic challenges. But the rules are kinda funny like that sometimes.
For example, if your camera is capable of double exposures that is allowed, even in basic challenges. But combining multiple images with software to achieve the same effect is not allowed even in advanced editing.
Go figure. :)
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05/26/2004 01:52:44 AM · #9 |
I agree that barrel distortion and 'perspective' correction should be allow to be corrected. It will just make a good photo more prefect.... and less critique for that !... anything that DONT change the integrity of the picture look to me OK... but i am just a photo participant not the supervisor of the site... so i have to shut up and live with rule.... I tend to think that people are too picky about little insignifiant detail, but the more your picture is close to prefect, more they have to see the little problem or detail.... rules is the rules, if i dont like it, i will just quit to participate to open challenge and pay for the advance challenge... but the picture here is WAY better than the best i can do, so i stay here... with you !
:-)
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05/26/2004 11:27:11 AM · #10 |
Originally posted by kirbic:
With about 40% of the SC weighing in so far, the opinion is... 'perspective' and/or distortion correction is legal under advanced editing, but not legal under basic editing. |
So cropping with 'perspective' isn't allowed in basic? Your applying the effect to the whole photo... |
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05/26/2004 12:50:30 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by BikeRacer:
I'd love to be able to use 'perspective' and lens correction tools in challenges...
I'm not looking to create any cool effects. I just want to remove the problems most normal lenses have, and to make straight lines come out straight...
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Perhaps these tools should be considered (like Neat Image in basic and advanced rules) for reasons like these:
1-Correct for the large number of poor quality lenses in use here that generate lense effects in the first place.
2-Allow photographers with poorer quality optices that have a tendency to enter basic challenges a way to improve their chances for higher scores.
3-Make pictures more realistic.
4-It allows no greater potential for abuse than Neat Image.
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05/26/2004 12:57:40 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by stdavidson:
4-It allows no greater potential for abuse than Neat Image. |
Not sure I agree with this. The "transform" tools in Photoshop (where you can distort the image to adjust for 'perspective', lens distortion, etc.) can be taken to some serious extremes. And although most would use it appropraitely, there would undoubtedly be those who would "take a mile" and find some way to use it to an extreme.
The "Basic Editing" rule set is simple because it doesn't permit any non-linear pixel manipulation. Any post-processing must be applied to the entire image in the same way. The Basic Editing rules have basically been around "forever", and I think they've served the site well. There have been plenty of fantastic images submitted prior to December 2003 (when the Advanced Editing rules were put into "trial"), and there continues to be great images in the Basic Editing challenges today.
Message edited by author 2004-05-26 12:57:58. |
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05/26/2004 01:01:04 PM · #13 |
| You could always buy a scan back and use it on a 4x5 camera. Then you are digital, and you can correct for distortion and 'perspective' in camera. I saw an older one on e-bay awhile ago that was 20 or 30 megapixels, I don't remember, and it was going for about $600. Of course then you need a 4x5 camera and those aren't exactly cheap. Plus the new scan backs are up around 300+ megapixels so the old one I saw on e-bay really is obsolete. |
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05/26/2004 01:06:02 PM · #14 |
| Actually Canon makese three tilt/shift lenses. I really want one, but haven't been able to justify it yet. They are manual-focus only and don't allow the range of adjustment of a true bellows-based view camera, but Canon's T/S lenses are plenty capable for many things. (The ability to tilt the focal plane can create some very interesting DOF effects!) |
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05/26/2004 01:53:30 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by EddyG:
Actually Canon makese three tilt/shift lenses. I really want one, but haven't been able to justify it yet. They are manual-focus only and don't allow the range of adjustment of a true bellows-based view camera, but Canon's T/S lenses are plenty capable for many things. (The ability to tilt the focal plane can create some very interesting DOF effects!) |
I have the 24 & the 90 TS, but If the Transform tool is applied to the whole image, it's not much different than cropping it. |
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