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Showing posts 51 - 66 of 66, (reverse)
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 03/26/2009 04:35:16 PM · #51
Originally posted by karmat:
Several years ago, I was driving my sister's car. No lights or anything showing a warning until the engine blew. The "Check Engine Light" did come on simultaneously with the "bang" that was the engine blowing.


An engine can fail for a number of resons. It's unusual for a head gasket to go with no prior signs. However it's common for a piston or a con-rod to fail with no warning and immediate catastrophic results.

I've been thinking again about the Explorer. While there may have been no warnings, for BOTH head gaskets to have failed means the engine must have been failing for a while. (The head gasket stops water mixing with oil; when it doesn't the oil and water mix and form a 'milky' residue whic is obvious in the expansion tank and if the oil filler cap is removed). I could understand 1 head gasket failing and giving the driver the indication that it had failed, it seems very very unlikely that both would have failed at the same time. I simply cannot believe that so much damage could have been done to such a solid engine in such a short space of time without prior warning. I'm baffled.
 03/26/2009 04:35:37 PM · #52
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
When they pulled over and popped the hood - smoke poured out. At that time, they noticed that the engine was covered with fluid. They saw that the radiator was empty - but the radiator reservoir was full. They tried pouring water in the radiator and it went straight through and onto the ground.

This doesn't sound good.....

There really should have been some other indicator prior to pulling over if the water tran right out.

It's possible that at speed something happened to allow the cooling system to evacuate out the bottom, but there would have been a stripe on the road at least......possibly unnoticeable if he wasn't looking in the rearview mirror, but then that means that he drove it too long afterward.

BTW, if the cooling system evacuated suddenly like that, the sensors would not have told a warning light to come on 'til it was waaaaaaay too late. They work on the cooling system having fluid in it.
 03/26/2009 04:37:39 PM · #53
Originally posted by mikeee:
I've been thinking again about the Explorer. While there may have been no warnings, for BOTH head gaskets to have failed means the engine must have been failing for a while. (The head gasket stops water mixing with oil; when it doesn't the oil and water mix and form a 'milky' residue whic is obvious in the expansion tank and if the oil filler cap is removed). I could understand 1 head gasket failing and giving the driver the indication that it had failed, it seems very very unlikely that both would have failed at the same time. I simply cannot believe that so much damage could have been done to such a solid engine in such a short space of time without prior warning. I'm baffled.

Upon thinking about the rapid evacuatuion of the cooling system.....once that happened and it was run 'til it basically started to sieze....hence the loss of power, the gakets would have been baked but good, and piston & wall damage would result as well.

Question is....how did the cooling system dump?

Looking back, the OP said the hose came off the T-Stat housing.....if the system promptly voided its coolant, these catastrophic results were inevitable.

Message edited by author 2009-03-26 16:39:09.
 03/26/2009 04:52:59 PM · #54
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by mikeee:
I've been thinking again about the Explorer. While there may have been no warnings, for BOTH head gaskets to have failed means the engine must have been failing for a while. (The head gasket stops water mixing with oil; when it doesn't the oil and water mix and form a 'milky' residue whic is obvious in the expansion tank and if the oil filler cap is removed). I could understand 1 head gasket failing and giving the driver the indication that it had failed, it seems very very unlikely that both would have failed at the same time. I simply cannot believe that so much damage could have been done to such a solid engine in such a short space of time without prior warning. I'm baffled.

Upon thinking about the rapid evacuatuion of the cooling system.....once that happened and it was run 'til it basically started to sieze....hence the loss of power, the gakets would have been baked but good, and piston & wall damage would result as well.

Question is....how did the cooling system dump?

Looking back, the OP said the hose came off the T-Stat housing.....if the system promptly voided its coolant, these catastrophic results were inevitable.


I agree. At the start of the thread I guessed the disconnected hose had caused the problem because the indications were of a sudden loss of coolant, but I also guessed that it may have been a symptom of excess pressure as a result of a boiling cooling system (but less likely).

I've repaired a fair few head gaskets in the past, but never experienced so much damage. And on that engine? Pretty bullet-proof from my 12 years experience with mine and the only reported failures were on old engines where the gasket had perished, and then only on 1 side.

In summary, I'd estimate a hose failure (don't know how) resulting in low or no coolant for a period of time with none of the obvious signs being spotted. Maybe it was a lack of familiarity with the car, but I'm amazed the driver didn't spot the impending failure before the engine took itself apart. Head gasket failures USUALLY result in steam and an obvious smell of coolant and the reair is just a couple of skimmed heads and a new set of gaskets. RARELY broken pistons.

However, the real question is 'Who's responsible for the repair'?
 03/26/2009 04:55:39 PM · #55
I just want to say thanks to everyone debating this with/for me.
I am at a loss where cars are concerned unfortunately. I always wanted to get into working on them when I was younger and just never did. I am really out of my element and unsure of how things happen or what my next steps should be.

Jeb - I sent you a PM.
 03/26/2009 05:20:24 PM · #56
again - i can't really help with your particular situation - but.

if you can get it running ... ? trade it in - get it running drive it straight to a dealership - and pawn it off.

a friend of mine had a chevy cavilier ( '93 maybe.. ) one day out of the blue one of the spark plugs shot out of the engine and almost through the hood ( left a nice reverse dent ). we cross threaded the plug back in, and traded the car in for $1500 the next day. got a '96 civic. no questions asked....

of course i would have hated to be the one that purchased the cavilier. but that might be the kind of situation you're dealing with.

i just have a feeling - trying to trace the fault to someone is going to be a chore. and during that chore you're going to be car less. it also might cost money to try to recoup less $$..



Message edited by author 2009-03-26 17:23:06.
 03/26/2009 05:50:47 PM · #57
Originally posted by soup:
again - i can't really help with your particular situation - but.

if you can get it running ... ? trade it in - get it running drive it straight to a dealership - and pawn it off.

a friend of mine had a chevy cavilier ( '93 maybe.. ) one day out of the blue one of the spark plugs shot out of the engine and almost through the hood ( left a nice reverse dent ). we cross threaded the plug back in, and traded the car in for $1500 the next day. got a '96 civic. no questions asked....

of course i would have hated to be the one that purchased the cavilier. but that might be the kind of situation you're dealing with.

i just have a feeling - trying to trace the fault to someone is going to be a chore. and during that chore you're going to be car less. it also might cost money to try to recoup less $$..


reason #12 not to buy a used car!
 03/26/2009 06:22:19 PM · #58
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
...He was driving on cruise control when this happened. The vehicle started stuttering. He looked at the dash and saw the speedometer dropping - but the only lights on the dash were from the passenger not wearing a seatbelt and the cruise control light. No other gauges or lights.

When they pulled over and popped the hood - smoke poured out. At that time, they noticed that the engine was covered with fluid. They saw that the radiator was empty - but the radiator reservoir was full. They tried pouring water in the radiator and it went straight through and onto the ground.

With this additional info - anyone have any ideas?


That does clarify things slightly... if they poured water in and it went through to the ground, then there was a *big* leak at a low point in the system (bottom of radiator, lower hose, etc). If that leak occurred very suddenly, and if the exiting stream of coolant was directed downward, it is possible that the driver might not immediately know that (s)he was suddenly without coolant.
Some engines won't indicate overheat if there is no coolant at the thermostat. Some have more sophisticated monitoring. I don't personally know which situation applies here.
Now, as Matt posted, it still takes some time to damage an engine that badly even under total-coolant-loss conditions. And normally, there are other indications that something is amiss, even in the absence of an over-temp light. but we're all guessing more than a little, we weren't there.
If the dealer will put money toward a used engine, that may be your best bet here, since it seems like there was no definitive reason that the dealer would have been aware of a risk of failure.
 03/26/2009 06:30:07 PM · #59
With out a recall you have no case. if there had been a recall and the dealer did not replace the clamps either before it was sold or during the maintenance than they would have to replace the engine.

the heads warping isn't a big surprise. the Explorer like many others have aluminum heads and they warp easily. I find it hard to believe that you would crack a piston though; a cracked piston usually is due to an impact not over heating. Over heating will cause the rings to collapse but that would take a tremendous amount of heat. if the idiot lights didn't come on or there were not any temp. warnings you might have a claim but that would probably end up going to court unless there is a clause saying that gauges the monitor the engine are not part of the warranty. as long as the truck was sold under a warranty and not "AS IS" you might be able to fight and get it fixed.
I do have a question for you and a suggestion. are the heads off the truck? if they are go and look at them and see if they are grooved between the cylinder walls. it will look like someone cut into the heads. the reason I as is it is possible to have a blown head gasket and still drive the car without a problem. but it produces "blowby" which is the compression escaping from one cylinder to the one next to it. this will cause damage to the head and will look like a saw or or cutting torch was taken to it, the deeper it is the longer the gasket has been blown, this can also cause the cracked piston they are saying you have. if it is there you can get the car fixed, it is a defect that was preexisting when you bought the car and they could have caught it using a compression tool. which they sould have done if they were putting it under warranty.
Just a side note ... it is an old trick to put saw dust into the oil to keep the pistons from making a knocking sound .... check your oil. It isn't done very often. Just a thought ...
Anyway, maybe this will help. Good luck
 03/26/2009 06:40:46 PM · #60
Originally posted by NstiG8tr:
FORD You know what they say:

Buy a Ford
Buy the best
Drive a mile
Walk the rest.


FORD= Found On Road Dead
Fix Or Repair Daily
If you look at it the other way...Driver Returns On Foot
 05/26/2009 02:39:24 PM · #61
It has been a while - but I wanted to let everyone know that after almost three months, I finally found someone at Ford who took another look at the vehicle and determined that the thermostat housing had cracked which led to the chain of events that blew my engine. They repaired it under warranty and I finally got it back on Saturday.
Brand spankin' new engine with a 3yr/300,000 mile warranty. It was a hassle, but I am happy that it is finally taken care of.
 05/26/2009 02:45:36 PM · #62
wow thats awesome news congrats I am glad you got it all sorted out
 05/26/2009 03:02:38 PM · #63
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
Brand spankin' new engine with a 3yr/300,000 mile warranty.


That is one impressive warranty period. Isn't that mileage something like someone driving 275 miles per day every day of the year.

Makes me want to go out and purchase a Ford.

Ray

Message edited by author 2009-05-26 15:04:57.
 05/26/2009 05:25:25 PM · #64
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
Brand spankin' new engine with a 3yr/300,000 mile warranty.


That is one impressive warranty period. Isn't that mileage something like someone driving 275 miles per day every day of the year.

Makes me want to go out and purchase a Ford.

Ray


I'm guessing 3yr/30,000 mile
 05/26/2009 09:58:32 PM · #65
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
It has been a while - but I wanted to let everyone know that after almost three months, I finally found someone at Ford who took another look at the vehicle and determined that the thermostat housing had cracked which led to the chain of events that blew my engine. They repaired it under warranty and I finally got it back on Saturday.
Brand spankin' new engine with a 3yr/300,000 mile warranty. It was a hassle, but I am happy that it is finally taken care of.

Yay!......8>)
 05/27/2009 03:10:37 PM · #66
Originally posted by Ken:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by ArpeggioAngel:
Brand spankin' new engine with a 3yr/300,000 mile warranty.


That is one impressive warranty period. Isn't that mileage something like someone driving 275 miles per day every day of the year.

Makes me want to go out and purchase a Ford.

Ray


I'm guessing 3yr/30,000 mile


Nope - per Ford it is 3yr/300,000 miles....surprised me too!!
All I know is it is a wonderful feeling to have my vehicle back. I was sick and tired of relying on my roommates to take me everywhere or let me borrow their cars.

I want to thank everyone again who gave me advice/suggestions along the way - it really did help make a difference!
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