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10/03/2008 10:24:47 AM · #326 |
It's "funny" because it seems the ONLY place the Repubs have wanted less government is when it comes to allowing big-business, lobbyists, and polluters to have very little regulation.
Hands OFF them, but when it comes to things like the Patriot Act and a blank check for an endless military occupation, it's no holds barred.
Now that we are pulling in the reigns on Wall street, moving toward a "green" energy policy, and trying to curb "special interests" â€Â¦ they have needed to do some flip-flopping and spinning.
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by ryand:
Originally posted by Jac:
I hope Americans will join together and come to an understanding that the Republican platform is only a platform of power, period. |
Republicans want less power in the government, giving more power to the people, and the Democrats want more power in the government. With the way our government handles things, I'm thinking the less power they have the better. |
Really? Has George W. Bush been a democrat all along? If what you're saying is true, he must be, since he's overseen the largest increase in the size and scope of goverment in this country's history. |
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10/03/2008 10:43:09 AM · #327 |
Flippin' and spinnin' like a fish out of water.
Originally posted by metatate:
It's "funny" because it seems the ONLY place the Repubs have wanted less government is when it comes to allowing big-business, lobbyists, and polluters to have very little regulation.
Hands OFF them, but when it comes to things like the Patriot Act and a blank check for an endless military occupation, it's no holds barred.
Now that we are pulling in the reigns on Wall street, moving toward a "green" energy policy, and trying to curb "special interests" â€Â¦ they have needed to do some flip-flopping and spinning.
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by ryand:
Originally posted by Jac:
I hope Americans will join together and come to an understanding that the Republican platform is only a platform of power, period. |
Republicans want less power in the government, giving more power to the people, and the Democrats want more power in the government. With the way our government handles things, I'm thinking the less power they have the better. |
Really? Has George W. Bush been a democrat all along? If what you're saying is true, he must be, since he's overseen the largest increase in the size and scope of goverment in this country's history. |
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10/03/2008 10:45:20 AM · #328 |
That's Polititions For you..
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Flippin' and spinnin' like a fish out of water.
Originally posted by metatate:
It's "funny" because it seems the ONLY place the Repubs have wanted less government is when it comes to allowing big-business, lobbyists, and polluters to have very little regulation.
Hands OFF them, but when it comes to things like the Patriot Act and a blank check for an endless military occupation, it's no holds barred.
Now that we are pulling in the reigns on Wall street, moving toward a "green" energy policy, and trying to curb "special interests" â€Â¦ they have needed to do some flip-flopping and spinning.
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Originally posted by ryand:
Originally posted by Jac:
I hope Americans will join together and come to an understanding that the Republican platform is only a platform of power, period. |
Republicans want less power in the government, giving more power to the people, and the Democrats want more power in the government. With the way our government handles things, I'm thinking the less power they have the better. |
Really? Has George W. Bush been a democrat all along? If what you're saying is true, he must be, since he's overseen the largest increase in the size and scope of goverment in this country's history. |
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10/03/2008 12:06:56 PM · #329 |
Okay, I've heard this three or four times on television since the end of the debate.
Commentators pointing out that Biden did not mention the name of the US commander in Afghanistan, but Palin did, and using that to say she had a stronger grasp of the details. The problem with that....she got it wrong...Palin: "Well, first, McClelan did not say definitively the surge principles would not work in Afghanistan." General David McKiernan is the commander of US forces in Afghanistan. I am guessing she was refering to George McClelan who led the failed Peninsula Campaign in the Civil War and later went on to lose to Lincoln in the 1864 Presidential election. Picky point, but man the media is frustrating sometimes.
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10/03/2008 12:10:53 PM · #330 |
Originally posted by vxpra:
General David McKiernan is the commander of US forces in Afghanistan. I am guessing she was refering to George McClelan who led the failed Peninsula Campaign in the Civil War... |
She most likely got confused with Scott McClellan. Hard to keep so many names straight when you're cramming for a test. |
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10/03/2008 12:28:09 PM · #331 |
| Someone should write a book about Republican Linguistics. So many of their candidates reinvent the English language: George H.W. Bush and Sarah Palin talk in strings of unrelated sentence fragments. Quayle and W. Bush pretty much speak complete gibberish bracketed by whatever is piped into their earplugs. You'd think they'd get the hang of ventriloquism after all this time... |
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10/03/2008 12:53:19 PM · #332 |
More than once, I was baffled by her lengthy and rambling answers with no apparent regard for the question, punctuation, or general sentence structure. I think it was her response to the 'nuculer' question that confused me the most. And I'm on the right...
After watching the replay, I don't think she was whupped by Biden, but IMO he had the better 'performance'.
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10/03/2008 01:10:49 PM · #333 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Someone should write a book about Republican Linguistics. So many of their candidates reinvent the English language: George H.W. Bush and Sarah Palin talk in strings of unrelated sentence fragments. Quayle and W. Bush pretty much speak complete gibberish bracketed by whatever is piped into their earplugs. You'd think they'd get the hang of ventriloquism after all this time... |
I agree. She did do a lot of incoherent rambling (much like me...after a few beers) but she also did have some interesting wordment structures. Or is it interesting word structurments?
All joking aside, she gave two to three answers where I had absolutely no idea what the hell she said and I may even go to the transcript to find and post one part.
I've noticed that many Republicans running for high office have trouble pronouncing the word Nuclear. Seems to come out nook-u-ler. Since they are usually the only people on the entire planet who get to play with them one would hope they could at least pronounce it correctly.
I think the media have just given up on that one since it doesn't sell papers.
eta: the bar for her was set so incredibly low she did well, based on that but Biden took it away. His best debate ever and I hope he gets some credit for it.
Message edited by author 2008-10-03 13:18:09. |
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10/03/2008 01:20:32 PM · #334 |
| You say either I say Either...you know the song.. Hell I have not understood a damn thing Ted Kennedy has said for the last 20 years, but I don't go around complaining about him being drunk all the time. Dialects are different in many places. There is no need to be disrespectful because someone talkes different from you. |
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10/03/2008 01:24:35 PM · #335 |
Originally posted by coronamv:
You say either I say Either...you know the song.. Hell I have not understood a damn thing Ted Kennedy has said for the last 20 years, but I don't go around complaining about him being drunk all the time. Dialects are different in many places. There is no need to be disrespectful because someone talkes different from you. |
A rambling incoherent mess of a butchered sentence that contains no pertinent information in answer to a pointed question is not a "dialect". |
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10/03/2008 01:27:11 PM · #336 |
| Here's a good comparison of the oratory skills and grasp of the issues of Palin and Biden. That Palin is in the run for the vice presidency is not merely odd, but indicative of something exceptionally wrong. |
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10/03/2008 01:28:56 PM · #337 |
| All right, Seems like this topic deserves it's own thread but I'll go ahead and weigh in here. I cannot believe the amount of Palin bashing going on here. It's unreal. I don't like her being on the ticket and I think she is lacking in experience but she did fantastic last night... maybe that's what it is. You didn't want her to and when she did you all found it irritating. Biden had no answer for his own criticisms of Obama. That was a definite turning point. You may not like her mannerisms or colloquial manner of talking but I'll guarantee you that a huge portion of regular joe (yes I said it) people did. You should be afraid... be very afraid. Regular people like her. I like her. I just don't think she has enough experience to be VP. |
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10/03/2008 01:31:25 PM · #338 |
| Liking somebody is not reason enough to send them to the second highest office in the country. I'm sure she's a lovely woman (outside of her Jesus-freakery), and I'm sure she bakes a mean banana nut cake, but she's not fit to be vice president of the United States. |
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10/03/2008 01:32:12 PM · #339 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Here's a good comparison of the oratory skills and grasp of the issues of Palin and Biden. That Palin is in the run for the vice presidency is not merely odd, but indicative of something exceptionally wrong. |
I trace it back to Lee Atwater, who began a culture of do-Anything-to-win in the Republican party. Inevitably, the Democrats have had to copycat in order to stand a chance. Once you give in to "the end justifies the means" you become hopelessly corrupt and it affects governance as well as campaigning. The Bush Administration is the premier example. |
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10/03/2008 01:38:15 PM · #340 |
One thing, among many, that irritated me was Palin's insistence that lowing corporate taxes would help the economy and grow the number of jobs. A couple of minutes later, she said she raised the windfall profit tax on oil companies in Alaska. Now, am I just really ignorant here, or is a windfall profits tax another way of taxing corporations?
(And if I am called a folk one more time I will scream). |
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10/03/2008 01:41:33 PM · #341 |
| Listen, folks like you just don't oh never mind. ;-) |
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10/03/2008 01:45:51 PM · #342 |
Originally posted by coronamv:
You say either I say Either...you know the song.. Hell I have not understood a damn thing Ted Kennedy has said for the last 20 years, but I don't go around complaining about him being drunk all the time. Dialects are different in many places. There is no need to be disrespectful because someone talkes different from you. |
Frankly, we've had a lack of eloquence for a long time. Listen to some of Tony Blair's impromptu answers during press conferences. It's like suddenly drinking a nice Pinot after being used to house red. I listened to him for a while a few years ago and he almost had me convinced the war in Iraq was a good thing... ;) |
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10/03/2008 01:47:18 PM · #343 |
Originally posted by dahkota:
Now, am I just really ignorant here, or is a windfall profits tax another way of taxing corporations? |
Yep, and it was equally troubling to me that she was railing against bigger government while speaking of broader powers for the Vice-President, more financial oversight and government restrictions on personal matters. What annoyed me most is that she had the gall to repeat claims already proven false or blatantly misleading many times by fact-checking organizations (Obama will raise taxes, Obama voted against the troops, Obama won't say the surge worked, etc.). I suspect part of the reason Biden just smiled on some of these points is that a response would only lend credibility to a false claim. |
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10/03/2008 01:47:32 PM · #344 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
Originally posted by Louis:
Here's a good comparison of the oratory skills and grasp of the issues of Palin and Biden. That Palin is in the run for the vice presidency is not merely odd, but indicative of something exceptionally wrong. |
I trace it back to Lee Atwater, who began a culture of do-Anything-to-win in the Republican party. Inevitably, the Democrats have had to copycat in order to stand a chance. Once you give in to "the end justifies the means" you become hopelessly corrupt and it affects governance as well as campaigning. The Bush Administration is the premier example. |
Even Atwater renounced these methods and apologized before he died. |
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10/03/2008 01:49:08 PM · #345 |
I thought it was interesting that Palin mentioned she appreciated the debate because she could speak *unfiltered* by the media, implying that her poor public performance in the week leading up to the debate is just a public perception caused by media spin. Funny, both the NY Post and the NY Daily news today have cover stories praising her debate performance.
And by the way, I find it vaguely insulting that the new Republic slogan for the race is "Country First" -- as if any opposition doesn't feel the same!
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10/03/2008 01:50:31 PM · #346 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
What annoyed me most is that she had the gall to repeat claims already proven false or blatantly misleading many times by fact-checking organizations (Obama will raise taxes, Obama voted against the troops, Obama won't say the surge worked, etc.). I suspect part of the reason Biden just smiled on some of these points is that a response would only lend credibility to a false claim. |
I wondered about that. I felt he didn't contradict her strongly enough. |
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10/03/2008 01:52:11 PM · #347 |
Originally posted by dahkota:
One thing, among many, that irritated me was Palin's insistence that lowing corporate taxes would help the economy and grow the number of jobs. |
How many net jobs have the "Bush tax cuts" produced? I wish someone would finally point out that this mantra is demonstrably false; that jobs are created when wealth is spread through out the populace instead of being hoarded by the financial "elite." Last year, the top 1% of the population received about 20% of the income. |
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10/03/2008 01:53:06 PM · #348 |
It should be "Politics First!" â€Â¦
Originally posted by citymars:
And by the way, I find it vaguely insulting that the new Republic slogan for the race is "Country First" -- as if any opposition doesn't feel the same! |
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10/03/2008 01:53:24 PM · #349 |
Originally posted by citymars:
And by the way, I find it vaguely insulting that the new Republic slogan for the race is "Country First" -- as if any opposition doesn't feel the same! |
Ugh, it's just one of those fallacious slogans that the core eats up. Hopefully most people will see through that kind of BS. (We've a similar problem where with the Conservatives hammering us with "Not a leader" in reference to Mr. Dion.) |
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10/03/2008 01:54:02 PM · #350 |
Originally posted by citymars:
And by the way, I find it vaguely insulting that the new Republic slogan for the race is "Country First" ... |
I think the mean it in the sense of "... Europe next, and the rest of the world after that." |
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