Clarification, please? - DPChallenge Forums

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

05/04/2008 09:46:03 PM · #1

I need a quick clarification on the Basic Editing ruleset. I know this has been discussed before, but I can't seem to find the answer when doing a forum search...

Can I take a single RAW file and expose it multiple times and then merge the multiple exposures together (either by using CS3's SmartObjects or by using HDR)?

Yo_Spiff

Olympus 12-100mm f/4.0 M.Zuiko ED IS PRO

05/04/2008 09:47:31 PM · #2

I don't think that is legal under basic rules.

From the Basic editing rules:

You may:
use RAW conversion software as long as the changes are made globally to a single file on one layer and do not create new features or effects in the process. [/quote]

It is a little vague. I would not consider that to fit within those rules.Perhaps the rules for basic need clarifying in the is area.

Message edited by author 2008-05-04 21:51:53.

littlegett

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

05/04/2008 09:54:48 PM · #3

Simple Answer.... No.

It has been discussed, and is something that can be done in Advanced, but not Basic.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

05/04/2008 09:55:41 PM · #4

Originally posted by yospiff:

I don't think that is legal under basic rules.

From the Basic editing rules:

You may:
use RAW conversion software as long as the changes are made globally to a single file on one layer and do not create new features or effects in the process.

It is a little vague. I would not consider that to fit within those rules.Perhaps the rules for basic need clarifying in the is area.

Well, I'm not using Layers in my RAW conversion process, and any adjustments I make are to the whole image (no selections). So I think I may be legal.

Also, the Basic Editing rules state "create your entry from a single capture", which is what I have done.

Thoughts, comments?

littlegett

Canon EOS-20D

05/04/2008 09:58:10 PM · #5

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

Originally posted by yospiff:
I don't think that is legal under basic rules.

From the Basic editing rules:

You may:
use RAW conversion software as long as the changes are made globally to a single file on one layer and do not create new features or effects in the process.

It is a little vague. I would not consider that to fit within those rules.Perhaps the rules for basic need clarifying in the is area.

Well, I'm not using Layers in my RAW conversion process, and any adjustments I make are to the whole image (no selections). So I think I may be legal.

Also, the Basic Editing rules state "create your entry from a single capture", which is what I have done.

Thoughts, comments?

You are creating multiple images from a single image no? I mean, when you adjust exposure and you said you have to 'MERGE' that in essence is using multiple files and not allowed.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

05/04/2008 10:01:32 PM · #6

Originally posted by littlegett:

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

Originally posted by yospiff:
I don't think that is legal under basic rules.

From the Basic editing rules:

You may:
use RAW conversion software as long as the changes are made globally to a single file on one layer and do not create new features or effects in the process.

It is a little vague. I would not consider that to fit within those rules.Perhaps the rules for basic need clarifying in the is area.

Well, I'm not using Layers in my RAW conversion process, and any adjustments I make are to the whole image (no selections). So I think I may be legal.

Also, the Basic Editing rules state "create your entry from a single capture", which is what I have done.

Thoughts, comments?

You are creating multiple images from a single image no? I mean, when you adjust exposure and you said you have to 'MERGE' that in essence is using multiple files and not allowed.

If I use CS3's SmartObjects, they are not really considered images at that point. I can go from Adobe Camera RAW directly to a CS3 SmartObject.

Even if I simply convert to one TIFF or PSD, then in CS3 I go and create multiple SmartObjects (one for each exposure), I haven't created multiple images.

littlegett

Canon EOS-20D

05/04/2008 10:05:28 PM · #7

MAY NOT
#
use ANY editing tool to create new image area, objects or features (such as vignettes, lens flare or motion) that didnâ��t already exist in your original capture.
#
I would consider making multiple exposures in 'objects' new image areas.

(edit to add)
YOU MAY
#
use RAW conversion software as long as the changes are made globally to a single file on one layer and do not create new features or effects in the process.
#

Making multiple exposures I consider new effects, however, I also believe SmartObjects to be Multiple layers. Even if they are not multiple layers in the traditional sense, they are multiple objects 'MERGED' to create a NEW EFFECT.

Message edited by author 2008-05-04 22:08:14.

TooCool

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

05/04/2008 10:06:00 PM · #8

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

If I use CS3's SmartObjects, they are not really considered images at that point.

Any way you justify it it is not legal in basic...

Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III

05/04/2008 10:12:28 PM · #9

I figured it was a long shot, but I've also submitted a ticket to the SC, asking the same question. I'll let you all know what the response is when I get one.

Yo_Spiff

Olympus 12-100mm f/4.0 M.Zuiko ED IS PRO

05/04/2008 10:54:53 PM · #10

It was a good question. Let us know what the definitive word is.

05/04/2008 11:41:17 PM · #11

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

How are you NOT using layers when merging the different exposures you created from the one RAW file? How are you NOT using more than one file since processing the RAW file more than once requires it to be exported more than once?

05/05/2008 12:06:08 AM · #12

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

How are you NOT using more than one file since processing the RAW file more than once requires it to be exported more than once?

Thanks, all.

I've received official word that it is illegal to use image-containing layers, which is what a SmartObject is, as opposed to an adjustment layer, which does not contain any images information. I knew that these layers contained such info, but just wanted some clarification (as the subject stated). ;-)

By the way, Colette, a SmartObject (SO) is not a file, in and of itself. I can create a SO from ACR and go directly to it in CS3, without ever touching the file system, per se. SO's are not saved as files (or at least I never have), they are part of a saved PSD project.

05/05/2008 12:13:29 AM · #13

Originally posted by AperturePriority:

Originally posted by cpanaioti:
How are you NOT using more than one file since processing the RAW file more than once requires it to be exported more than once?

Thanks, all.

I've received official word that it is illegal to use image-containing layers, which is what a SmartObject is, as opposed to an adjustment layer, which does not contain any images information. I knew that these layers contained such info, but just wanted some clarification (as the subject stated). ;-)

By the way, Colette, a SmartObject (SO) is not a file, in and of itself. I can create a SO from ACR and go directly to it in CS3, without ever touching the file system, per se. SO's are not saved as files (or at least I never have), they are part of a saved PSD project.

I wasn't talking about SmartObjects at all, just the process of taking multiple exposures from one RAW file.

05/05/2008 12:31:34 AM · #14

I understand how SmartObjects can be used to flip back and forth between PS and ACR easily.

To do multiple exposures do you just duplicate the SmartObject in PS and change the exposure in ACR for each? (not legal in basic) Just curious.

05/05/2008 12:41:42 AM · #15

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

To do multiple exposures do you just duplicate the SmartObject in PS and change the exposure in ACR for each? (not legal in basic) Just curious.

Yeah, that's normally how I do it--right-click on the SO, and choose "Edit Contents", which flips you back over to ACR. Then repeat for the number of exposures you want.

Many times, I'll add a gradient layer to blend the different exposures (works well with landscapes with a well-defined division between sky and ground).