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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> I need some pros and cons of both of these cameras
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 04/27/2007 07:55:04 AM · #1
I won't be upgrading for a while yet, but I'm researching now. I have joked with hubby that he got his new truck and his catering business underway, now it's MY turn to the ball rolling for myself.

I'm tired of doing just outdoor portraits, as much as I enjoy doing it I feel so limited. I won't be getting rid of my Oly because I love it too much and I'm attached. But I do need something better.

So I've narrowed it down to these 2

Canon 5D
Nikon D200

This obviously will be a huge investment and I don't plan on buying another camera after this purchase. I'd also like some pointers on lighting- as far as what I would need to buy for a portable studio- I won't be setting anything up in my house per landlords request, so I'm going to need something I can haul to customers locations.

Also, anyone ordered on Ebay? I've never ordered anything from there but have noticed packaged deals that look pretty good.
canon 5d

04/27/2007 08:41:20 AM · #2
No known cons for the 5D... I wouldn't hesitate to buy it if I had the money.
Pros: Least noise, best resolution, best choice of lenses.
 04/27/2007 08:43:17 AM · #3
Both great cameras, but if you like less grain at higher ISO's the 5D is what I would reccommend.
 04/27/2007 08:44:02 AM · #4
how much do the lenses run and does that package look like a good deal? I'm thinking the 2.8 lens I can use as a portrait lense correct?

I could easily buy the Nikon D200 right now, thing is there are things I've seen from the D200 that I didn't like- could just be a bad photographer lol, but I have never seen anything I didn't like from the Canon- the color, clarity, all of it are superb. I'd have to wait till fall to get the Canon which isn't a big deal because I can do outdoor work now anyways with my Oly.
04/27/2007 08:51:12 AM · #5
If full frame and better high ISO performance are worth an extra $1200 (B&H) to you, and you don't already have an investment in glass, get the 5D, it's a really nice camera.

If you want a better camera body that is sealed and at least equal image quality under 800 ISO, a better flash system, and want to put the extra $1200 into something else (lenses?), then the D200 would be a good choice.

If you won't be upgrading for awhile, likely as not the models will have changed and there will be a whole new set of options for you to consider at that time.

Fact of the matter is, DSLR's have progressed to the point where they are all capable of excellent images. What will separate good pictures from bad will be the photographer, not the camera. Look at it as buying into a system over the long haul. The camera bodies are practially obsolete when you buy them, but the lenses continue to be viable as is the manufacturers strategy in the marketplace.

As for Ebay?? There are a lot of scams out there and people are losing a lot of money because they are trying to get an unbelievable deal. Thinking with thier pocketbook and not thier brain. Look at B&H and some of the other reputable dealers pricing. If what you see advertized is too far from B&H, question it. There isn't a whole lot of markup on the camera bodies so these people will have to get it out of you some other way.
 04/27/2007 08:52:19 AM · #6
Lookie here
 04/27/2007 08:58:22 AM · #7
Originally posted by missinseattle:

I could easily buy the Nikon D200 right now, thing is there are things I've seen from the D200 that I didn't like- could just be a bad photographer lol, but I have never seen anything I didn't like from the Canon- the color, clarity, all of it are superb. I'd have to wait till fall to get the Canon which isn't a big deal because I can do outdoor work now anyways with my Oly.


Just look at the top rated images under equipment>cameras for both. You will see that both cameras are capable of superb images. Any "bad" images you see are the fault of the photographer.
 04/27/2007 08:59:05 AM · #8
Dont forget that the 5D has been out a while now. I got one a few months ago but with the $600 rebate(that I did finally get). If they are still going for full price consider waiting on the replacement. You need on consider the entire line though not just these two cameras. Which one do you want locked into?
 04/27/2007 09:07:12 AM · #9
I dont have a D200 so I cant say much about it. With the 5D and the extra megapixels expect to have to buy the fast memory cards, otherwise its just to slow.(raw anyway) I did shoot in jpg the other day and was way impressed how good they looked right out of the camera.
 04/27/2007 09:13:02 AM · #10
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Lookie here


An excellent link - I hadn't compared them side to side like that.

For how I shoot and what I care about in features, D200 is a better camera. I'm quite happy that for once what I "need" happens to be the less expensive option.

I'm wondering what justifies the 5D being so much more expensive - all I could see was a larger sensor and it's a CMOS compared to the CCD on the D200.

Comments?
 04/27/2007 09:52:33 AM · #11
Why are you turning down Olympus? I'm researching also because I want to buy a DSLR, and I'm waiting for this baby to be available.
The fact it has in body stabilization, auto cleaning sensor and live view are really attractive, I've read some hands on reviews and it seems the image quality is really good even at high ISO.
It is true 4/3 lenses are somewhat expensive and there are fewer choices, but with adaptors you can fit a wide variety of lenses with very few limitations....
 04/27/2007 10:00:59 AM · #12
If you are considering the D200, you really need to take a look at the Pentax K10D. The biggest pro for this camera is weather sealing and the built in IS system, which means every lens will be IS. Pentax also has superb glass for portrait work.

Yes, do "lookie" here for camera details.

Also "lookie" here for a look at some work by Benjamin Kanarek, a fashion photographer in Paris using the K10D system.

Tim

Edit: Added the Benjamin Kanarek link

Message edited by author 2007-04-27 10:05:57.
 04/27/2007 10:11:16 AM · #13
My advice between these two cameras: forget about the details for now--specs, frame rates, megapixels and all that nonsense.

Go to a store that has both and hold them. Nikon and Canon have very different directions when it comes to ergonomics, button placement, etc. Go to a camera store and look at each one. Hold them in your hands, look through the viewfinder, and take some shots. Change the shutter speeds, aperture, and ISO, and take a few more shots. Chances are, one body will feel much more natural for you than the other. Buy that one.
 04/27/2007 10:18:05 AM · #14
Thanks for posting the links- I've compared lol.

I'm not "turning down" Olympus. But the one lens I could really use is 6,000 some dollars. I originally bought the Oly because it was in my budget, it's been a wonderful learning camera and has helped me learn everything I've done so far.
Tim, I've looked into the Pentax and it's definetly on my list.

Like I said I won't be buying for quite some time.

Zal, I've held both and it's hard to choose by that because they are both so different from my Oly which I am used to. The D70 had been my original choice before I purchased the Oly, but I could only afford the body and nothing else. I was able to get body, two lenses, extended warranty, and cf card for less then the D70 camera body at that time.

I need to find someone around here with a 5D tha will let me go shoot with them so I can take it outside and work with it because that's where I do most of my shooting. I had a friend with D70 who now has 2 D200's but he tried to rip me off selling his D70 so we really aren't on speaking terms anymore. I'm sure if I asked he'd let me go out with him and use one of his D200's to try it out, but I don't feel like asking him lol.
 04/27/2007 12:06:02 PM · #15
Originally posted by digitalknight:
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
Lookie here


An excellent link - I hadn't compared them side to side like that.

For how I shoot and what I care about in features, D200 is a better camera. I'm quite happy that for once what I "need" happens to be the less expensive option.

I'm wondering what justifies the 5D being so much more expensive - all I could see was a larger sensor and it's a CMOS compared to the CCD on the D200.

Comments?


larger sensor is a huge deal for some photographers. it depends on what you need and how big you need to make it. if you get upset about noise (I do), or if you are wanting to print things very big go with cannon. the bigger sensor really comes down to more info in a capture, meaning less noise. if you need more info in a capture go with the cannon.

also that bit about holding them is huge. I love the cannon's buttons and the large thumb wheel on the back. I also think it makes more sense on the placement of everything, but that is just me.
 04/27/2007 01:19:20 PM · #16
The 5D will give you a shallower DOF than the D200.

As far as that ebay deal goes, do you really want either of those two lenses? If you're doing studio work, either a set of primes (50mm, 85mm and 135mm) or a couple of zooms (Tamron 38-75 f/2.8 and Sigma 70-200 f/2.8 are the lower-cost options) would be better lenses.
 04/27/2007 01:23:51 PM · #17
5D is incredibly smooth, tone-wise. I used Kirbic's when he was visiting and I could notice the difference between it and my 20D, which is pretty comparable results-wise to the D200. As far as I can see, the 5D is very much the popular choice for serious portrait shooters. Smooth means the world in portraits...

R.
 04/27/2007 01:26:49 PM · #18
on top of these good pieces of advice, a couple of minor points:

* If indeed you're not going to actually purchase the camera for a while, be sure to see what happens next with the 5D. Its getting "old" and could be replaced in the next months.

* As far as good prices go, you should have a look here: //www.digitalrev.com. Should be at least as good/better in every respect than ebay. I never purchased there yet but discovered it thanks to the good reviews of people on these forums.
04/27/2007 01:34:02 PM · #19
Since you are talking about portrait work, have you considered the Sigma SD14 with it's excellent Foveon sensor or the Fuji S5 Pro with it's increased dynamic range and 14-bit capture depth?

Might be something to consider...
 04/27/2007 01:56:51 PM · #20
Wedding photogs complain about the slow write time on the Fuji S3 Pro, and maybe this has been addressed with the S5 Pro. I have never had a problem with overloading the catche on my S3. I shoot mostly landscape and macro, and some people pics, and love the Fuji film simulations which make it easy to get beautiful skin tones right from the camera. Another item with the Fuji is that the viewfinder is not as big or bright as the Canon 5D. That could be a big reason to go with the Canon for you. The Fuji S3 uses the same viewing system as the D70.
I bought a second Fuji S3 body on eBay for $885 US, because I liked my original one so much after a year of heavy shooting.
The S3 uses Nikon lenses too, which are much less pricey than equiv Canon glass. Get the ED or L series lenses if you can afford them, as the glass is how the image gets to the sensor, and there is a quality difference.
I would suggest that you have a look at the S5 reviews. It uses the same sensor as the S3 with different electronics.
The "go hold them" suggestion is the best way to pick the item that you will be holding a lot for a long time.
04/27/2007 02:32:22 PM · #21
Originally posted by mouten:
on top of these good pieces of advice, a couple of minor points:

* If indeed you're not going to actually purchase the camera for a while, be sure to see what happens next with the 5D. Its getting "old" and could be replaced in the next months.

You may see a nice discount on the 5D soon, AFIK Canon discounts twice a year and last fall the 5D discount was $300 which could be doubled if you bought a lens.
 04/27/2007 03:16:23 PM · #22
Originally posted by MelonMusketeer:
Wedding photogs complain about the slow write time on the Fuji S3 Pro, and maybe this has been addressed with the S5 Pro. I have never had a problem with overloading the catche on my S3. I shoot mostly landscape and macro, and some people pics, and love the Fuji film simulations which make it easy to get beautiful skin tones right from the camera. Another item with the Fuji is that the viewfinder is not as big or bright as the Canon 5D. That could be a big reason to go with the Canon for you. The Fuji S3 uses the same viewing system as the D70.
I bought a second Fuji S3 body on eBay for $885 US, because I liked my original one so much after a year of heavy shooting.
The S3 uses Nikon lenses too, which are much less pricey than equiv Canon glass. Get the ED or L series lenses if you can afford them, as the glass is how the image gets to the sensor, and there is a quality difference.
I would suggest that you have a look at the S5 reviews. It uses the same sensor as the S3 with different electronics.
The "go hold them" suggestion is the best way to pick the item that you will be holding a lot for a long time.

if i had nikon lenses i personally would go for an S5, but its all in what your shooting, the max shutter is no where near enough for a sports phtographer, but fine art portrait photographer definitly. The tonal range it captures is amazing
 04/27/2007 03:23:06 PM · #23
Originally posted by hankk:
Originally posted by mouten:
on top of these good pieces of advice, a couple of minor points:

* If indeed you're not going to actually purchase the camera for a while, be sure to see what happens next with the 5D. Its getting "old" and could be replaced in the next months.

You may see a nice discount on the 5D soon, AFIK Canon discounts twice a year and last fall the 5D discount was $300 which could be doubled if you bought a lens.

if i recall correctly(its been a few days since ive been at work) the rebate on a 5d body its $150 or $200

Message edited by author 2007-04-27 15:23:23.
 04/27/2007 03:34:57 PM · #24
The only real big con I can think of is that one is a Nikon.
 04/27/2007 06:11:21 PM · #25
Hi,

Here's that DPReview link again, this time to compare the six cameras mentioned in this thread (Nikon D200, Canon EOS 5D, Olympus E-510, Pentax K10D, Sigma SD14, Fujifilm S5 Pro):

HERE.

I've held the D200 and for me it fits just right. I haven't held the Canon, but the idea of the full sized sensor really appeals to me. Both are probably too much camera for this beginner, though.

By the way, I'm shocked to see that there are over 500 5D owners on DPChallenge. Damn, people have a lot of money!
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