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DPChallenge Forums >> Tips, Tricks, and Q&A >> Confusion on Photoshop Layers
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 02/24/2007 09:41:02 AM · #1
Up until now, I've just edited away, careless and fancy free. I know that I can do better, and I'm really trying to develop a workflow for my post processing. The concept of the workflow I have, but implementing it I have hit a snag, and it may just be because I don't fully understand how certian Photoshop layers work.

For example, I am currently working on my February Free Study. I have nicely composed photo that I shot in RAW. Here's what I have done so far:

1. Adjust white balance, exposure, brightness, contrast, etc. In Camera RAW
2. Opened that into Photoshop CS2
3. Copied the background layer
4. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and adjusted Shadow/Highlight
5. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and burned
6. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and dodged
7. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and ran Noise Ninja
8. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and Smart Sharpened a portion of the photo
9. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and USMed another portion
10. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and did some more dodging.

Step 10 really gave it a kick that I wanted, but now I want to get rid of step 5, because I burned that too much.

My understanding was that each layer should act as a transparency, and I should be able to delete it to get rid of those edits. I know adjustment layers work like this, I have no problem with them. But it appears that the way I am creating new edit layers just copies the previous layer. If I delete the burn layer is step 5, it makes no difference to step 10, I still have too much burn.

Am I creating my edit layers incorrectly? Can I make them transparent? How do I get rid of the overburn in step 5 without basically starting the whole post processing over? At this point on this photo, I know I probably have to, but please help me understand what I am doing for futute photos.

Am I asking for something that just doesn't exist?

Thank you in advance for any help.
 02/24/2007 09:45:16 AM · #2
Use ctrl + shft + N to get a new blank layer each time. Do your adjustments there - those stay permenantly editable.

Then when you need another layer with pixels use ctrl + shft + alt + N + E --- long, I know, but that will give you a new layer based on the changes in all of the adjustment layers below. I use that one for final tweeking before I collapse the whole lot and save.

Remember to always flatten all layers before you do a save as jpg or save for web.
 02/24/2007 09:51:04 AM · #3
Thanks, Cindi. That seems to do the trick. It didn't seem like it was working before, but maybe I was doing something different. It seems too simple and now I feel stupid.
 02/24/2007 09:52:28 AM · #4
Originally posted by larryslights:
Thanks, Cindi. That seems to do the trick. It didn't seem like it was working before, but maybe I was doing something different. It seems too simple and now I feel stupid.


Its not simple and don't feel dumb. PS is a huge bit of software and little nuances like that can take ages to find on your own. Always ask, someone will know that answer. :D
 02/24/2007 10:02:16 AM · #5
Another way to dodge and burn without touching your original layer is to Option-Click (Alt-Click on PC) on the new layer icon in the layer palette. This brings up the new layer dialog box. In there, change the layer blend mode to OVERLAY this will then give you the option to fill the layer with 50% gray. Select this option and click OK.

On this new gray layer you can "paint" the areas you want to dodge and burn with a paint brush. Make sure you lower the brush opacity so the dodging and burning will build as you paint.

If you mess up you can always repaint the area with 50% gray and start over again all without touching the original layer.
 02/24/2007 10:30:23 AM · #6
Originally posted by wmprkg:
Another way to dodge and burn without touching your original layer is to Option-Click (Alt-Click on PC) on the new layer icon in the layer palette. This brings up the new layer dialog box. In there, change the layer blend mode to OVERLAY this will then give you the option to fill the layer with 50% gray. Select this option and click OK.

On this new gray layer you can "paint" the areas you want to dodge and burn with a paint brush. Make sure you lower the brush opacity so the dodging and burning will build as you paint.

If you mess up you can always repaint the area with 50% gray and start over again all without touching the original layer.

This is a better dodge and burn method. Even though it is a real data layer it is not a duplicate of your original layer and can be easily deleted without affecting the rest of the image among other advantages.
 02/24/2007 01:35:03 PM · #7
Originally posted by larryslights:
1. Adjust white balance, exposure, brightness, contrast, etc. In Camera RAW
2. Opened that into Photoshop CS2
3. Copied the background layer
4. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and adjusted Shadow/Highlight
5. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and burned
6. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and dodged
7. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and ran Noise Ninja
8. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and Smart Sharpened a portion of the photo
9. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and USMed another portion
10. Used CTRL-ALT-SHIFT-E to create a new layer, and did some more dodging.

... My understanding was that each layer should act as a transparency, and I should be able to delete it to get rid of those edits. ...

Am I creating my edit layers incorrectly? Can I make them transparent? How do I get rid of the overburn in step 5 without basically starting the whole post processing over? At this point on this photo, I know I probably have to, but please help me understand what I am doing for futute photos.

Am I asking for something that just doesn't exist?

Thank you in advance for any help.

You will want to study and understand layers better. Unfortunately, everything you did in your workflow requires it be done on a data layer so creating new "blank" layers will do you no good. Each layer you created duplicated and covered up everything below it. That is why they behave differently from adjustment layers which contain no data so can be deleted at will.

You created 8 data layers. That is to many and it looks like they were all done before any adjustment layers at all were added. You should minimize the number of data layers you create and save in your post processed master file.

A workflow suggestion to consider would be this:

1-Duplicate BG layer.
2-Apply noise reduction to duplicate layer.
3-Duplicate that layer and apply shadow/highlight.
4-Add all adjustment layers for whatever purposes you need them.
5-Create 50% greyscale layer and do dodge and burn there. Notice it is saved until after adjustment layers.
6-Save post processed master file.

That leaves you an original in the BG layer and two data layers, one for noise reduction and one for shadow/highlight.

When you want to produce an output file:

1-Open post processed master file.
2-Flatten the image, crop and resize.
3-Duplicate the flattened layer and apply Smart Sharpen to that.
4-Flatten and save under a different name as your output file. Master file remains unchanged.

You will want to slightly oversharpen the whole image in step 3 and then fine tune it. You should NEVER need to apply both Smart Sharpen AND USM to the same image. Smart Sharpen does everything USM does and much more.

The advantage to applying Smart Sharpen in a separate layer in step 3 is it allows fine adjustments in two ways. First, you can back off the opacity slightly to easily make visual global sharpening adjustments to the whole image. Second, you can add a mask to the sharpened layer to make fine adjustments to localized areas of the image that may still be oversharpened by airbrushing the mask with a black brush to mask out all or part of it out. For localized areas that may still need more sharpening you can very carefully use the sharpen tool.
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