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DPChallenge Forums >> Current Challenge >> Did we forget how to be photographers?
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Showing posts 26 - 50 of 63, (reverse)
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 11/01/2003 09:08:42 AM · #26
I ran out of time, so PS wasn't used except a tiny bit in mine, which was legal. But, I did have fun shooting the shots of all the kids and neighborhod houses that might fit. Van
 11/01/2003 09:46:08 AM · #27
i just hate it that people take "no editing restrictions" as a means to go completely overboard. i've not looked at the halloween entries yet, but i'm sure some of them are too much.

it just sucks that the few of us that want to use photoshop to IMPROVE (spot-editing, dodging, burning) always have our images drowned out by the digital art masses whenever we get a chance to use it. ah well...
 11/01/2003 09:46:39 AM · #28
and i've said before, and i'll say it again: if you're truly using photoshop correctly, then no one knows you're using it.
 11/01/2003 10:12:29 AM · #29
LOL - I never read past the line that said "restrictions lifted" so I originally submitted my photograph without any PSing. Then I noticed that little line in red and took my photo back to do one thing to it that had me in a quandry before I originally posted the first time. I don't think it helped my score any and probably wasn't even noticed.

I also agree with grigrigirl about learning more from this site about Photoshop. That would be helpful and informative.
 11/01/2003 10:13:57 AM · #30
oops typo-- I never read past the challenge title down to the line that read "No Restrictions."
 11/01/2003 10:40:41 AM · #31
Originally posted by muckpond:
and i've said before, and i'll say it again: if you're truly using photoshop correctly, then no one knows you're using it.


That doesn't make sense, Muck. PS is meant to edit and manipulate images. I somehow doubt the creators would add tools like 'Liquify' if they didn't want you to have the ability to do some un-natural things. I agree with you that certain pictures (arguably MOST pictures) are far better off when the PS is limited to undetectable subtleties, but the capability to do more was clearly incorporated into the program intentionally.

Just 'cuz you don't like it, don't make it wrong :)

To see some awesome manipulation, maybe Danny (crabapple3) will show us his before and after of Glory, which is stunning work.

Pedro
 11/01/2003 10:47:54 AM · #32
Please ignore the "Image Modification" related rules.

lol
Damned if ya do and damned if ya don't.
I took this challenge with a grain of salt and took the opportunity to use filters, layers and manipulation that aren't usually permitted.

Dang! wrong again. :(
 11/01/2003 10:58:35 AM · #33
Originally posted by Pedro:
Originally posted by muckpond:
and i've said before, and i'll say it again: if you're truly using photoshop correctly, then no one knows you're using it.


That doesn't make sense, Muck. PS is meant to edit and manipulate images. I somehow doubt the creators would add tools like 'Liquify' if they didn't want you to have the ability to do some un-natural things. I agree with you that certain pictures (arguably MOST pictures) are far better off when the PS is limited to undetectable subtleties, but the capability to do more was clearly incorporated into the program intentionally.


Well, yeah...duh. You CAN use Photoshop to do digital art. I should have said "if you're using Photoshop correctly as a photo-editing tool..." But if you use "liquify" in an everyday photo, it's going to be obviously manipulated and people are going to question everything else about the photograph. The power of Photoshop is in the ability to subtle-y manipulate certain portions of a photo that improve the photo as a whole, but don't LOOK obviously manipulated.

Fact of the matter is, just BECAUSE Photoshop let's you liquify and ooze and blur and smear and nudge and rotate and squish and twirl and whatever doesn't mean you HAVE to use them. The point of this site is a photography challenge, not a digital art challenge.

Using tools such as Photoshop to create digital art is fine, but that takes it beyond photography and, IMHO, has no place on this site. Those kinds of shots merit a very low score from me.

I think that if we were allowed to spot edit on a regular basis, the digital art submissions would naturally be scored lower as a whole, and people would stop trying to do them. And people would be able to learn a lot more about using Photoshop to manipulate photos in the process.
 11/01/2003 11:15:12 AM · #34
i can only laugh at this silly bickering about a software program
and a challenge that had no rules to follow.

edit

soup

Message edited by author 2003-11-01 11:15:51.
 11/01/2003 11:18:11 AM · #35
Both sides of the argument are equally valid. Some people wanted photoshop to be used to improve a photo, and some people wanted photoshop to be used to create a more surreal halloweeny piece of art, using a photograph as a base. There is no wrong or right, just let people vote on how much they like/dislike the result :)
 11/01/2003 11:23:36 AM · #36
Originally posted by Konador:
some people wanted photoshop to be used to create a more surreal halloweeny piece of art, using a photograph as a base. There is no wrong or right, just let people vote on how much they like/dislike the result :)


That was my point Konador....I wouldn't do what I did on this shot on any other normal photo...but this wasn't meant to be a normal photo. Fun holiday, fun competition, fun shots, fun easing of the rules!
 11/01/2003 11:30:43 AM · #37
I apologize if I sounded shrill. It's difficult to present any kind of differing viewpoint on here without someone thinking you've over-reacted.

My whole point is that I'm frustrated that our opportunities to legally use Photoshop are so limited, that entries (such as my own) that use the tool to enhance an image are drowned out by the number of entries that are, in effect, "digital art."

So, I'm just going to keep doing my own thing and touching up photos for my personal use and submitting whenever I think I can. I have no interest in participating in (or voting on) a digital art challenge. If I did, I'd hang out at Worth1000.
 11/01/2003 11:33:20 AM · #38
I really wanted to enter this challenge but i was to busy trick-or-treating with my daughter. In the past few months i have learned how to use Photoshop's more artsy side and was really hoping for a challenge where i could manipulate a photograph. I think this is a great way for those of us who need to go further into digital photography to learn and grow. I wouln't want all challenges to be like this one, but why not once in a while let us get it out of our systems.
It doesn't take away the fact that we ARE photographers.
 11/01/2003 11:34:05 AM · #39
I know what you mean muck. These challenges are the ones that people always dig up as a reason not to relax the editing rules in open challenges. In that sense I don't think that they're a good idea, but for halloween I think it's good fun to see what people came up with. In a 'normal' challenge (such as still life for example) I wouldn't like to see digital art.
 11/01/2003 11:43:30 AM · #40
i agree completely on everyday pictures, Muck. I only meant to imply that for challenges like this, it's cool. I lightly touch up all my prints, because it can correct for some of my inadequacies as a photographer.
I voted NOT to relax the everyday editing rules, FYI. for all the same reasons you're mentioning about the digital art thing.
Pedro

edit: and yes you did sound a little shrill when you threw the "duh" in there. Not necessary :)

Message edited by author 2003-11-01 11:44:30.
 11/01/2003 12:30:24 PM · #41
Originally posted by grigrigirl:
I wish we could learn more about photoshop through this site...and through non restrictive challenges. I have interesting ideas but have not the know how to accomplish a final result! Ive seen some amazing artwork produced through photography and photoshop combined. Photoshop is a wonderful tool.


I agree with ya! just learning the filters, and what everything else does would be fun too!


Message edited by author 2003-11-01 12:34:58.
 11/01/2003 12:36:39 PM · #42
Please don't get me wrong. I am not Bit{>ing or complaining, just stating my opinion. I use PS ALL the time on my photos. I use it to the maximum allowable in the challenges. When the rules are relaxed, I use the extra possibilities as well. (I used some of them on my entry). I retouch photos after the challenges to "better" my prints. I THINK PS IS AWESOME!

That being said, I just think some people crossed the line between editing a PHOTO a creating a piece of DIGITAL ART. I think this is the reason many people voted not to expand the editing rules.

As far as I think, we are photographers not graphic artists. Yes this was a challenge in which we should have fun, but we should never forget who we are.

Discuss...
 11/01/2003 01:11:25 PM · #43
Originally posted by mariomel:
That being said, I just think some people crossed the line between editing a PHOTO a creating a piece of DIGITAL ART. I think this is the reason many people voted not to expand the editing rules....

I think the appropriate action is to give those photos lower votes. Don't punish people for using the tools, only for using them "inappropriately."
Photoshop doesn't kill photographs, photographers do.

Message edited by author 2003-11-01 14:03:49.
 11/01/2003 01:39:55 PM · #44
Originally posted by Pedro:

edit: and yes you did sound a little shrill when you threw the "duh" in there. Not necessary :)


duh!

(there, I'm done) :)
 11/01/2003 01:42:34 PM · #45
There are plenty of excellent tutorial sites and several truly outstanding books for learning Photoshop. Why fault a site like this one, which has a specific aim, for not "teaching" Photoshop, when there are so many fine resources dedicated to that purpose? Broaden your horizons a little bit. Learn from fellow photographers here; learn from Photoshop experts somewhere else.

Some of the entries in the Halloween challenge--and in the Future challenge, and in any challenge where editing restrictions are removed--are digital art in only the broadest sense of the word "art." Things like composition, color, and subject still matter. When someone posts an image that's just a bunch of "look what I can do with THIS filter," with no sense of balance, scale, and emotion, it's no longer art, any more than any unedited, badly done photograph is.

Removing editing restrictions seems to invite Photoshoppery for the sake of Photoshoppery. Which doesn't help anyone learn anything.
 11/01/2003 02:05:20 PM · #46
Photoshop is just another tool in the digital photographer's toolbox.

It is an interesting departure from the norm to occasionally have a challenge where it's use is not as restricted as in the typical challenge. I don't think every challenge should be that way.

A bad photo will still be a bad photo with or without Photoshop. As my Graphic Design professor used to say, "You can't polish a turd."
 11/01/2003 02:09:09 PM · #47
Originally posted by Spazmo99:
As my Graphic Design professor used to say, "You can't polish a turd."

Sure you can ...

Message edited by author 2003-11-01 14:10:31.
 11/01/2003 02:20:53 PM · #48
Originally posted by muckpond:
i just hate it that people take "no editing restrictions" as a means to go completely overboard.


A lot of sites consider it photography, as long as it started out as a photo. Check out this site I found yesterday
Look under the very first one. "Master Photographer-Black and White Photography" check out the pics

Message edited by author 2003-11-01 14:21:35.
 11/01/2003 02:24:44 PM · #49
I have been here since Feb. 2003 and there has always been someone that did not like each and every challenge or a picture someone else took
Some try to decide how long a person spent on a photo only mind readers can do that. Some don't like comments that are made or what people say about the comments . This all tells me that we are a big variety of people so In my opinion we should have a variety of types of challenges
What one doesn't like another will and we can submit to the ones we like. One other thing it seems we are a group of complaining people,
Sue
11/01/2003 02:28:15 PM · #50
Originally posted by Crafty Sue:
One other thing it seems we are a group of complaining people,
Sue

Yeah, got a complaint about that?
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