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10/26/2006 03:55:29 PM · #1 |
Aside from the obvious price difference (almost half), I'm wondering if there's a functional difference between AlienBees B800 flash unit, and the White Lightning X800. Both are Paul C. Buff products, and both seem to use exactly the same peripherals (stands, hardware, modifiers, softboxes, triggers, and everything else).
Price isn't necessarily a deciding factor for me, but things like size, construction, and so on might be. I see that the B800s are made with plastic bodies, the X800s with metal, for example. I suppose I'm having difficulty understanding any technical or performance difference that might be worthwhile to consider. If anyone has any thoughts, I'd appreciate it. |
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10/26/2006 04:18:46 PM · #2 |
The only $.02 I can add is that I've heard lots of good things about Alien Bees. Unless you're doing hours of shooting at a time, or moving your setup around a lot, I doubt you'll notice a benefit to the metal construction over the plastic .
As far as White Lightning goes, they're what our University photog uses, and they work very well...when they work. Both have been back for repairs, and one of them literally burned up twice in a row. I'm not denouning them, just saying that whatever units you buy, there's potential for issues.
Good luck!
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10/26/2006 04:41:26 PM · #3 |
The X800 has a 250W modeling lamp, compared to the 100W lamp in the B800. The X800 also has a shorter flash duration, slightly more output, and an aluminum case. The X800 costs about $119 more than the B800.
I've never used either of these units (I have B400 units), but I would expect any difference in flash performance to be minimal. The brighter modeling lamp in X800 would be nice to have and is probably the biggest difference between the two. The aluminum case might make a difference to anyone giving them hard use, for instance on location shoots. The design of the X800 case is also more in line with other manufacturer's units. IMHO, the square box shape of the B800 looks kind of goofy.
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10/26/2006 04:42:15 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by OdysseyF22:
The only $.02 I can add is that I've heard lots of good things about Alien Bees. Unless you're doing hours of shooting at a time, or moving your setup around a lot, I doubt you'll notice a benefit to the metal construction over the plastic .
As far as White Lightning goes, they're what our University photog uses, and they work very well...when they work. Both have been back for repairs, and one of them literally burned up twice in a row. I'm not denouning them, just saying that whatever units you buy, there's potential for issues.
Good luck! |
Thanks, that's helpful. I'm not too jazzed about having metal bodies or anything. My current setup is low-end Opus units, all very plastic. Interesting anectode about the White Lightning units, maybe that'll swing my decision. Thanks again. |
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10/26/2006 04:44:10 PM · #5 |
Originally posted by Mick:
The design of the X800 case is also more in line with other manufacturer's units. IMHO, the square box shape of the B800 looks kind of goofy. |
Agreed, though I probably shouldn't let that be a factor. :) Yeah, I forgot about the modeling lamp being more powerful. Thanks for the reminder. |
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10/26/2006 04:46:12 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by Louis:
My current setup is low-end Opus units, all very plastic. |
Honey! You are the king of lighting and you're looking for something different?. Don't fix what's not broken. from the looks of your photos what you have for lighting now is spectacular.
just my two cents. |
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10/26/2006 04:56:21 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by jaded_youth:
Originally posted by Louis:
My current setup is low-end Opus units, all very plastic. |
Honey! You are the king of lighting and you're looking for something different?. Don't fix what's not broken. from the looks of your photos what you have for lighting now is spectacular.
just my two cents. |
That's very sweet and I love you for it, but most people who use flash units would know way more about lights/lighting than me. :) |
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10/26/2006 05:00:02 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by Mick:
The design of the X800 case is also more in line with other manufacturer's units. IMHO, the square box shape of the B800 looks kind of goofy. |
Agreed, though I probably shouldn't let that be a factor. :) Yeah, I forgot about the modeling lamp being more powerful. Thanks for the reminder. |
One thing I don't understand is why it's okay to use a 250W quartz bulb on the X800, but not on the B800. They say that you can go up to a 150W bulb in a B800, but you have to be careful of overheating. Doesn't the 250W bulb in the X800 put out even more heat than a 150W bulb? It may be that the X800 also has a more powerful cooling fan. I guess I'll have to ask them about it.
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10/26/2006 05:01:50 PM · #9 |
BTW I have/use alien bee's, and although I have no experience with the other lights you mentioned I'm VERY happy with the bee's.
hth :) |
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10/26/2006 05:06:31 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by Mick:
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by Mick:
The design of the X800 case is also more in line with other manufacturer's units. IMHO, the square box shape of the B800 looks kind of goofy. |
Agreed, though I probably shouldn't let that be a factor. :) Yeah, I forgot about the modeling lamp being more powerful. Thanks for the reminder. |
One thing I don't understand is why it's okay to use a 250W quartz bulb on the X800, but not on the B800. They say that you can go up to a 150W bulb in a B800, but you have to be careful of overheating. Doesn't the 250W bulb in the X800 put out even more heat than a 150W bulb? It may be that the X800 also has a more powerful cooling fan. I guess I'll have to ask them about it. |
I think they're different kinds of bulbs. The B800 seems to use regular incandescents, and you can go up to a 150W fluorescent. The X800 uses a different non-household bulb (similar to what I have in those Opus units). |
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10/26/2006 05:30:59 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Louis:
I think they're different kinds of bulbs. The B800 seems to use regular incandescents, and you can go up to a 150W fluorescent. The X800 uses a different non-household bulb (similar to what I have in those Opus units). |
Yes, the B800 takes a standard 100W Edison-type base quartz bulb. However, it looks like the 250W bulbs in the X800 use the same base. So, if the cooling fans are the same, you should be able to use the 250W bulbs in a B800. I guess I'll just have to ask them.
BTW, I don't think fluorescent bulbs would work in either unit.
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10/26/2006 05:40:30 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by Mick:
Originally posted by Louis:
I think they're different kinds of bulbs. The B800 seems to use regular incandescents, and you can go up to a 150W fluorescent. The X800 uses a different non-household bulb (similar to what I have in those Opus units). |
Yes, the B800 takes a standard 100W Edison-type base quartz bulb. However, it looks like the 250W bulbs in the X800 use the same base. So, if the cooling fans are the same, you should be able to use the 250W bulbs in a B800. I guess I'll just have to ask them.
BTW, I don't think fluorescent bulbs would work in either unit. |
You're right. I meant 150W halogen bulbs shown in use here. |
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10/26/2006 06:02:23 PM · #13 |
<<< DISCLAIMER >>>
In my earlier post, I stated that a person should be able to use 250W quartz bulbs for the modeling lights in AlienBees flash units. For the record... I DO NOT KNOW THIS FOR A FACT AND DOING SO MAY BE HAZARDOUS. You should check with the manufacturer before making any such modification to your flash unit.
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10/28/2006 03:07:40 PM · #14 |
As a follow up to my previous post, I found this little tidbit in the AlienBees FAQ...
"Q: Is the 150-watt quartz lamp the brightest modeling lamp that I can use?
A: 150 watts is the maximum power recommended for your modeling lamp. This allows the cooling fan to maintain low internal temperatures. It is possible to use a 250-watt quartz lamp if particular care is taken. As a 250-watt bulb produces more heat, you should not operate your flash unit for extended periods of time with this bulb in place. You will need to be cautious when using this bulb, ensuring that there is adequate airflow. Accessories that close around the faceplate (such as a softbox, an octabox, a honeycomb grid or a snoot) may restrict the airflow and trap heat. In these conditions, a 250-watt lamp should not be used. Failure to follow these precautions could cause damage that may not be covered by our warranty."
So, apparently you can use the 250W quartz bulbs on AlienBees B-series units, but you should use the precautions outlined above.
If I can find the 250W bulbs for a decent price, then I may give this a try.
I've sent an email to the AlienBees people asking what the differences are between AlienBees B-series units and White Lightning X-series units regarding cooling and the use of 250W bulbs. When I get a reply I'll post it here, in case anyone is interested.
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10/28/2006 03:46:23 PM · #15 |
If you're looking at White Lightning, I strongly recommend stepping up to the X1600. You get 7 stop range instead of 5, and you can run the light in 1/4 output mode which'll speed up your flash duration.
But the AB00's work fine and they're a great value.
In terms of construction, look elsewhere for accessories. I'm not a fan of Paul Buff modifiers and lightstands - they're not very durable.
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10/28/2006 04:10:00 PM · #16 |
Also look at Paterson Interfit Stellar units. They cost less than AB units by far (a paterson 300ws is less than an AB400 but puts out the same light as an AB800!). and they'll take 250w lights
Same features and the accessories are less costly and you can get them from more than one company since bowens stuff fits as well.
B&H sells them, a 2 light 300WS kit with stands, umbrellas, carry bag is $499.
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10/28/2006 04:41:52 PM · #17 |
Thanks for the input.. I decided to go for the B800s, plus a bunch of accessories. :/ Kind of wish I'd read virtuamike's post before ordering. :) If the accessories are really horrible, I'll send them back. They can't possibly be worse than the Opus crap I've got currently. A gel holder melted after about 15 minutes with the modelling lamp on! (Melting plastic has a nice techno-industrial scent though.)
I wrote to AlienBees asking about any major differences between the two lines, and got an answer that just echoed the websites, though it seemed to be personalized, and was very long and detailed. I had really hoped to understand any functional differences, for example, any shift in output during extended use and the like, but didn't get that. |
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10/30/2006 07:57:05 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by Mick:
As a follow up to my previous post, I found this little tidbit in the AlienBees FAQ...
"Q: Is the 150-watt quartz lamp the brightest modeling lamp that I can use?
A: 150 watts is the maximum power recommended for your modeling lamp. This allows the cooling fan to maintain low internal temperatures. It is possible to use a 250-watt quartz lamp if particular care is taken. As a 250-watt bulb produces more heat, you should not operate your flash unit for extended periods of time with this bulb in place. You will need to be cautious when using this bulb, ensuring that there is adequate airflow. Accessories that close around the faceplate (such as a softbox, an octabox, a honeycomb grid or a snoot) may restrict the airflow and trap heat. In these conditions, a 250-watt lamp should not be used. Failure to follow these precautions could cause damage that may not be covered by our warranty."
So, apparently you can use the 250W quartz bulbs on AlienBees B-series units, but you should use the precautions outlined above.
If I can find the 250W bulbs for a decent price, then I may give this a try.
I've sent an email to the AlienBees people asking what the differences are between AlienBees B-series units and White Lightning X-series units regarding cooling and the use of 250W bulbs. When I get a reply I'll post it here, in case anyone is interested. |
Okay, I received the following reply from AlienBees regarding my question about using 250W bulbs on their B-series units...
"The Bees and the White-Lightning’s do all have a built in cooling fanâ€Â¦the reason we don’t recommend using the 250w model lamp in the Bees for long periods of times is the way the heat is dissipated throughout the unit. With the Bees the front panel being metal and the housing on the Bees being plastic the heat does not distribute as wellâ€Â¦The front plate on the x series is metal but since the housing is metal as well it draws the heat awayâ€Â¦"
Whould any of you care to volunteer to see how long you can run a 250W bulb on an AlienBees monolight before it bursts into flames? I'd really like to know. :D
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11/03/2006 08:50:45 PM · #19 |
| So I went with the ABs, and they arrived today: 2 B800s with 13' stands, large softbox, the lightmod system with gels, honeycomb filters, and the radio trigger. I've tested everything and it works great. The hardware doesn't seem too poorly put together to me, but then, I've been using low-end Opus for a while, and anything's better than that. I'll hopefully be putting it all through its paces this weekend. |
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11/03/2006 09:10:18 PM · #20 |
Hey, way to go, Louis! My first 2 AB400s are over 3 years old now and have been used TONS and (knock on wood) I've yet to replace a strobe bulb. Adding another or two or three more along the way is easy too 'cause everything gets along!
Now the important question.... what color?? Mine are pink! :P
Message edited by author 2006-11-03 21:10:55.
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11/03/2006 09:26:29 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by idnic:
Hey, way to go, Louis! My first 2 AB400s are over 3 years old now and have been used TONS and (knock on wood) I've yet to replace a strobe bulb. Adding another or two or three more along the way is easy too 'cause everything gets along!
Now the important question.... what color?? Mine are pink! :P |
Mello yello baby. :) |
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11/04/2006 10:21:30 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Originally posted by idnic:
Hey, way to go, Louis! My first 2 AB400s are over 3 years old now and have been used TONS and (knock on wood) I've yet to replace a strobe bulb. Adding another or two or three more along the way is easy too 'cause everything gets along!
Now the important question.... what color?? Mine are pink! :P |
Mello yello baby. :) |
Good! Ours won't get confused when we go on tour with our studio workshop! ;)
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11/04/2006 11:32:16 AM · #23 |
| I am so signing up for that one! ;-D |
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11/04/2006 11:47:19 AM · #24 |
| First stop: Iceland 2007. :) |
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11/04/2006 11:58:29 AM · #25 |
Yeah, Iceland. Let's go teach those kids a thing or two! ;)
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