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09/20/2006 01:45:15 PM · #1 |
1 - Is there a light stand attachment that will allow me to shoot both of my flashes into one umbrella?
Is it this thing?
2 - Will it actually double my flash output?
I have a 420ex and a 430ex and the ST-E2. I want to try some portraits outside at night (see  arnit and larus for examples) and I'm thinking I'm going to need more power than a single flash can give me. Has anyone ever done this (2 flashes into one umbrella)?
I do not own studio strobes, and don't plan to buy them (for a while).
Thanks for your thoughts :) |
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09/20/2006 02:04:38 PM · #2 |
Speaking from a standpoint of knowing, well, not much about flashes, I see no reason why this wouldn't work. Twice the amount of light emitted should double the output from the umblella. The mount you linked to doesn't look like it will work, at least not without some sort of adaptors. But any way you can get them both next to each other in the umbrella ought to work. (I think)
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09/20/2006 02:58:40 PM · #3 |
| I have 2 light stands, so I could just place them next to each other firing into the umbrella, but I figured there must be a better way. |
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09/20/2006 03:13:55 PM · #4 |
How far away are you going to be ... why don't you think one will be enough?
Here's what I would do: 1) stick one flash and umbrella right behind you (close to the camera axis), this will be your fill light, and 2) place the other flash and umbrella off to the side - about 45 degrees for a single person portrait. This is your main light. If you're shooting groups of 2 or more people then, the larger the group, the closer you pull it back towards the camera to avoid shadows from one person affecting the lighting on another.
In order for the main light to be stronger than your fill light (since they have nearly equal output and since the ST-E2 probably doesn't let you adjust lighting ratios the way a 550EX or 580EX can), you'll simply place the main light closer to the people than the fill light.
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09/20/2006 03:15:03 PM · #5 |
Originally posted by hopper:
I have 2 light stands, so I could just place them next to each other firing into the umbrella, but I figured there must be a better way. |
You have the flexibility to experiment with comparisons between having them close together, a small distance apart, or on opposite sides; left/right, top/bottom, etc.
Why not make a series with a fixed subject (e.g. typical still-life) and educate us all : ) |
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09/20/2006 03:17:04 PM · #6 |
I just thought of something: both flashes need to be able to see your ST-E2. That's one drawback to Canon's wireless versus something like a PocketWizard (using radio frequencies) and strobes.
Since you will be outside, the chance of reflected light reaching both flashes is pretty slim. So... both lights will need to be in front of your camera so that they can see the output of the ST-E2.
That's okay, just put a longer lens on the camera and keep a hood on it to avoid spillage of light from your fill light.
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09/20/2006 03:28:30 PM · #7 |
I thought of 2 umbrellas, one for fill, but I don't want two shadows - which led me to the "one strong light" conclusion. The ST-E2 does allow different outputs for 2 different flash groups.
Seems I'm going to have to do some test runs. The wife just LOVES wasting time.
:-) |
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09/20/2006 04:41:11 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by hopper:
Seems I'm going to have to do some test runs. The wife just LOVES wasting time.
:-) |
I suggest experimenting with some poses which involve smelling flowers or eating chocolate ... : ) |
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09/20/2006 07:05:56 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by hopper:
I thought of 2 umbrellas, one for fill, but I don't want two shadows - which led me to the "one strong light" conclusion. The ST-E2 does allow different outputs for 2 different flash groups. |
That's why the fill light is right along the axis of the camera. No shadow! :-)
Meanwhile, the main light still casts a shadow by virtue of being off to the side. And it is this shadow that defines the three dimensional form of the subject when captured in a two dimensional picture. So you want shadows... you just want to control them. And again, that's where the fill light comes in. It softens and controls the shadows created by the main light.
Make sense?
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09/20/2006 07:34:26 PM · #10 |
Here is a quick example of a group shot with the main light on camera-left (about 45 degrees up and 45 degrees to the subject's right) with the fill light right behind the camera.
It's not the greatest pose, but ... you can definitely see that there are, in fact, shadows from one girl to the next. But the fill light is softening those shadows. Meanwhile, the shadows that are along the features of their faces have turned a two-dimensional image into a three-dimensional image.
I also had a hair light on the right side of image, but that light isn't falling on the front of them at all.
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09/20/2006 07:39:47 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by hopper:
1 - Is there a light stand attachment that will allow me to shoot both of my flashes into one umbrella?
Is it this thing?
2 - Will it actually double my flash output?
I have a 420ex and a 430ex and the ST-E2. I want to try some portraits outside at night (see arnit and larus for examples) and I'm thinking I'm going to need more power than a single flash can give me. Has anyone ever done this (2 flashes into one umbrella)?
I do not own studio strobes, and don't plan to buy them (for a while).
Thanks for your thoughts :) |
I don't know if this helps but I was thinking about multiple flashes and guide numbers once in this thread,
Originally posted by that thread:
"For multiple flash, the GN of the combined guide number is the square root of the sum of the squares of the GN of each individual flash" from here
So, in the case stated in the original post,
20^2 + 20^2 = 800 and the square root of 800 is ~28.3 so my new GN would be about 28m (84ft) @ ISO 100
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09/20/2006 07:49:31 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by hopper:
1 - Is there a light stand attachment that will allow me to shoot both of my flashes into one umbrella?
Is it this thing?
2 - Will it actually double my flash output?
I have a 420ex and a 430ex and the ST-E2. I want to try some portraits outside at night (see arnit and larus for examples) and I'm thinking I'm going to need more power than a single flash can give me. Has anyone ever done this (2 flashes into one umbrella)?
I do not own studio strobes, and don't plan to buy them (for a while).
Thanks for your thoughts :) |
1. You can use that. Or you could save money and tape the flashes together. Bungee cords would work too.
2. In theory, double the flashes means double the output, which means you'll get 1 extra stop. Whether or not that's enough output for what you want to do, I don't know. You could probably get more output by just shooting direct instead of bouncing off the umbrella or moving the light closer.
And remember, output vs coverage are 2 different issues. If anything, 2 flashes into one umbrella at night would be overkill.
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