To Color or Not To Color? - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

09/13/2006 11:19:05 PM · #1

Okay, nearly every single one of my comments in the "Simple Pleasures" challenge said the same thing -- that I shouldn't have made this picture black and white.

I just wanted to clarify that the ice cream was black and white to begin with! It was chocolate chip! The cookies were an ugly brown, and the background was red!!! If you had seen the original in color, you would have made it black and white too.

Just had to clear things up. Thanks for letting me vent! ;-)

Twyla

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

09/13/2006 11:30:02 PM · #2

that doesn't look like ice cream ... ;)

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

09/13/2006 11:30:20 PM · #3

To get punch in a B & W image it needs to have contrast. This image is lacking in contrast.

There is some good texture in the image but it get's lost in the shadows. I realize that an increase in exposure would most likely blow the highlights so some PP is in order to bring up the contrast.

parrothead

Canon EOS-40D

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX Aspherical DF for Canon

09/13/2006 11:31:56 PM · #4

Definately need color in my opinion! It look like a concrete mess in the thumbnail. But what the heck do I know? Its all about the learning process!

crayon

09/13/2006 11:35:41 PM · #5

black and white makes your ice-cream look like mud (I have an even worse name to call it actually, lol). keeping it in colour (even if the colours are ugly) is better than letting it appear like mud.

09/14/2006 12:14:39 AM · #6

How about something like this? Contrast masking for more luminosity in the shadows, some local burning to clean the BG up, some dodging on the cookie upper left, some cloning of flaws on the ice cream, a little neat image, and colorizing with a hue/sat layer:

Robt.

Promaster 28-200mm f/3.8-5.6 XR IF

09/14/2006 01:21:48 AM · #7

Originally posted by SquishyB:

Okay, nearly every single one of my comments in the "Simple Pleasures" challenge said the same thing -- that I shouldn't have made this picture black and white.

This image makes a perfectly good B&W:

Low contrast and some technical improvements are all it needs.

Additional Post:
1-Noise reduction
2-Standard Levels - Add mask to retain cream tonality
3-Curves for mid-tone contrast
4-Selective Color for brightness - Add mask to retain cream tonality
5-Minor cloning

atupdate

Pentax K-R

09/14/2006 06:36:38 AM · #8

Bear and Steve,

Nice work on this image but try to save it using Basic rules like he was handcuffed with.

Tim

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

09/14/2006 08:56:38 AM · #9

yes, there is SO much more I could do with it using advanced rules. unfortunately that wasn't the case! I would love to see what you can do with just the basic rules.

Konador

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

09/14/2006 09:08:58 AM · #10

Quick attempt under basic.

Shadows/Highlights
Levels
Gaussian Blur + Fade to 20%(ish)
Unsharp Mask on High Radius to enhance contrast
Levels
Hue/Sat
Shadows/Highlights
Smart Sharpen

09/14/2006 09:54:46 AM · #11

Originally posted by atupdate:

Bear and Steve,

Nice work on this image but try to save it using Basic rules like he was handcuffed with.

Tim

Good point... Here is basic version:

Not much difference. Mostly the cloned out specks and a little tonality on top of the cream is all that is lost. Advanced rules usually only tweak things a little anyway.

Post:
1-Noise Reduction
2-Standard Levels with midpoint adjust (no mask)
3-Standard Curves for mid-tone contrast (no mask)
4-Color Selection for black, midtone and white adjustments
5-Sharpen

09/14/2006 10:49:08 AM · #12

Konodor inspired me to do my own CS2 specific version for basic:

The other basic version I did works for older versions of PS and other image editors. This one brings out even more detail.

CS2 specific Post Processing:
1-Noise Reduction
2-Shadow/Highlight on duplicate layer
3-Standard Levels
4-Standard Curves for mid-tone contrast
5-Selective Color for additional mid-tone and contrast adjust
6-Smart Sharpen

Message edited by author 2006-09-14 10:49:33.

09/14/2006 11:41:03 AM · #13

Nothing in mine that wouldn't be legal in basic except the cloning and the burning/dodging. While it would be nice to remove the BG distractions, you can't do that in basic obviously, and it's not the major issue anyway. The "contrast masking" is basic-legal if you use CS2 shadow/highlight adjustment (same thing, automated) and it can, in any case, be emulated with careful curves work.

Steve Davidson's version above shows that quite clearly :-)

Robt.

09/14/2006 01:03:28 PM · #14

I guess I need a course in all the bells and whistles of PhotoShop Elements. I thought I knew how to do stuff, but your pictures come out much more impressive than mine! I'm also still unclear on what exactly is allowed for basic editing. I've only been doing levels & sharpen. Is there a list somewhere that outlines that specifically?

09/14/2006 01:14:14 PM · #15

Originally posted by SquishyB:

It's not possible to have a "specific" list because there are so many editing programs out there, all with different tools and nomenclature.

Using PS Elements, you will be safe if you work with hue/saturation, brightness/contrast, selective color, curves, and levels, all available in the image adjustments menu. You can also use any of the Elements sharpening tools, available in the filters menu under "sharpening", and you can use gaussian blur, which is in the filters menu under "blur".

Bear in mind that any of these adjustments must be applied to the image as a whole in basic editing; you are expressly forbidden from selecting a portion of the image with any selection tool and working on that portion separately.

(These "locations" for the tools are where they live in PS 7.0 in the menu bar; I think Elements names them and locates them the same way. If not, someone will correct me.)

Robt.

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

09/14/2006 01:20:25 PM · #16

Thanks for all the help, Bear. That will definitely improve future entries! Now I just need to learn how to use them all! ;-)

Edit: I can't find selective color or curves. Can anyone help me out?

Message edited by author 2006-09-14 13:26:51.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

09/14/2006 01:39:03 PM · #17

Originally posted by SquishyB:

Edit: I can't find selective color or curves. Can anyone help me out?

Curves was left out of Elements. If you have PSE 3, there's a book/CD on using it which includes a Curves plugin.

09/14/2006 11:13:27 PM · #18

What about selective color?

Sigma 18-200mm f/3.5-6.3 DC OS for Canon

09/14/2006 11:29:41 PM · #19

I don't know; you need someone who uses Elements to advise you; I never have...

Robt.

ElGordo

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/14/2006 11:38:36 PM · #20

Dude, if your composition looks like a pile of dung, nothing can much save it. In this case, color would have at least made the subject recognizeable as cookies and ice cream.

yanko

Carl Zeiss 50mm ZE f/1.4 Planar T for Canon

09/14/2006 11:40:13 PM · #21

Originally posted by SquishyB:

Thanks for all the help, Bear. That will definitely improve future entries! Now I just need to learn how to use them all! ;-)

Edit: I can't find selective color or curves. Can anyone help me out?

Selective color and curves are not in that version of photoshop. Now, I have never tried this since I have photoshop cs2 but here is a link to download a "curves" and "selective color" adjustment plugins that can be used in Elements. They are suppose to work the same so try them out.

ETA: It also comes with Channel Mixer which is another highly used tool people use.

Message edited by author 2006-09-14 23:45:01.

crayon

09/14/2006 11:45:43 PM · #22

Originally posted by ElGordo:

Dude, if your composition looks like a pile of dung, nothing can much save it. In this case, color would have at least made the subject recognizeable as cookies and ice cream.

he said what I wanted to but held back in my initial reply, lol

09/15/2006 08:55:40 AM · #23

Originally posted by ElGordo:

Dude, if your composition looks like a pile of dung, nothing can much save it. In this case, color would have at least made the subject recognizeable as cookies and ice cream.

Sheesh. Don't hold back, gordo! Tell us how you really feel!!

09/15/2006 11:01:47 AM · #24

OK... One last version of this image in honor of what ElGordo thinks of it (Dung imagery has its charm)

An Elements version using Levels only...

...

Post:
1-Noise Reduction
2-Levels (With above settings)
3-Sharpen