Nikon/Canon - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

09/07/2006 04:46:16 PM · #1

I know it's the old Chevy vs. Ford type discussion but I am truly torn here. I'm getting to a point where I'll be able to upgrade all of my equipment and I need some serious advice on switching to Canon. I was going to go with a D200 and D2Xs with all new glass. I keep getting suggestions from my peers to switch to Canon. I'm familiar with Nikon but very frustrated with my D70 and D70s. I'm hoping the Nikon upgrade will cure my issues but also wooried I could make a mistake.
Without starting a riot can I get some un-biased advice on this issue.
As far as Canon, I would go with the MarkII (not sure which model) and something equal to a D200 as a backup. Thanx

Nick

violinist123

Canon EOS-6D

09/07/2006 04:47:57 PM · #2

Sounds like you've got enough money not to worry about it, but if it is a consideration I would stick with whatever body works with all the glass you have. Why dump everything and start over? There's no difference between either manufacturer to warrant that.

talmy

Nikon D300s

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 16-85 f/3.5-5.6G ED VR

09/07/2006 04:49:17 PM · #3

Might help if you said what your frustrations were with the D70. Then people could tell you if the D200/D2X or a Canon would solve them.

I'll add that there is also the possibility that your frustrations are just a matter of technique and you might not need a new body at all.

Message edited by author 2006-09-07 16:54:41.

jfriesen

Panasonic LUMIX GH5

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

09/07/2006 04:50:34 PM · #4

These types of questions usually end in people asking you your particular needs in a camera, and any peeves you may have with certain limitations of both of the cameras.

Basically, I would suggest, don't dump your glass. The D200 I've heard is great. The D80 is cheaper with a lot of the D200 features.

darnok

Nikon D850

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 16-35 f/4 ED VR

09/07/2006 04:51:44 PM · #5

I have a Sony P&S and a Pentax manual film SLR so I'm pretty unbiased. You should stay with what you have, Canon and Nikon are pretty evenly matched. There's no reason to waste a lot of money selling everthing and buying new gear.

fotomann_forever

09/07/2006 04:58:03 PM · #6

I wouldn't pass a judgement on the D200 or especially the D2X based on the D70.

The D2X is in a completely different league than the D70 and the D200 is a differnt level of camera also.

sea2c

Canon EOS-50D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8

09/07/2006 05:06:57 PM · #7

All I can say is that with the current lines, if I get to the point of making money doing this thing I'd be switching to Canon.

Having said that, if you do make the move just remember I have dibs on your 80-200!

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

Canon RF 24-70mm f/2.8 L IS

09/07/2006 05:12:45 PM · #8

I assume that with the bodies you're considering that you are or will be a working pro. I do see a lot of switchin' going on in those circles, and it's more toward Canon than Nikon.
I don't think that there's any huge advantage in glass in either system, but there are differences in body performance. In particular, if low-light performance is key to your work then Canon bodies are going to provide one to two stops advantage, no doubt about it. If you're shooting wedding work, for instance, and you want large, detailed prints of existing-light shots, the canon FF bodies (1DsMkII and 5D) are second to none.
The controls and features on Canon vs. Nikon are really not worth debating. There's the myth that Nikon has better ergonomics, but really it's all what you are used to. I will say the the Canon 1-series bodies do have a funky "double-button-press" control scheme to avoid accidental changes that takes some getting used to, but that's about the only tangible ergonomics issue I can point to.
you seem to have at this point only one Nikon lens that is a big-dollar item, and that could be resold for a high fraction of the original price. the pain involved in switching seems to be minimal for yoru situation, should you decide it makes sense for you.
Weather sealing is another oft-referred-to difference, with Nikon having it lower in their body line. But then you need weather sealed lenses as well to gain any benefit, and there are less of those in the Nikon line than Canon. In the end, there's no great advantage to either system as far as robustness to weather conditions.

robshookphoto

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 28mm f/1.8 USM

09/07/2006 05:58:37 PM · #9

there are the advantages kirbic mentioned for if you go pro, but also, canon is better for sports. the 1d mark II shoots 8.5 fps at 8 mp, the d2x shoots 8 at 6 mp. the fps rate isnt a big difference, but when combied with the lower megapixels, it is the reason most sports photographers shoot canon.

renefunk

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

09/07/2006 06:19:12 PM · #10

i think that canon is the only beetween these to that have a camara with full frame.
full frame kick ass

doctornick

Apple iPhone 13 Pro

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

09/07/2006 06:54:51 PM · #11

The question you have to ask yourself is what is it that you want to improve and what are your needs. If you want Huge files with great High ISO performance then the Canon 5D and 1Ds II cannot be beat by anyone yet. It all depends on what you want to do and what you see is limiting your progress.

Baxter

Nikon D500

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-140mm f/3.5-5.6G VR

09/07/2006 07:09:37 PM · #12

Are you only buying a camera, or a camera system. If the answer is system (and why else would you buy a DSLR) then look at the entire system. Lenses, flash and all the other accessories that you may want or need in the future. In my opinion the Nikon cameras (D200 and the D2X are as good as or better in some ways as Canon. The Nikon flash system is better. But Canon has a larger selection of lenses and a better selection of pro ("L") lens. If you look at Nikon's latest bunch of lenses (18-200, 18-135....) and the latest cameras (D50, D80) it looks to me Nikon is focusing on consumer grade equipment and not on high end pro grade equipment. Only you can decide as to which system will best meet your needs now and in the future.

Tamron 70-180mm F/2.8 Di III VXD

09/07/2006 08:17:39 PM · #13

I guess a little more info was in order.

I am going to upgrade my glass to VR or IS anyway I go.

I will be shooting a lot more sports (pro and college level) and I've been doing a lot of low light stuff. I bought a new SB800 and it'll be hard to let that go ( highly recommend ). As far as my issues with the D70...

Too damn slow. I've way out grown the 3 burst rate and it's auto focus gets lost WAY too easy. Can't tell you how many times I set up for a shot of a QB or receiver only to get the lame fan behind them or the back of some DB or DL. It has been a great camera and I can't beat up on it for getting me where I am but I can blame it for keeping me where I'm at. (Make sense?)I've had issues with the WB in the D70 also. I figure if I'm going to upgrade my glass and cameras it would make sense to atleast consider going to Canon.

MadMan2k

Sony Alpha a6400

09/07/2006 08:24:14 PM · #14

Most of the sports shooters use Canon, their telephoto lineup is great. Get a 1DMk2N and 300 2.8IS and you'll probably have the best AF you can get now.

hokie

Nikon D2X

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

09/07/2006 08:27:20 PM · #15

My story may be a bit long but I think it is a good account for people thinking of going for pro gear.

I am a marketing and advertising consultant. If you look at my bio you can see who I have worked for. I do not consider myself a professional photographer. I don't make my living using a camera. However, I am fortunate to work with top professionals from all walks of the photography world.

When I was working for Media General (they own a ton of TV and Newpapers) I found myself in need of a digital camera for basic public relations and advertising duty. That is how I came to DP Challenge, to learn more about digital. At the same time I became a regular at DP Review and about 4 other sites to learn more. I bought a Canon G2 at the time because I liked the feel, it was well rated for image quality and the swivel lcd really was helpful.

As I grew more interested in digital photography over the 4 years I owned the Canon G2 I considered a DSLR but I just didn't feel anything at the time offered me a significant improvement over the G2 for all the money they wanted. During that time, I became the national advertising director for The Washington Times National Weekly Edition and found myself needing a camera that allowed more flexibility and bigger files. At that time I was sure I was going to buy Canon gear. I kept up with all the Canon information, was saving my money for a Canon 1Ds and was ready to pull the trigger.

Well, about a year ago I was hired away from The Washington Times by one of the companies that produced a lot of the national print advertising for companies like Bank of America, BMW and Proctor and Gamble, etc..

Those guys were true pros, there were about 6 staff photographers. Half had Nikon and half had Canon. As I said, I had been saving my money for 3 years for a Pro-DSLR kit. I was so sure I was going Canon there really wasn't any other thought in my head.

Then there came an assignment to cover an event for one of our advertisers and none of our staff photographers could make it. I said something about me being able to shoot it if I had the right gear. Well, the owner of the company said "Choose what you think you need out of the stockroom and go for it!"

It just so happened the owner was a Nikon hardcore and he ahd everything. So, I packed up a Nikon D2x, about $30,000 worth of lenses and other gear and he gave me a crash course in using that Nikon D2x.

My point in writing this book up to this point..to set the stage.

I shot that event and the photos I got from that event were awesome. The camera felt as if it were an extension of my hand. It was fast when I needed fast, it was hi resolution, I could change my settings so easy on the fly through the viewfinder and intuitive.

Did it have a some more noise than the Canon 1D's when shooting iso 1600 and iso 3200..yes. If I pushed outside the proper exposure settings I could make out some luminence noise but chroma noise stayed super low. Which meant that Iso 1600 still looked better than iso 400 speed film and iso 800 and below were as good as anything out there from any brand.

I went out 2 weeks later and spent my savings on Nikon gear.

Now, I shoot for all types of jobs. I have had photos in Blue Note, Bike Magazine, Vanity Fair, The Washington Times and a lot of smaller publications.

I am not nearly as good as Kiwiness or Manny Librodo or Grigrigirl or Dr. Jones. They do things with their Nikons that I wish I could do someday.

I absolutely believe, without a doubt, that Canon and Nikon are a personal choice now...there is not a whit of difference for 99% of all photgraphic situations and I could show you any type of photo known to mankind shot with a Nikon that will be as good as any Canon and vice versa. Anyone that says something significantly different I would not trust.

Message edited by author 2006-09-07 20:30:41.

EricMGB1974

Nikon D700

Nikon MF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 AIS

09/07/2006 08:59:24 PM · #16

First, having recently gone from the D70 to a D200 I can say that it will definitely address the issues you have with the D70.

One other thing to consider, though, is support and reliability. Maybe it's because there are more Canons out there, but it certainly does seem that I see a significantly larger number of "My camera died..." threads for Canons than I see for Nikons. Also, in talking with the owner of my local camera store when I was looking for my first dSLR, he seemed to feel that Nikon backed their products better and longer. He is an authorized dealer for both Nikon and Canon, and actually carries and sells more Canon equipment at present. According to him Canon drops support for discontinued products fairly quickly and it can be very difficult or impossible to get repairs or service on older Canon gear after it's discontinued. Nikon, on the other hand, is still able and willing to repair even older manual focus bodies and lenses as long as parts are still available.

If that's incorrect, I'd have no problem with being corrected, but I trust the person I got it from and don't see where he would have had incentive to make it up. He would have made a lot more money off me if I had traded my Nikon gear for Canon, and at the time we discussed this that was a definite possibility.

Message edited by author 2006-09-07 20:59:56.

Carl Zeiss 35mm ZF f/2.0 Distagon T

09/07/2006 09:46:23 PM · #17

Well a little more research and this what I found...

My editor at the newspaper did a little checking with the 42 other papers Lee Publications owns and found that by far more used Canon and seemed to submit less repair tabs than those with Nikon. Interesting being there were more Canon based papers. You would think the opposite considering the odds. I also checked with the local Calumet rental manager and they seem to submit more Nikon repairs than Canon. Again they rent more Canon than Nikon so one would think it would be the opposite here also. Anyway just wanted to add a bit more food to this thread and thank everybody for their comments. I am REALLY struggeling with this decision. I switched from Canon film (T70) to Nikon digital (D70 D70s). This however will either way be a $14,000 decision. I really need to get this one right. Again thank you so much for helping me out. And yes very shortly I will have some Nikon gear for sale either way.

virtuamike

Nikon D2X

09/08/2006 03:51:06 AM · #18

Originally posted by jtf6agent:

A few things.

VR and IS are great for low light shooting in situations where you can drop your shutter speed. It's not as practical shooting sports especially when you need to keep your shutter speed up and need instant responsiveness (in the time it takes for the gyros to spin up, you may miss the moment). At the very least rent some VR/IS glass first and try it out, and see if it's something you want to pay for.

And when shooting sports, getting your timing down will help far more than sheer fps. Bursting is not a guarantee for getting good shots. Regarding focus issues, if the sport allows it then you're better off letting the action come to you rather than trying to track the action. Again if you'd like to see if having a more precise AF system will make a difference then rent a body for a day or 2, but sports photography did exist prior to all these different AF modes.

Yes, the D70 auto WB can go nutty in anything other than daylight. But going with the D200 or D2x won't be much of an improvement if you deal a lot with artificial lighting. The D70 is spot on if you use manual WB though, and unless you're in situations where you're mixing color temps constantly then it won't take too much time to just take a reading.

Bottom line, while it's nice to have the latest and greatest, don't blame the D70 for holding you down. If you're getting assignments then rent or borrow and try stuff out, but don't sink $14,000 into this blindly. People have done a lot more with a lot less.

mist

Canon EOS-60D

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

09/08/2006 04:23:27 AM · #19

Wow. That all sounds like big money to me.

If I were in that position, I'd be massively tempted to rent both the intended bodies and a selection of lenses, then take both on your next shoot(s). One or t'other is sure to come out as being your "favourite".

FireBird

09/08/2006 11:42:44 AM · #20

Originally posted by jfriesen:

Basically, I would suggest, don't dump your glass. The D200 I've heard is great. The D80 is cheaper with a lot of the D200 features.

Yeah, what he said. You'll take a big hit selling your glass. You have an excellent opportunity now if you're quick. Buy a D80 and if you don't like it, sell it. D80's will be in short supply for a while and you'll get almost all your money in a re-sell on eBay. Finding one right now might be the problem. With the D200 BestBuy And Circuit City were the places to check regularly, if you can stand dealing with them. ;)

cryan

Nikon D700

Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 EX DG Macro for Nikon

09/08/2006 12:02:40 PM · #21

I too shoot weddings and a lot of sports, college level. The D200 has performed flawlessly for me. The WB has not been an issue, i too had the same problem with the D70. My advise would be to go with the D2xs or D200, you won't regret it. You could also wait till the end of the year ad see what both Nikon and Canon are coming out with, both pro bodies are getting up there is age (for digital anyway). Now with all that said, I'm not against Canon, I've just been shooting Nikon for about 15 years and am very used to the system. I have used Canons both film and digital, I don't like how they feel in my hand but thats a personnal issue. If you are looking for low light shooting Canon does have better noise performance but the D200 and D2xs do far better than film at higher ISO's. Try them both and have fun doing it, let us know what you decide.

FireBird

09/08/2006 12:04:32 PM · #22

Originally posted by kirbic:

There's the myth that Nikon has better ergonomics, but really it's all what you are used to.

Ergonomics are subjective, depending on the physical characteristics of the person involved and their tastes.
For me Nikon ergonomics wasn't a myth. I picked up my
D70 out of the box and went outside to take pics of the
moon. In the dark, without even reading the manual,
my fingers naturally went to the right buttons. My D200
is even a little better in this aspect.
The above being said I'd really like to try a 20D or
30D with a nice 200mm zoom for a while. This would
help me dispel the myth that Canons are not very
ergonomic. Since I've noticed that Canon owners seem
to want to convert Nikon owners, maybe I'll luck up and
one of these Canon evangelists will loan me their kit for
a month or two. I'm sure I'd become a convert. ;)
Just PM me if you'd like to help me out. ;)

Bugzeye

Fisher Price Kid-Tough Digital

09/08/2006 12:09:29 PM · #23

Get the best you can afford but think it through before you dive in.
the D2Xs is an awesome camera our local paper has 3 full time photographers each of them has a collection of Nikon gear. I know the main photographer switched over from Canon during the Digital transition of the news paper. Last time I talked to him he said the D2Xs is the best camera he has ever owned this was about 3 weeks ago.