Good News and I'm asking for advice

06/08/2006 07:23:15 PM · #1

So my friend and I have decided to start a photography business here in Delaware. Right now we're just trying to build a portfolio and get some gigs to do cheap for expirience. We have secured a local wedding and we're doing it for next to nothing but it'll be good for us in the long run. Anyway, I also just graduated from the University of Delaware with a degree in Music performance (which doesn't get you any work I might add D:< ) so I have a little bit of money from graduation presents to spend, about $1100. Now despite my inability to get a job and pay my rent and other various bills i'm looking to invest this money to further my photography business. Ah, you might say, but what kind of business exactly? Well... I don't want to release too much information until we have somewhat of a hold in the market, but part of it will be doing weddings and events, and part will be a small traveling studio setup for portraits. I have a few options right now in terms of equipment I can buy so here is where i was looking for advice. I may also be able to get a small loan later to help setup a studio later.

As you can see by my name i'm shooting with the old skool 1D 4.1mp camera which is a tank and has treated me well. One option would be to sell this camera for as much as I can, and then invest the rest of the money + that money into a 1DmkII which is pretty much my dream camera right now. This would leave NO money left over for anything else.

note: one of my reasons for wanting this upgrade is because of battery life and High iso performance. The 1D gets only about 300 shots with two batteries, and the new version of the camera can get 3-4 times more life per charge. I have considered the 20/30D but I simply love the 1-series and i'd like to stick to it.

Other things i'd probably need for a wedding if I didn't upgrade my camera: A battery system for my camera costing a few hundred dollars, possibly one that can power both the camera and the flash unit at the same time. Either way I'd probably need a flash battery pack or at least 3 sets of charged batteries for each event. I have no zoom in the 24-100 range and I think that a tamron 28-75 2.8 would be a great addition to my lenses especially for a wedding situation.

I may be missing a few key things and please give me any oppinions or advice you have.

oh and for those saying "you need a backup camera" because I don't have one... I have something better, another photographer who will always be shooting with me, and he does have a backup camera if it becomes absolutely necessary.

Thanks in advance!

06/08/2006 07:37:04 PM · #2

oh and while it pains me just to think about it, I might consider selling the 80-200L 2.8 Magical Drainpipe.

06/08/2006 08:39:26 PM · #3

anyone have any thoughts at all?

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

06/08/2006 08:44:10 PM · #4

While everyone has their own style, if you study up on what the bigger name photogs use, or haunt the forums of work a day wedding photogs you'll find something like this:

wide - 16-35/17-40 or tamron 17-50 or sigma 18-50 2.8
70-200 2.8 (canon IS version preferred but any will do)
usually a 50 1.4 and some like 85 1.8/1.2.
fisheye, and a 10-22/12-24
for the reception any of the above or the 24-105 f4 IS would be nice.

Run two bodies - one with the wide and one with the 70-200. have 1 to 2 more for backup. 20D works fine, 30D is the new one. 5D is the cat's meow for this and the 1Ds just a luxury. A 20D or 30D will do an entire wedding on a 1 battery. have backups of course, but rarely needed if you start with a fresh one. And maybe a backup lens or two - they do fail and get dropped...

10Gb of CF cards, perhaps more if you want backup cards.

Flash...Metz 54 or 70, quantum T4d or a canon 580 - and well, backup for all of it. and batteries. and backups for batteries. battery packs are hokum. handy i guess, but not needed. a 2400mah set of AAs will shoot a wedding, and if you change them going into the reception you'll never have a problem. A vivitar 285 or sigma EF500 will work also, but the first is oldschool and the other a budget unit (and i;m getting one for backup - affordable for that).

For strobes - all kinds of choices, but you HAVE to radio fire them, so figure either the quantum or pocket wizard units - and you need a receiver for EVERY strobe. (too many guests use flash and that will trigger your strobes if set to fire optically slaved.). and backups.
you can do pack and heads, battery units or plug in the wall. all have their pluses and minuses. one full set of 120v units and one of battery units is best - one backs up the other and you're good for either need.

Other things that suck money: brides want to see pictures of brides. they want to see sample albums. they want to see BIG prints, framed. to sell it you have to show it, to show it you have to buy it. Figure $500 to $1000 invested in samples, depending on how deep you want to get into it and what level of stuff you want to sell. A nice (empty) artleather album will cost you $90, 1/2 off as a studio sample - add in the sample cameo, gilded edges and monogram (show to sell) and that ups it $40. If you want White Glove, well, an empty album is $950. You should have a couple of regular albums, and some parents albums...130+130+60+50 - and prints for in the pages is $200 maybe, so $540 there. and if you meet the client at a starbux, fine, but you need something better than a cardboard box to carry it all in...

I have invested about $8,000 so far, and have another $5 grand to go easy (no pocket wizrds, more lenses and i already had the computer)

So $1100 won't go far. Hell, just an ad on TheKnot.com is $1400 a year.

thegrandwazoo

Nikon D750

06/08/2006 08:45:25 PM · #5

I am not a canon guy but were I you...I get the 20D they are on sale everywhere and no please for the love of god don't sell the 80-200. I have the nikon version and to the grave' it goes with me!

Just my $.02

Wazz

Message edited by author 2006-06-08 20:48:48.

ralph

Nikon Z9

06/08/2006 08:48:05 PM · #6

have you looked into advertising rather than buying more equipment ?
i think that would get you farther !!

06/08/2006 08:51:07 PM · #7

Things fail so you need backups.

last wedding: middle of ceremony the 30D starts backfocusing - with 2 different lenses. and at the reception it and the flash begin fighting over what the definition of Av and P mode are...not sure what the issue was, but once i got home everything was just fine. of course it was.

for flash - i use little of it. i'd like to offer it as an upgrade at receptions to have the whole room lit up, but that means a PW sender and at least 2 receivers...$600 right there. and i want backups as at an event last fall i found out something in the building caused my cheap ebay radio trigger system to randomly fire.

One wedding photo i assisted used 4 lumedyne units (roughly $1200 each plus stands) (and 2 more as backups in her car) and used quantum radio units, another $1000 at least. Now she shot with a 10D and a canon 28-200 lens - all that flash means no need for a 2.8 lens. but add up the costs there...with those and her on camera unit i figured she had over $8000 in flash units alone for this one OUTDOOR wedding (in a tent, and it was overcast).

06/08/2006 08:52:42 PM · #8

Originally posted by thegrandwazoo:

YEP!

I have the tamron 70-210 2.8 and yes, if i die tonite i am to be buried with it. I may one day get the canon 70-200 2.8 IS and then it can be my eternal companion.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

06/08/2006 09:03:25 PM · #9

Actually advertising is reletively inexpensive for us as soon as we get a website up and running.

prof, I'm not sure you looked at my gear list but, as you can see from the lenses I own, I mostly have all of those you listed covered except for the extreme wide. 17mm on a 1.25x camera is still pretty wide while not a fisheye. I noticed you didn't even mention the 1DmkII for weddings I wonder why that is? I feel it's the best all around camera on the market outside of debatably the D2X. For the flash I do have a 550ex and a strobe. The other strobes will not be necessary for months so i'm worrying about that later. I don't really want to talk about prints at this time but thanks for your input on that issue.

Interesting to see that you have had so many camera problems, I've never expirienced a single one. I'll keep that in mind.

for the non wedding part of the job, I would never need more than the 2 digital cameras we already plan on having as there's only one station. This would hopefully be the major income maker of the business down the road.

zeuszen

Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II

06/08/2006 09:04:18 PM · #10

Originally posted by kyebosh:

... One option would be to sell this camera for as much as I can, and then invest the rest of the money + that money into a 1DmkII...

The 1DMkII & -(N) have been around for a good while now. I wouldn't be at all surprised, if these received a major update before the year is over. Considering the investment along with the seriousness of your endeavour, you might want to wait for either a price reduction on the N or the real thing...

In terms of performance, the 30D isn't too far off anymore...

Thinking of the financial situation you describe, I wouldn't spend any money at this time. :-(

06/08/2006 09:07:55 PM · #11

Originally posted by zeuszen:

Originally posted by kyebosh:
... One option would be to sell this camera for as much as I can, and then invest the rest of the money + that money into a 1DmkII...

The 1DMkII & -(N) have been around for a good while now. I wouldn't be at all surprised, if these received a major update before the year is over. Considering the investment along with the seriousness of your endeavour, you might want to wait for either a price reduction on the N or the real thing...

In terms of performance, the 30D isn't too far off anymore...

Thinking of the financial situation you describe, I wouldn't spend any money at this time. :-(

well my financial situation is somewhat strange... my parents want to give me the money as a gift, with that mindset they won't give it to me for rent or my other living expenses.

06/08/2006 09:13:02 PM · #12

you always need backup. ask my buddy scott (1D mk2n...currently at canon for a failed shutter) or emmanual (1D mk2 n also) - most of his issues are in his mind i think - he want 0 hot pixels...and no dust). ask deapee here about the time he dropped his lens...i dropped one last week on a night shoot..thank got it was not damaged (tamron rocks!)

my 30D has had issues...not sure what's up with it. 20D and my older 300D were perfect.

websites work - IF the customer knows to go there. you have to get them there. Nick, a friend here, spent the knot money and booked 12 weddings in 2 weeks. others have no luck. could be a price range issue.

Check out a bridal show - space, display, handouts - $1000 to $1500 easy.
mall display - $800 a MONTH and up.
newspaper may work - it does here but not in the city 40 miles away (i live in a rural county).

The 1D mk2 n is (rumours ya know) slated for eventual phase out. you don't need 8 fps for a wedding anyway. it's abig heavy camera - wedding are tiring to shoot, even if you are young. Why work harder than you have to?
4Mp is fine for somethings, but many wedding things - not. Even mid-priced wedding albums have 12x24 inch panorama pages and if you do continous tone prints you can get by with 150 dpi (1800x3600 image). however, many of the coffee tabel print on demand outfits only take 300dpi files - 3600x7200...a long up from a 4mp capture.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

06/08/2006 09:24:30 PM · #13

Originally posted by Prof_Fate:

I'm well aware the 1DII is a heavy camera, it's slightly lighter than the one i'm using right now. And i'm well aware of the limitations that come with shooting at 4mp, this is one of my reasons for upgrading. I'm not really concerned with the phaseout of this series of camera, just because canon makes something new doesn't mean I can't keep using it. I feel the performance it gives will last for quite a long time.

I realize i need a backup, but I will always have at least 3 cameras at any gig I do.

Does the 20D/30D do tethered shooting straight to a computer? I'm guessing it probably does but I wasn't sure.

Printing and advertising are not my primary concerns at this time. I will deal with that when I am ready to launch.

zeuszen

Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II

06/08/2006 09:29:12 PM · #14

Originally posted by Prof_Fate:

...The 1D mk2 n is (rumours ya know) slated for eventual phase out...

If it were phased out, what camera would all those NG wildlifers use? A Nikon?