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05/28/2006 06:12:46 PM · #51 |
Why is it, with a couple of exceptions, it's the teenagers in this thread that are making the most sense. Talk about role-reversal, the 'kids' are the voice of reason and the 'adults' are prone to paranoid ravings.
As Tracy pointed out, the idea a teenager is still a child is a relatively new concept in society -- time was if a girl was not married by 16 she was in danger of becoming a spinster.
The maturity of the teenagers in this thread are quite typical of the maturity of the teenagers I know. The only difference I see is Ennil and Charles have obviously had parents that listen to them, and have not had it hammered into them that their opinion doesn't matter. [joking]Silly kids these days, don't know they should be seen and not heard[/joking]
Most of what has been said in this thread and in every thread this discussion comes up in is nothing more or less than paranoia. Fear does terrible things with a persons imagination -- they imagine justifications to ignoring the opinions of their children and imagine perverts in every glance on the street. The teenagers end up with no one with experience they can trust for advice and either have to have a go at it on their own or with their friends.
One thing I have learned is when speaking with a teenager, what they have to say is far more important than anything I could possibly come up with. They are the ones going thru it all -- yes they need the experience of their parents to test their concerns against -- but ultimately they must work out the answers for themselves. It is better for them to work out the answers while being listened to by an experienced adult willing to listen than it is to work it out in the school of hard-knocks on the street. But having the answers to their problems handed to them or forced upon them will only result in a lack of experience and a dependence upon others that will haunt them the rest of their lives.
David
Message edited by author 2006-05-28 18:13:12.
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05/28/2006 06:23:33 PM · #52 |
Originally posted by TrynityRose:
If you go outside and start thinking that people who look at your kids or yourself are just doing it to fuel some sexual fantasy then you are already a victim. Yes, it's a disgusting thought that someone could do that, but unless they create physical harm then I would rather assume the best and not assume everyone is thinking the worst. |
I'd like to point out that, in this scenario, the stranger may not be thinking of the child as a sexual object, but the parent definitely is.
There is quite the parallel to terrorism, in that when we let others change our behavior unreasonably, then "they" have won.
As others have mentioned, I think actually discussing the dangers and prevention with your kids is a great idea, acting as a shield between them and the world is usually not. |
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05/28/2006 06:29:23 PM · #53 |
I have worries, myself. I have a 4 year old boy. I have 8 child sex offenders within a half mile of my house and one that lives right behind me! He is perfectly aware that if my child and I are in the backyard, he is not to talk or even look over the fence. Having the dog helps for some warning/protection, but I do not allow Aidan out in the yard without me there, also.
I have thrown out the idea of posting some signs around my yard, stating, "You harm my child, I WILL SHOOT YOU!"
One place to check for this
State registries
The best one I found
My county (search for your won with your county and "sex offender" in google) has a map that shows where they live, so I KNOW where they are and who they are.
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05/28/2006 06:29:44 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
As others have mentioned, I think actually discussing the dangers and prevention with your kids is a great idea, acting as a shield between them and the world is usually not. |
I totally agree with that.
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05/28/2006 06:55:34 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
As others have mentioned, I think actually discussing the dangers and prevention with your kids is a great idea, acting as a shield between them and the world is usually not. |
I totally agree with that. |
I agree as well.
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05/28/2006 07:00:17 PM · #56 |
This is a very interesting thread, and I've tried to read it all, as well as the other thread this one stemmed from. So sorry in advance, this is a long response.
I just want to start off by stating that I am speaking from the experience of a 21y/o girl who grew up with extremely poor self esteem and a single mom who never talked/listened to me about such things and was probably somewhere in the average protectiveness area. (I've also endured many other bad experiences that are probably not appropriate to be posting in a public thread)
I agree that there is a difference between protection and OVERprotection. I went through a rough stage (ages 16-18) and then came out of it. However, all of the girls (that I've kept track of) that I grew up with who had overprotective parents, turned out really bad, begging for sexual attention from anyone and all the time, most of them pregnant before 18, etc (mostly because they thought a child would make them feel loved). The best and only good thing you can really do, is talk to your kids, actively participate in their lives, make your plans together, and make sure they feel that you are a good LISTENER. I would attribute most of my behavior to the fact that I really thought that nobody cared about me. I don't think that it is rebellion, but that it is the kid seeking out those forbidden things the first chance they get, not realizing why they shouldn't.
I agree with Ennil, and I feel that I am old enough to see some of the things that I thought when I was a teen as kind of dumb now, but not too old that I would have forgotten how I really thought at that age.
I also wanted to add that almost all statistics point out that 90%+ of child molestation is committed by a relative or a well known person of the family, and my personal opinion is that most of these kids trust that adult and don't have the self-esteem to realize that that person is hurting them; the kid just wants affection/attention. |
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05/28/2006 07:04:26 PM · #57 |
I can't get any comments on my pictures - well not many lol, but I state an opinion and bam it takes off lol.
We're very open with our daughter and she's only 5. We have a sex offender living living less then a block from us- was convicted in the early 90's for molesting a child and taking indecent liberties with children. Now he looks perfectly normal, rides his bike around here like everyone else and seems like the nicest man. Even chatted with him once after first moving in here and remember thinking to myself "what a nice gentleman he is". My neighbor brought it to my attention that he was not very nice and in fact spent 6 years in jail for his atrocities. Not wanting to depend only on my neighbors word on this man I looked it up myself and sure enough there it was. I pointed him out to my daughter not long after that, and have since pointed him out so she is aware that he is out there and that he is not safe. She knows not to talk to him or look his direction.
That being said we don't shelter her from everyone and everything. We do in fact spend less time at home then we do out in the parks, hiking, going to the beach ect. Just because I find a bikini inappropriate for my child does not mean she's sheltered by any means.
Call me wacked, call me overprotective, in the long wrong and even now I have a very happy, balanced, bright little girl who is aware of her surroundings. There's nothing wrong with that. There IS something wrong with people who choose to ignore or downplay the fact that there are so many predators out there. And I think any good parent would protect their child the best they could.
I'm not paranoid be any means. I'm aware of my surroundings and what goes on. If I was trully paranoid I'd have her living in a room without windows and homeschool her. I'd definetly have issues then. |
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05/28/2006 07:13:52 PM · #58 |
Well, I think the best thing is for a child to have good self esteem and not want to wear a bikini in the first place.
Growing up, I wore both, but then from 5th grade until college, wouldn't wear a bathing suit at all (or shorts/skirts for that matter) because I was so self conscious that I was not tan and did not have rock hard thighs (which has nothing to do with what we're talking about), I just don't think that bikini wearing leads to unsafe behavior any more than a regular bathing suit would. Depends on the particular suit itself... just as I think that those t shirts that say slutty stuff are just as bad as a mid-drift shirt, has more to do with how they wear it than what they're wearing |
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05/28/2006 07:17:02 PM · #59 |
Originally posted by missinseattle:
And I noticed someone mentioned myspace, the news specials I've seen have had NOTHING to do with myspace. I saw one the other night on 20/20. Was a family man with 3 children and a beautiful wife. Seemed like your perfect family guy with a happy home. His other life he was a serial pedophile preying on girls between 5 and 15. Videotaping them, rubbing up against them to grab things off the shelf in a grocery store. He actually grabbed a girl in a hotel, drug her off the elevator and outside. Her dad had told her long before that if anyone ever tried to do anything to her to scream and yell and do whatever she could to get away. That's what she did and the man was caught not long after that.
THOSE are the stories I'm referring to. And she wasn't some sexy dressed teen. She was a pastors daughter who was dressed modestly and very careful wherever she went.
That's what scares me. And the older my daughter gets, the more I worry. |
Yeah, I saw that show. That guy was SERIOUSLY freaky.
Myspace and such can make things easier for people, sure, but this guy just spent hours at the mall observing and stalking young girls. |
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05/28/2006 07:20:28 PM · #60 |
Originally posted by amandalore:
Well, I think the best thing is for a child to have good self esteem and not want to wear a bikini in the first place. |
I do agree with this.
Originally posted by amandalore:
I just don't think that bikini wearing leads to unsafe behavior any more than a regular bathing suit would. Depends on the particular suit itself... just as I think that those t shirts that say slutty stuff are just as bad as a mid-drift shirt, has more to do with how they wear it than what they're wearing |
I guess that makes sense. I know I was never comfortable with a bikini because I was going to be showing just as much skin as I would be to someone in the future when I was dressed in a bra and panties. I feel like there is a bit of intimacy there that is supposed to be connected with that, and bikinis take that away. I am not saying I think nobody should wear one, but that is why I haven't and why I would not be comfortable if a child of mine would ever want to wear one. |
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05/28/2006 07:25:20 PM · #61 |
have you ever been into myspace? for parents, make sure you visit your kid's myspace account if they have one. I see WAY TOO often, a lot of teens on that site with several very very half naked provocative pics and way too much info and the comments from men are terrible, not to mention the girls' responses.
And you can tell that the girls who are posting these things, are running real low on self esteem, I don't think that I can put enough emphasis on this point. Parents, I really feel that self esteem is the key to success, if I could have one wish, it would be that I would have been happy with myself as a child. I did everything, had straight As, was outgoing, girl scouts, baseball, rainbow girls, and everyone thought I had so much self confidence, but still to this day, if someone asks me in a sincere way, "Amanda, how are you feeling, are you ok?" I break down and cry. |
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05/28/2006 07:41:09 PM · #62 |
First of all, i read alot of this thread, not all of it, but alot.
And this is a topic i have very strong feelings on. I think its great that so many people have so many different ideas on the same topic and we have created a great discussion.
I saw somewhere scarttered, and i failed to find it again, that someone commented on how no wonder girls are having sex at a such a young age, they dress in skimpy clothes. That is not exactly what i read, but its along the same lines. I don't care what the age is or what the girl is wearing, she CAN wear and, and she SHOULD be able to wear it without haveing people say this is why she is having sex (weather true of not). She should also be able to wear the skimpiest(sp) clothes she wants to, wuthout being accused of it being her fault that she has a preditor or not. This is how it should, and yea, i understand that it is not how it is. But I don't thing you should tell girls//women, that they can't wear some kind of clothing.
I got kind of lost in my own paragraph, so ill just post that for now, and put up more later
Edit: Addon
Myspace, i agree that the MAJORITY of girls, or boys, that post themselves in skimpy clothes on myspace do it because of low self esteem , yes.
However, myspace has a minor protection against that
for ages 15 and under the proilfe appears "private", well semi private, you can still see their main profile image, and thats it. Sure, 14 and 15 years old can easily lie about there age, but, myspace has no control over this.
Message edited by author 2006-05-28 19:44:24.
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05/28/2006 07:48:32 PM · #63 |
It also doesn't help when the judicial system fails to protect children, and instead "protects" the guilty...
Judge: Man is too short for prison |
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05/28/2006 07:49:15 PM · #64 |
I agree Elmakias... I also want to add that most girls dress in such a way to try to attract the kind of attention they want. actually, everyone does it. Usually you dress how you want people to react, you don't dress as a reaction to (whatever it may be). For example, I wear business attire when looking for a job, "skater" clothes when going downtown and "preppy" clothes when going to community functions.
and as a serious question, not an argument, have there been any studies done to indicate whether a person's attire influences a sexual preditor's decision? or is it more just based on opportunity and victim behavior? |
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05/28/2006 07:55:50 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by NathanW:
It also doesn't help when the judicial system fails to protect children, and instead "protects" the guilty...
Judge: Man is too short for prison |
oh man, that is horrible, sexual predators deserve the abuse they'd receive in prison in my opinion. and I also feel that they have something broke inside them that cannot be "fixed"
also, only about 30% of sex offenders actually register. (and also note, that most of the ones who do register are the more decent people, such as guys who took a girl home from bar who lied about her age, and the guy now has his life ruined because who would think that a girl who looks twenty something could sneak into the bar and would lie about her age, I mean, how often have you asked to see someone's ID before going home? assuming you'd take someone home from a bar that is....)
edit spelling
Message edited by author 2006-05-28 19:56:14. |
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05/28/2006 08:12:41 PM · #66 |
Originally posted by amandalore:
I agree Elmakias... I also want to add that most girls dress in such a way to try to attract the kind of attention they want. actually, everyone does it. Usually you dress how you want people to react, you don't dress as a reaction to (whatever it may be). For example, I wear business attire when looking for a job, "skater" clothes when going downtown and "preppy" clothes when going to community functions.
and as a serious question, not an argument, have there been any studies done to indicate whether a person's attire influences a sexual preditor's decision? or is it more just based on opportunity and victim behavior? |
From the workshops I've attended, it is 99% opportunity. Has virtually nothing whatsoever to do with dress. |
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05/28/2006 08:14:28 PM · #67 |
| Thanks Artyste, that confirms my hypothesis (at least for me). I always assumed as much |
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05/28/2006 08:51:57 PM · #68 |
dress is often used as an excuse, is more what i was going for, if that makes any sense?
and to amandalore's comment that people deserve abuse in prison. I strongly disagree, i think no one deserves any kind of abuse, even if you have done somehting horrilbe.
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05/28/2006 08:54:26 PM · #69 |
Originally posted by Elmakias:
dress is often used as an excuse, is more what i was going for, if that makes any sense?
and to amandalore's comment that people deserve abuse in prison. I strongly disagree, i think no one deserves any kind of abuse, even if you have done somehting horrilbe. |
I can respect that |
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05/28/2006 09:03:20 PM · #70 |
thanks : ), i understand where u are coming from as well, i think..
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05/28/2006 09:05:15 PM · #71 |
I have a lovely 11 yr old daughter and a grown up 24 yr. old daughter. My view on this subject is to be quite open with my daughters about the subject. It's not only the sexy outfits for little girls that bother me, but the popular "attitude" shirts about being a brat or princess or telling the reader to shut up or they don't care or count.
I like cute clothes for my girls, but my goal has always been to work with them as they are growing up to give some thought to what they are wearing and the message it might send. Clothes that are up to date and flattering without being blatantly sexy seem to be THEIR preference.
I have told them from itty bitty times on, they have choices to make all through life. I remind them to think about the kind of person they want to be and make their choices based on that desire. My older daughter, for example, got a tattoo when she was 18. She knew I'd dislike it, but she also knew I'd respect her choice to do it. I'm just not a tattoo fan, but she is. I want them both to be their own person. Of course, I guide my 11 yr old more than I now DON'T for my 24 yr old....but I still listen, listen, listen to the 24 year old!
All that being said, the 11 yr. old is not in a hurry to grow up and while I love feminine pretty things and can't wait for her to be interested in fixing her hair, wearing a little make up and even talking about boys....I'm glad she's taking her own time doing it! I think both my girls take pride in looking nice, and the older one likes to show off some curves, but neither have ever been interested in skimpy type outfits.
I've also taught them ways to protect themselves, but I don't think I want them to live totally with a fearful or suspicious mindset. It's such a balancing act as a parent. :)
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05/28/2006 09:06:36 PM · #72 |
Originally posted by greatandsmall:
Children rebel. It's in their nature.
My parents could have stopped it; but they would have had to start by paying attention to me at a very early age. Unfortunately, the parents I lived with until the age of 15 weren't capable of that. When I moved to live with my father and stepmother, it was too late. The stricter they were, the more I acted out.
I had friends with communicative friend-type parents and friends with strict prison-warden parents. I was able to corrupt them all equally. Sadly, we all made some poor choices. This is partially responsible for my apprehension about being a parent. It's a lot of hard work! |
I never rebelled, and I am very thankful for the fact that I had a good family situation from the start. |
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05/28/2006 09:20:15 PM · #73 |
Originally posted by Elmakias:
and to amandalore's comment that people deserve abuse in prison. I strongly disagree, i think no one deserves any kind of abuse, even if you have done somehting horrilbe. |
Being what this thread is about, I strongly disagree with you. If you hurt a child on purpose, you deserve the chair. Wait, let me take that back. If you hurt a child on purpose, you deserve to have the worst metal and physical abuse you can possibly have without dying everyday for the rest of your life. No exceptions.
Although dress has much to do with how people act towards one another, and although I disagree with girls of any age (and women) wearing sexy clothes to get attention and show off their bodies, sexual predators are going to get what they want regardless of apparel. Girls covering up would not cure this particular problem.
To sexual predators, it̢۪s not about sex, it's about control.
Horny teenage boys are another story. But probably if a young girl is dressing sexy, she wants that attention anyway. That's why, just as many people have already said in this thread, strong relationships and great communication are key for parents with children. I wish I had been so blessed with parents of this sort.
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05/28/2006 09:57:47 PM · #74 |
I have a solution for all of you paranoid parents. You can dress your daughter in the burqua, keep her locked in the house and control everything she sees, hears and reads until you marry her off to the man of your choosing.
Sheesh... |
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05/28/2006 09:59:44 PM · #75 |
Originally posted by NightShy:
Originally posted by Elmakias:
and to amandalore's comment that people deserve abuse in prison. I strongly disagree, i think no one deserves any kind of abuse, even if you have done somehting horrilbe. |
Being what this thread is about, I strongly disagree with you. If you hurt a child on purpose, you deserve the chair. Wait, let me take that back. If you hurt a child on purpose, you deserve to have the worst metal and physical abuse you can possibly have without dying everyday for the rest of your life. No exceptions.
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Way to show your compassion! |
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