my Candid - I would really like to know..........

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

04/19/2006 04:36:39 AM · #1

Please - whoever gave me the one 2, one of the six 3's, or one of the twenty two 4's.....just tell me why you thought it was that bad. If you dont want to post here for all to see fine, but at least PM me. I'm not out to flame you for your vote. I just need to know what it was that you thought so bad about this shot.

Ben

Canon EOS-30D

04/19/2006 04:49:07 AM · #2

It's like he can't look but his hand on the stone really says something. I thought it was a very strong picture, just a tad too dark overall.
I gave it a 7, high praise, :P

I'd perhaps say not to take the odd low vote to heart, some people just don't relate to some photo's, can't win them all. Even the top 2 got 1's and 2's.

Message edited by author 2006-04-19 05:02:28.

MAK

Leica CL

Leica 18-56mm f/3.5-5.6 Vario Elmar-T ASPH

04/19/2006 04:59:31 AM · #3

I think a lot of us got bashed with the 2 stick myself included. Ive given up trying to please the DPC voters now I please myself and Im happier for it..LOL this is a great shot and you know it.. who cares what voter gave it a 2 I like it and so do you.

Simms

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

04/19/2006 05:03:03 AM · #4

Shutterpug, no point asking, its the trolls.. they vote up the bad'uns, vote down the good'uns.

I didnt vote, but would put this at 7.. It tells a story. We get an idea of where he is, we have an idea of what he is doing.. We dont know who he is visiting, but the photo allows us to fill in the blanks.. actually now its made me think I would say even an 8, unfortunately when voting on challenges time is a luxury most of us dont have, so dont have the chance to analyse pictures like I just did, I wish I could, but scrutinising 300+ photos in that kind of details is pretty mind-numbing.

Can I quickly ask, did you specifically go to the cemetary to get shots for this challenge? Its not a loaded question where I will come down on you for being a vulture, just interested really.

Message edited by author 2006-04-19 05:06:05.

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 ED

04/19/2006 05:11:56 AM · #5

Originally posted by marksimms:

Can I quickly ask, did you specifically go to the cemetary to get shots for this challenge? Its not a loaded question where I will come down on you for being a vulture, just interested really.

Yes, I actually made three trips to the cemetery hoping to get an emotive candid shot. I didnt just want to shoot a person walking down a street. I wanted a shot that had a story to tell.

As for other replies here, yes I know we all get low scores. And I am not complaining as much as I want to try and understand the thought process of those who vote such inmages low. Sure it bugs me to see low scores on this as I truly do not feel it deserved anything lower than a 5, but that is my biased opinion. I would love to hear from the un-biased who felt otherwise.

Edited to add: I did take other Candids that I could have entered - they are posted in the Candid Outake thread. The others were not from the cemetery.

Message edited by author 2006-04-19 05:14:14.

BeeCee

Nikon D40

04/19/2006 05:24:14 AM · #6

I also went to the cemetery... on my birthday even! But there was not ONE single person there.... alive, at least :(

Pug, I LIKED your picture!!

I think the "2-voters" are sometimes folks who have not-so-great shots in themselves, trying to narrow the gap between they and the good shots...?

yanko

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Carl Zeiss 50mm ZE f/1.4 Planar T for Canon

04/19/2006 06:07:48 AM · #7

I don't know Linda. I'm guessing those that voted that way did so because well your photo doesn't have bright happy colors in it and worse the subject matter doesn't evoke happy joy joy feelings.

To be serious though, it wouldn't surprise me if more people vote based on how your photo compares with the best. Makes it kinda hard to get a fair score when there are so many incredible pro photographers with entries also. It's like well this one is a 10 and I can't have this other one be that close in score to the 10 so lets make it a 4 or a 3.

Heck, I don't know. What I do know is I have less of a grasp of what voters want than I did before. I laugh now when I remember that I questioned why my Square Crop photo didn't score higher and that was a 6+. Nowadays I'm getting low 4s (as in my Something Old entry). Can't imagine what the issue is with this one. Can't be the processing this time around and I feel the technicals are there and it's most definitely not DNMC so that just leaves me with one conclusion, not enough wow factor. Fine but I didn't think that accounted for seven tenths of the score. *sigh*

Oh well, maybe I should just cave in and shoot stuff from the library of DPC approved shots. After all if I'm not going to get much feedback what else is the reason to submit to challenges besides padding ones stats/ego?

Ok rant over. I need to go to bed. Btw, I liked the shot linda. Hope you do better the next go around. :)

Message edited by author 2006-04-19 06:09:28.

hopper

Canon EOS-80D

Canon EF 35mm f/2 IS USM

04/19/2006 06:10:41 AM · #8

i imagine people took a guess that it was posed

goc

Apple iPhone 4

04/19/2006 06:28:18 AM · #9

hmm, maybe the peeps didnt like the theme, the cemetary-the sad story
maybe they felt too touched ? i dont know ... i always look at the photos from story point of view, if there is no story or i cannot imagine it then i look at the quality of the photo and details ... then it's time to vote and give the score, i didnt vote on this one but i would give it a 6 or 7 no doubt about it, the photo is to dark and low contrast overall but still ... it has a story, event it's a sad one.
and 34th place out of 300 and sometinhg isn't bad at all me thinks :-)

my2c and i'm definetly NOT an expert

04/19/2006 06:29:47 AM · #10

Oh, for cryin out loud...

seriously, you've been on the site for nearly a year, have entered 59 challenges, and have been extremely active on the forums. you've finished below 5 and above 7 twice in your past 20 challenges, and with a bunch of 6+ finishes...

and now you are *wondering* about 1/7 of the votes when 6/7 of the votes put you in the top 8% of all entries?

oh, puh-leeeeze!

because "one person" "seemed" to think it was contrived?

my problem with the image is its composition. central focus is the face, which is looking straight down out of the frame. boom. end of story. see the face, get taken out of the image. if you had walked 10-15 feet to your right and framed the shot horizontally so that there would be a contained connection of lines between his head, the tombstone, and whatever he's looking at, the image would have been much stronger. if you want your image to tell a story, you have to keep the viewer looking at it. if you want to get all the votes at dpc, you have to produce images that connect with all the viewers.

Tokina AF 12-24mm f/4.0 AT-X Pro DX

04/19/2006 08:13:18 AM · #11

Originally posted by skiprow:

I appreciate your comments on what you thought my image was lacking, however I do not feel it was necessary for you to be rude about my asking for an understanding of low votes. I come to this site to learn, and if I cannot ask a question without being ridiculed for it then why bother being here.

Beagleboy

Canon EOS-30D

04/19/2006 08:17:06 AM · #12

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.4D

04/19/2006 10:34:28 AM · #13

sorry, linda, if you found my post rude and rediculing. while you might think your post was an effort to unearth some unknown explanation for the bottom end of the bellcurve of voting, i find it, given your stats, progress, and experience on this site, a bit of a whine. it's one thing to need help to bring your scores up a whole point or a half point, but i gotta believe you're past that point. so, tactless as i may be, i'd suggest time would better be spent digging into the next challenge...

tate

Apple iPhone 15 Pro

04/19/2006 10:39:52 AM · #14

The interesting thing about this site is that there are so many images that each is looked at for only a short time. What's really interesting is when an image gets a bunch of 8-10 scores as well as a bunch of 1-5 scores. In a way, this pattern is sometimes more interesting, even though the image doesn't score as high. Anyway, there may be an ironic backlash when a situation looks too good to be true. This might be the case here - if someone thought this image was set-up or violated someone's privacy, they may feel obligated to score low. For me, I didn't vote on it but I would have 7'd.

As far as what skiprow was saying, I think he's just teasing you because we all get 2's and 3's on nearly all of our iamges.

04/19/2006 03:34:25 PM · #15

Originally posted by skiprow:

it's one thing to need help to bring your scores up a whole point or a half point, but i gotta believe you're past that point. so, tactless as i may be, i'd suggest time would better be spent digging into the next challenge...

I am far from that point....I have improved from this site, and only hoped to continue to do so. I wasn't whining at all. I am happy my scores are mainly in the 6 range now. I would love to learn how to get them up beyond that though. Thus was the reason for my post. It seems to have been pointless though as non of those who gave out the low votes are willing to step forward and provide a constructive critique - without beating on the photog for daring to ask why.

04/19/2006 04:05:47 PM · #16

well, i guess a better question would be to ask the 35 people who voted it so far the other direction why did they think it was so great?

you see, if you are going to bother to try to go to the nths, why don't you focus on the strong side rather than the weak side? rather than try to move the bottom voters up from low voting to average voting, why don't you try to move the average voters up to high voting?

sorry if you're taking this personally, linda, because i'm just giving you my opinion: i think it's a waste of time for anyone scoring in the top 15% or scoring above a 6 to be asking the low voters of a basically normal voting distribution to tell you what was wrong. to me, that's no different than tilting windmills. i would expect it of someone new enough not to have seen the same question asked and the same response received, but not from someone who's been around awhile.

and look at the replies you've gotten--not much that really tells you much more than the standard response: it's the typical dpc voting distribution.

from where i sit, i'd be more interested in why these images

were so overlooked

skewsme

Canon EF 200mm f/2.8 L II USM Lens

04/19/2006 04:14:23 PM · #17

I didn't enter or vote in this challenge, so can't speak directly to your 2's. I love taking pictures of things in the cemetery. However, similar to what Metatate suggested, this shot might represent too personal a moment, potentially invasive to the subject, overwhelming the technical aspects of the photo. I don't know how it would have affected my vote, but I know it would have given me pause.

Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 24-70mm f/2.8G ED

04/19/2006 04:20:33 PM · #18

and another thing

the bottom line on scoring well is connecting with viewers and voters. the better your image connects and resonnates with the viewers, the more likely they are to overlook obvious technical problems. on the other hand, if your image doesn't wow people, they'll hit you on the technical side.

so, you take a technically proficient photo that comes close to the challenge description, and you should score a 5 or 6. as it is, you got a hair more votes above 6 than below. in reality, it doesn't matter why the low voters scored you low. basically, your image was better than average, even though it didn't manage to blow away the majority of voters. again, wouldn't it make more sense to focus your creativity on the current challenges, trying to figure out a WOW type image, rather than quibbling over the bottom end of the spectrum...

thegrandwazoo

Nikon D750

04/19/2006 04:32:03 PM · #19

I think it was a great image and who knows why some need to pick poke and prod. Oh well!

You rock! Keep on Keeping on!

The Wazz

Canon EOS-20D

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

04/19/2006 04:33:22 PM · #20

Something about the way the man is positioned seemed to me more like he was using the headstone to get up off the ground rather than having any moments of intense sadness or suffering. Lacking that emotional charge, there isn't much else that strikes me as especially compelling. I didn't vote but probably would have given it a 5 and don't see a 4 as entirely out of the question.