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01/25/2006 09:45:09 AM · #51 |
Originally posted by Brenb:
After my last 3 entries below my average, I am thrilled with this score.
Votes: 42
Views: 54
Avg Vote: 5.9524
Comments: 2 |
Yay Bren! |
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01/25/2006 09:49:40 AM · #52 |
Votes: 47
Views: 63
Avg Vote: 4.3617
Comments: 6
Better than I expected actually. It started out at 5.5 which surprised me but that was only after 3 votes. It dropped down pretty quickly after a few more votes. The comments I've gotten are pretty much what I expected (as will be seen by my comments about the shot that I wrote pre-voting :D). I hadn't planned on entering this challenge since I'm not really equipped to take a really good wildlife shot (unless the wildlife stays really still and lets me get really close LOL!). I just happened upon an unusual sight and had my camera with me.
added after reading previous posts I don't mind a zoo shot since those animals are still essentially wild---from what I understood from the challenge description the difference was b/w domesticated animals (and reptiles etc kept as pets) and non-domesticated animals living in a natural environment. In my area, our zoo provides as close to natural as possible for the animal.
Message edited by author 2006-01-25 10:04:25. |
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01/25/2006 09:53:14 AM · #53 |
Originally posted by MattO:
And just because I have a different opinion doesnt mean I am not getting along does it? I am pretty sure I can have an opinion that differs from anyone elses.
MattO |
sorry Matt, i didn't mean to imply that you in particular aren't getting along...i just meant everybody in general...because i see so much bickering on the forums (not by everybody of course). |
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01/25/2006 09:53:29 AM · #54 |
Looks like I'm hanging right with ya, Bren:
Votes: 52
Views: 58
Avg Vote: 5.9823
Comments: 3
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01/25/2006 10:04:12 AM · #55 |
Originally posted by idnic:
Looks like I'm hanging right with ya, Bren:
Votes: 52
Views: 58
Avg Vote: 5.9823
Comments: 3 |
Hey you are, Cindi. The race is on. :) Mine went up to an even 6 but back down again.
Votes: 54
Views: 68
Avg Vote: 5.9630
Comments: 2
Thanks Rikki. You not in on this one or are you keeping your score a secret? You are so darn close to that ribbon it's not even funny. I am pulling for you to get one very soon.
Message edited by author 2006-01-25 10:08:39. |
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01/25/2006 10:17:08 AM · #56 |
Where I live it's easy to shoot zoo shots but difficult to find a truely wild animal. I do a lot of shooting in national wildlife refuges and state operated wildlife management areas. They grow corn in the refuges so the migratory Canada geese will have food. They burn off some invasive plants so that the native grasses can survive. They manage the water level to minimize the effects of tides and storms. So what's really wild? As long as it doesn't show cages or fences etc. I'd give an entry the benefit of the doubt as to whether it's wild or not.
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01/25/2006 10:32:21 AM · #57 |
Challenge description: "For the purpose of this challenge, "wildlife" should be considered non-domesticated mammals, birds, reptiles and amphibians living in a natural environment."
Appears that they should have defined "natural environment" also.
I'd wager "non-domesticated" was thrown in there to eliminate common pets (cats/dogs, etc...).
As for complaining about the "Zoo" shots I think some of the complaint may be coming from the effort required to get a "Wildlife" shot. It's not too difficult to park yourself at the railing of a (name your zoo animal) pit and get some easy photos. I think part of the "Challenge" was also in the adventure and "hunt" of capturing your subject in an image.
Just food for thought. ;^)
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01/25/2006 10:37:25 AM · #58 |
I think Zoo shots are extremely acceptable for this challenge...I for one dont want to see this challenge if you couldnt use zoo animals.. after all the wildlife in CITIES is pigeons, squirrels and rats... no thank you...
Zoos today work hard to make the area the animal lives in as natural as possible so ... they are in their natural environment. I give Zoos a lot of credit for the work they have done in that line
PLUS we have members that live in other places that have some of these animals out in the wild. A wild animal photo may have come from one of them..
Originally posted by glad2badad:
Challenge description: "For the purpose of this challenge, "wildlife" should be considered non-domesticated mammals, birds, reptiles and amphibians living in a natural environment."
Appears that they should have defined "natural environment" also.
I'd wager "non-domesticated" was thrown in there to eliminate common pets (cats/dogs, etc...).
As for complaining about the "Zoo" shots I think some of the complaint may be coming from the effort required to get a "Wildlife" shot. It's not too difficult to park yourself at the railing of a (name your zoo animal) pit and get some easy photos. I think part of the "Challenge" was also in the adventure and "hunt" of capturing your subject in an image.
Just food for thought. ;^) |
Message edited by author 2006-01-25 10:40:57. |
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01/25/2006 10:42:01 AM · #59 |
Sounds like it would have been a great reason for a visit to the country. ;^)
I know when there is a challenge that is more suited for city residents I either have to travel to get a shot or sit out the challenge.
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01/25/2006 11:16:41 AM · #60 |
LOL ~ I'm reading all this and wondering if people think my subject is a pet . . . which it's not. Quite the oppoosite. And to kick it all off for me, I finally found my subject after about two years of looking for it (and just never seeing it; bad luck). I so want to be more specific, but I guess the little ethical voice in my head is holding me back!
I just hate to think that the votes would get knocked down because somebody thought it might possibly be a zoo shot or a pet shot...
Especially given the context of my own actual experience with this subject!
Anyhow, I'll vote on non-domestically-bred subjects, be they in a zoo or in the forest or elsewhere.
But does that mean a 'wild' housecat roaming the streets of Key West would be valid? LOL ~ head crunch...
~ janson
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01/25/2006 11:19:39 AM · #61 |
Originally posted by bacchus:
...
But does that mean a 'wild' housecat roaming the streets of Key West would be valid? LOL ~ head crunch...
~ janson |
Well, if it has a sign around its neck saying "I am a feral cat"
;>) |
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01/25/2006 11:24:08 AM · #62 |
Go non-zoo shots!
Votes: 69
Views: 88
Avg Vote: 6.3188
Comments: 2
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01/25/2006 12:01:23 PM · #63 |
| I think the DPC managers try to have challenges that eventual will meet everyones needs over a period of time. The Wildlife challenge stated natural environment. Last year there was a challenge (7/11/05-7/17/05) named At the Zoo. I believe some people just try to nit pick the system for their benefit. I do not live in a big city so what was I to enter in the City Life challenge? |
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01/25/2006 12:07:33 PM · #64 |
Votes: 66
Views: 95
Avg Vote: 4.9394
Comments: 6
ROFL...I have gotten about half "DNMC". Others really love it & "get it". I'm wondering how many of these folks are sitting smack dab in the middle of the city, telling this country gal what is wild and what's not. ;) That's OK, though...I understand their point...I actually pulled it and then resubmitted, because I knew it would be controversial. |
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01/25/2006 12:57:05 PM · #65 |
Originally posted by Di:
I think Zoo shots are extremely acceptable for this challenge |
I dont mean this as an attack, but why do you find it so? In my reading of the challenge description it specifically rules out zoos. I understand that some people can not, or do not choose to spend the time to find wildlife in there area, or simply prefer to use the zoo, but as an urbanite,I know that wild animals exist everywhere in the form of birds and rodents.
At a minimum,if you choose to shoot at the zoo could you at least lie to me as if you belive it? A back lit shot of a meercat without much backround, I can belive you might have gotten in the wild. A white tiger sitting on a concrete slab, is in no way a wildlife shot and it says so in the picture.
Would it be "extremely acceptable" to submit a shot of a mountain landscape for the Cityscape challenge? Or a studio model shoot for a Candid challenge?
I know some challenges are harder to do in some areas of the world, last summer's Rain challenge comes to mind since it hadn't rained in several months, but if you cant get the subject of a challenge, why not either fake it as best you can or skip the challenge? Rewritting the challenge to suit your shooting style seems to go against the whole point of the site IMHO which is to force you to shoot in ways that you have not used in the past in an attempt to foster growth.
My intent in this little rant is not to attack anyone, since it is clear that there are alot of people who disagree with me, I am looking for an understanding of your viewpoint. |
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01/25/2006 01:28:08 PM · #66 |
I gave a ton of high scores here. Some lovely shots guys. A few clunkers in the mix, but not many. Overall, I predict high scoring finish.
Votes: 79
Views: 89
Avg Vote: 6.0127
Comments: 5
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01/25/2006 01:52:24 PM · #67 |
| I'm thinking the ones defending the zoo shots may have zoo entries hehe. |
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01/25/2006 01:55:44 PM · #68 |
Originally posted by idnic:
I gave a ton of high scores here. Some lovely shots guys. A few clunkers in the mix, but not many. Overall, I predict high scoring finish.
Votes: 79
Views: 89
Avg Vote: 6.0127
Comments: 5 |
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01/25/2006 02:10:53 PM · #69 |
Originally posted by yakatme:
And regarding these exotic animals, I wonder how many DPC'ers actually went to Africa, India, and Madagascar within the last week. |
Hey ... some of as actually do live in Africa and other "exotic" places :)
BTW living in Africa with a topic like this is great - I'm doing my personal best (so far): Avg 6.34
Cheers |
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01/25/2006 02:17:34 PM · #70 |
Brennan: You're right in that "natural environment" is the term that's really in question here; not "wildlife". I get that and I'm down with the no-zoo camp's perspective. They (zoo shots) still don't bug me that much, but now that I'm thinking about what "natural environment" means . . . I think the no-zoo camp probably has a better argument, following the fine print and the intentions of the challenge.
But some of these shots would be pretty hard to figure out. There's an excellent and outstanding tight macro shot of one animal in particular. It's really pretty damn incredible, in my opinion. But, because of the nature of the shot, I can't tell if it's actually in its natural environment (Australia, I believe), or in a studio or a zoo. I just can't tell. The light looks artificial, but the photographer could've taken an artificial light source into the wild. I know a few who do for wildlife shots. In the end, I just can't tell. I'd hate to shoot that photo down and simply be wrong (if it were in its natural environment). And I'd hate to not shoot it down, but kill other zoo shots, if it were in fact a zoo shot! A conundrum of grief and guilt... (lol)
So, you're asking why zoo shots would be alright for me ~ and that's pretty much it. I get your point, however. And you've got me thinking twice, for sure! "Natural environment" does seem to signify that not only household pets shouldn't be allowed, but also zoo shots. I'm just not sure if I'm comfortable voting down (or simply not voting) for a shot I can't peg down on those terms. Sometimes it's hard to tell.
Alas, the chaos of interpretation and judgment...!
~ janson.
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01/25/2006 02:25:30 PM · #71 |
Hi BrennanOB, as a person who tends to want to stick to the suggested rules at most times, it is difficult for me to take the other side here, but feel I must. The challenge stated non domesticated (no dogs, cats, sheep, cows, horses, etc) living in a natural environment, NOT their natural habitat!! There is a great difference there for me. The shot I entered was NOT from a zoo, but sure could have looked as if it was because there are man made artifacts showing in the photo - no way to get rid of them. As another poster says, places like yosemite and other parks regularly feed and protect their animals, does this make that a zoo, or not acceptable to this challenge? If you ever came to Florida and walked out any fishing pier on any given day you would see LOTS of wild birds, including pelicans, cormorants, anhingas, blue herons, etc etc etc, does this make them NOT wildlife? I think not, a good picture of a NOT domesticated animal - to me preferrably not showing any cage, enclosure, etc - is a good picture of wildlife, no matter where it was taken. Hope this helps in seeing the "other" side a bit better.
Jacque |
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01/25/2006 02:41:10 PM · #72 |
Some of the "zoo" shots are incredible, beautifully composed with great exposure and color. Some of the large bird shots are gorgeous! Even some of the subjects that clearly do not meet the challenge (insects, fish, people ΓΆ€“ before you scream look at the description as they are not mentioned) are great shots. All deserve high scores.
But do they? Our challenges have a description and although you clearly can not get disqualified for not meeting the challenge the rules do state that the voter should take into account the challenge description when voting. As a matter of fact I believe it says you should put a very high value on meeting the challenge when scoring.
As some others have said already, it comes down to effort and degree of difficulty. I for one score accordingly. If I personally know that it takes great effort and the degree of difficulty is high in obtaining, for instance, a wild non-yard bird shot then that shot, if well done, will get a boost in score. It I see a shot of a lion, tiger or bear (oh my!) clearly in the plains or tundra or woods then that shot will get a boost in score.
So, although I may think the shot is absolutely beautiful I may not score it as high in this challenge if it clearly does not meet my definition of the challenge description. That is the deal here. Otherwise, as is much argued here almost daily, all challenges would be open challenges.
So everyone relax and go vote your definitoin of the challenge. Don't get offended if someone disagrees. In the end the best photo that at least comes close to the challenge description normally wins.
Message edited by author 2006-01-25 14:45:33.
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01/25/2006 05:04:58 PM · #73 |
Originally posted by bacchus:
But, because of the nature of the shot, I can't tell if it's actually in its natural environment (Australia, I believe), or in a studio or a zoo. I just can't tell. |
Then vote lower for the ones that didn't clearly show that their image is of wildlife "living in a natural environment". If a photographer makes it difficult to determine if the details of the challenge were met, then they run the risk of compromising their score.
I would think that efforts to capture a great image within the guidelines specified is definitely a "challenge" and those who meet the challenge should be rewarded. |
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01/25/2006 05:19:14 PM · #74 |
Slowly climbing non-zoo shot
Votes: 98
Views: 112
Avg Vote: 6.1122
Comments: 5
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01/25/2006 05:20:59 PM · #75 |
flucuating non-zoo shot:
Votes: 100
Views: 131
Avg Vote: 6.4200
Comments: 4
Favorites: 0
Wish Lists: 0
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