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12/05/2005 03:58:17 PM · #26 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Originally posted by Brent_Ward:
What about not letting people vote on the challenges they have entered? I think this is very practical, and is the rule of thumb for all major photo competitions. |
There are 514 entries in Free Study and, with 36 hours to go, my entry has 219 votes. Of that number you can be SURE that a significant percentage of the voters also entered the challenge. Not allowing us to vote on challenges we have entered would decimate the voter base. There are not all that many really active players in DPC, I don't think.
I'd be more interested, frankly, in making it so if you DIDN'T vote say, 50% of the entries in a challenge you had entered, your entry would be removed when voting ended. I believe we have a significant number of people in DPC who don't do anything but enter, and rarely vote at all. IMO, these people are basically leeches on the body of DPC ;-)
R. |
I can't honestly say that I've gon through voting on every entry in every challenge that I've entered, but this is an interesting idea worthy of some discussion.
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12/05/2005 04:03:20 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by mesmeraj:
....i found the subject of the challenge so boring i didn't want to enter it why in the heck would i want to lookj at 200 images of something i found so unappealing. |
That is the challenge!
I think many people miss the point when very mundane sounding topics are given ( spoons, pencils, belly lint!)
Its the idea of stretching your mind, incorporating something everyone handles every day and may take for granted like eating utensils, and making something from it, MacGyver Style!
Frankly, the spoons, forks and knives type challenges are a heck of a lot more inspiring than very specific challenges like "Find the meaning of life in a high perspective while the sun goes down and two dogs hump each other" I mean, talking about not giving a guy any latitude to think! :-D
Edit (Here come all the meaning of life in a high perspective while the sun goes down and two dogs hump each other photos just to mock me) :-P
Message edited by author 2005-12-05 16:05:29.
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12/05/2005 04:10:03 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by hokie:
Originally posted by mesmeraj:
....i found the subject of the challenge so boring i didn't want to enter it why in the heck would i want to lookj at 200 images of something i found so unappealing. |
That is the challenge!
I think many people miss the point when very mundane sounding topics are given ( spoons, pencils, belly lint!)
Its the idea of stretching your mind, incorporating something everyone handles every day and may take for granted like eating utensils, and making something from it, MacGyver Style! |
Agreed! I love the "mundane" challenges, they are fun to mess around with and I learn things from them.
R. |
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12/05/2005 04:10:59 PM · #29 |
The challenge is to turn my favourite thing in the world into a misery by having to look at 200 sports photos?
I don't think so.
I like the "mudane" challenges. I am with Shannon, it is youre imagination that makes a theme mudane, not the theme itself. But i do not like spots photos, or landscape photos, i don't want to vote on subjects like that. And i won't, because i am here for fun. |
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12/05/2005 04:30:28 PM · #30 |
| What bothers me the most is that people just leave comments such as "blurry" or "no mind composition". Its so annoying. It would be so much nicer to just post on what you thing the photographer could have done better other than just saying whats wrong with it. |
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12/05/2005 04:32:00 PM · #31 |
Look at your photography as poetry. You can make a sunset melt the viewer with the time selection, the composition and the post processing. There are many subjects that are glorious in their own right...ah, ah, but then to apply your art to the mundane. Here you take a sunject not so glorious, not so generally appealing and with your imagination and technique you give a life, a beauty that raises the mundane into art.
I am invariably almost always amazed at how the creative minds work their magic to present outstanding images. If you think of your profession or hobby as art then all generally comes out well. |
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12/06/2005 02:44:53 AM · #32 |
Originally posted by coatedbtrmlk:
What bothers me the most is that people just leave comments such as "blurry" or "no mind composition". Its so annoying. It would be so much nicer to just post on what you thing the photographer could have done better other than just saying whats wrong with it. |
Well, isn't that the same thing basically? What could of been done better? Sharper focus, stronger composition...
Different people have different ways of commenting and saying things. IMO, it's up to you what you get out of that information :-) |
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12/06/2005 03:33:22 AM · #33 |
A 5 or below you'd wind up commenting on something like 85%+ of the entries and quite frankly alot of people probably don't have that kind of time to spend. I know I don't. I agree that a 5 is pretty much self explanatory.
Free Study, 514 images, 85% of them if not more are 5's IMO. You'd have to comment on 63 images per day just to get them done by the deadline. That don't include the other challenges you may want to vote on also. Now you're talking well over a 100 images per day.
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12/06/2005 03:52:27 AM · #34 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
I'd be more interested, frankly, in making it so if you DIDN'T vote say, 50% of the entries in a challenge you had entered, your entry would be removed when voting ended. I believe we have a significant number of people in DPC who don't do anything but enter, and rarely vote at all. IMO, these people are basically leeches on the body of DPC ;-)
R. |
I think this is a very interesting concept. It might have an impact, however, on some of the most successful folks on the site. Librodo, for instance:
Challenges Entered: 78
Votes Cast: 1211
Avg Vote Cast: 6.3931
Votes Received: 18831
Avg Vote Received: 6.3887
Comments:
Made: 467
Helpful: 404
Received: 3004
Profile Views: 42516
Favorites
Selected by other users:
Photographer: 600 (view)
Photographs: 1742 times (view)
User's favorites: (view all)
Photographers: 37
Photographs: 68
Would Manny be considered a "leech" then? 1211 votes cast as compared to 18,831 received seems like a very one-sided stat. Likewise with the comments stats, etc.
Please note that I'm not calling anyone a "leech," but just pointing out that although I think Robert's idea is a very good one, it might pose some problems for some folks that are generally "admired" by all on the site. |
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12/06/2005 04:49:18 AM · #35 |
Unfortunately while I can see it is frustrating not to get many comments and/or votes its just a matter of logistics for many voters. I work long hours and am usually struggling to find the time to create a high quality image to enter. If I then had to vote on all or even half of the images (e.g. over 500 in free study) I just wouldn't have time. I used to be able to sneak in some voting during quiet periods at work, but have no PC in my new job :-(
When I do vote I try to comment on the exceptionally good and exceptionally bad images, and ones which could have been great "if only..." Most images are just average - in lighting, composition and execution. I don't comment on these images, I don't have time. Anyway what can you say other than "Your image is neither outstandingly poor or great. Have a look at the top 10 images to see what you should have done better". To me, thats what a vote of 5 means...
My personal preference is to vote on ALL images in a challenge, I don't feel right otherwise - I could miss voting on a great image that deserves a 10. I can understand that some people just don't have that much time though and have enormous respect for those generous souls that comment on every image - what an effort!
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12/06/2005 05:49:48 AM · #36 |
I dare to be different, always have - drove my teachers nuts (but then I've achieved things they have never even dreamed of:).
I comment on every image I vote on or I don't vote (see my profile stats). My conviction is that this is the greatest forum for photographers and growing our craft ... and that comments are the lifeblood of that. Sure it makes it very time consuming gettting to 20% on 4 challenges in one week, but quality is way better for our photogs than quantity.
On the subject of DNMC: I regard the challenge subject as if I am a commercial photographer where a client or a pictures editor have asked for an image on that subject to illustrate a story, advertisement, poster etc. In use, those images are most unlikely to have titles. Therefore the image must communicate the keyword(s) of the challenge/brief without assistance. When I'm voting, if the image doesn't even try, it gets a 3 or worse because if I was a pictures editor I would bin it and certainly not pay the photogrpaher who couldn't meet my brief and was wasting my time.
Brett
Message edited by author 2005-12-06 05:59:01. |
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12/06/2005 06:37:25 AM · #37 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Originally posted by Brent_Ward:
What about not letting people vote on the challenges they have entered? I think this is very practical, and is the rule of thumb for all major photo competitions. |
I'd be more interested, frankly, in making it so if you DIDN'T vote say, 50% of the entries in a challenge you had entered, your entry would be removed when voting ended. I believe we have a significant number of people in DPC who don't do anything but enter, and rarely vote at all. IMO, these people are basically leeches on the body of DPC ;-)
R. |
But if people had the chance of having their entry removed, then I'm sure a lot of people would wait to vote 50%, perhaps just staying on 49% and see how well their entry was doing, if it was doing crap, they probably wouldn't make that last vote and deliberately get their entry removed.
Maybe?
Or maybe I'm just too cynical?
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12/06/2005 12:58:16 PM · #38 |
I wish more people had the time, expertise and dedication to use the approach that KiwiPix outlined.
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12/06/2005 01:02:29 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by hollisterGq:
I think that you should set it up to where if someone votes below a 5 (since 5 would be mediocre) they must leave a comment explaining what they think was wrong. even if it's just "not my taste" it seems lately lots of people are getting random low votes with no explanation and maybe this would help out in some sort of way. |
I agree.
However, how do you force a comment? the best the software will do is validate that the voter typed something...X, for example. X is not gonna be helpful. Of course, having my name attached to a comment of 'X' is not gonna look good.
Perhaps add a checkbox :Comment was helpful and :Comment was stupid
wold help.
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12/06/2005 01:16:12 PM · #40 |
RGO, UNCLEBRO:
That wasn't really a serious proposal. I would not advocate it as a practical solution to anything. It just struck me as a sort of reductio ad absurdum comparison to the other proposal put forward here, and many other times; "forced comments".
For sure, if failure to vote on 50% entries got one removed from the challenge then people WOULD hold off voting to evaluate their scores. And I don't REALLY think everyone who votes seldom is a "leech" LOL. We DO have people who come in, enter challenges, never respond to threads, don't check off their comments, basically are non-participants, but I don't see it as a problem. People like Manny aren't a problem. He's been a participating member of the site for quite a while, he's shared his thoughts and expertise freely, he's just fine.
I would not really presume to judge others against my own activity standards, in other words. MOSR people have lives (unlike me, apparently) and DPC is just a small part of their activities :-)
R. |
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