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11/02/2005 02:00:15 AM · #1 |
Ok, I am getting rather tired, irritated or ...not sure what work fits.
In the last 4 challenges (including shutterspeed and transparency) the commenters are second guessing my cropping. Big time. My scores are in the low to mid 5s, which is above my average, so I am happy with that...then I wonder...would I be doing that much better if I had cropped out the ______ like several commenters say.
I guess this bugs me cause in Transparency I tried it that way and chose my specicific crop that I entered. The shutterspeed one I envisioned it and made it happen (a rare combination for me BTW) so i was rather pleased. Then the commenter suggesting crop out the ________, and damn it, i think he's right!
How do you decide if it's cropped right or not? When, if ever, do you stop second guessing? Am i just in a 'phase', and this too will pass like last night's creamed corn?
Example:
The boy - in or out? I never considered leaving him out, figuring him to be a compositional plus, connecting emotionally with the viewer. Is the fact I never considered the other version mean i am missing some third eye?
Message edited by author 2005-11-02 02:02:40. |
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11/02/2005 02:09:40 AM · #2 |
In this particular case it's "just another shot" without the child. Some will like the child, some won't, but without the child there's nothing to write home about. If I removed anything from that shot, it would be the white thingy between the child and the water, which bugs the heck out of me...
I have a love/hate relationship with cropping as well. I'm "trained" to use full-frame, it's kind of built-in after all my years of zone system, large-format work. Now I have the 20D, which makes a VERY "wide" image, a much skinnier rectangle than I am used to from the old days. BUT when I start cropping it down to nominal 8x10 proportions I usually feel like I'm losing something, so my pictures are mostly getting skinnier... Tends to work well for landscapes anyway, so...
When I'm processing for DPC challenges I always click the magnifier a couple times then scroll around images and see radically different, tighter crops, just to energize my thoughts around potentilaities. Sometimes I end up with some seriously cropped-in shots that seem to work well, but this isn't a valid approach for printing, though it works fine at 640 pixels.
R.
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11/02/2005 02:09:41 AM · #3 |
| Crop and recrop till you have what feels right! I have had shots that just didn't work because no matter how I cropped them it didn't feel right. Too confined or too much space or lopsided whatever. It's digital. You can't kill electron trees by repeated cropping till ya get what feels good! Oh and you will never make everyone here happy. How many times do you get the comment, 'I don't like how you left ________ in the shot' and someone else says 'The ________ in this shot makes it work!)? |
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11/02/2005 02:17:47 AM · #4 |
The white thing is a drain pipe. basic challenge...it had to stay. I had maybe 5 minutes if that to get this shot. 4 year olds sometimes make lousy models, particularly when they just don't understand what you want and why.
I too do the scroll and crop and recrop and look. I tend to stay loose, but am working to overcome that.
perhaps I am irritated becuase I was sure my transparency image was sub par, and my shutter speed very good...so I am getting 5.2ish on the first and sub 5 on the second (if i hadn't seen the 5 total votes at 5.6 perhaps I'd be OK - it just keeps dropping now)
My alternate, which I am sure is better with the 4 year old in it ;P
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11/02/2005 02:20:00 AM · #5 |
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
The white thing is a drain pipe. basic challenge...it had to stay. |
Yah, I realize it's basic challenge rules; I'm just discussing the image as an image now, the rules don't apply anymore if you want to improve it :-)
R.
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11/02/2005 02:20:44 AM · #6 |
I agree with Robert, the child totally makes that particular shot. And sometimes I do the scrolling thing magnified too :-) sometimes I find something I hadn't even considered. And like TC said, crop, crop, crop, keep trying and find what feels right to you. And yeah, you'll go crazy if you try to go with every comment :-) no matter how well intended or honest the commenter was, there are a lot of times when you just have to acknowledge their opinion, consider it, then just stick with what YOU like :-)
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11/02/2005 02:34:42 AM · #7 |
I'm sorry that you were so irritated by my comment on this. Don't take my opinions too seriously, I can barely please anyone around here myself so I must not know much. ;)
Outside the scope of the challenge I would've preferred the photo to be about the boy. You're right, he does add emotional interest. My impression, however, was that this was one of those photos that were entered because it just happened to have a reflection in it not because it was a planned and thoughtful challenge shoot from the start. I guessed I've just had it drilled into my mind in my beginning photo classes to work simply and avoid having multiple subjects in one shot.
Obviously others disagree with me. No big deal. You can't please us all, so don't try to please anyone but yourself. ;)
(I didn't even vote in the challenge -- just commented on a handful of the entries. So you don't need to worry that my dissent hurt your score.) |
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11/02/2005 02:37:27 AM · #8 |
In order to maximize resolution you should try to compose the shot so that you don't have to crop at all. That's not always possible though, so, at times, it may be necessary to crop the shot in order to get a decent composition. Unfortunately, if you have to crop too much you loose enough resolution to cause serious image degradation.
This photo is a pretty good example of a shot that was cropped too much. I took this shot from the beach with a 350mm lens, but 350mm wasn't enough reach to get the shot I wanted. This image is only a small portion (approx. 1/4 if I remember correctly) of the full frame, and it shows noticable degradation. The composition before cropping was hopeless though, so I cropped the heck out it.
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11/02/2005 02:46:56 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by micknewton:
This photo is a pretty good example of a shot that was cropped too much. I took this shot from the beach with a 350mm lens, but 350mm wasn't enough reach to get the shot I wanted. This image is only a small portion (approx. 1/4 if I remember correctly) of the full frame, and it shows noticable degradation. The composition before cropping was hopeless though, so I cropped the heck out it.
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Just for the heck of it I ran it through focus magic:
Robt.
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11/02/2005 02:53:12 AM · #10 |
| There seems to be a slight improvment in focus and sharpness. Hmmm is this another program to have in my arsenal? |
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11/02/2005 03:06:54 AM · #11 |
That did improve the shot a little. Still, not enough to make up for the lack of detail caused by too few pixels. I still want a 600mm lens for christmas. :)
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11/02/2005 03:22:25 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by rikki11:
There seems to be a slight improvment in focus and sharpness. Hmmm is this another program to have in my arsenal? |
Folks who use CS2 seem to think there's a function in there that does the same thing as focus magic. I wouldn't know, I still use 7.0... I find it to be a very handy tool for rescuing slight motion blur fromn otherwise-nice images. My hands aren't as steady as they used to be... It can rescue slightly OOF images as well, but that's less of a problem for me.
Robt.
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11/02/2005 03:28:53 AM · #13 |
| where do i get this bear? i only use PS 7 at home but have CS at work :( |
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11/02/2005 03:31:05 AM · #14 |
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