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06/08/2005 12:25:56 PM · #101 |
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06/08/2005 12:31:13 PM · #102 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by Riponlady:
The point remains - who is going to draw these lines of acceptability and on what basis?
Pauline |
Again....Rudy Guiliani |
Probably being incredibly stupid but ...Who is Rudy Guiliani?
P |
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06/08/2005 12:32:41 PM · #103 |
Was he not the Mayor of New York
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06/08/2005 12:40:39 PM · #104 |
It will be a sad day indeed when suicide images appeal to the masses...
Originally posted by Kavey:
...Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
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06/08/2005 12:44:23 PM · #105 |
Originally posted by Artan:
Was he not the Mayor of New York |
Yes he was Mayor of New York City, best-known for his stewardship of the city post 9/11, but also noteworthy for his rather unilateral enforcement of his own taste on the body politic under the guise of "claning up" the city.
R.
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06/08/2005 12:56:01 PM · #106 |
Think aobut it this way people are drawn to dramatic situations if you will,,like for example on the news disasters accidents shootings especially if it hits close to home people are drawn to it,,its curiosity and I dont think anyone is bad for capturing the moment your showing a side of someone or capturing those emotions, we all do it in one way or another,,and everyone has their right to their opinion,,I guess if you cant deal with it than dont look,,its as simple as that.
Take this as you like,,not trying to piss anyone off just my opinion. |
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06/08/2005 01:02:08 PM · #107 |
Originally posted by glad2badad:
It will be a sad day indeed when suicide images appeal to the masses...
Originally posted by Kavey:
...Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
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I was referring there not specifically to suicide images but to any images that more conservative members would rather see banned but... my comment holds:
Whilst I can't say they appeal in the sense of wanting to hang them on the wall, I do find value in them because they remind me that the world isn't always a wonderful place, that bad things happen and often kick-start all kinds of discussions and thought processes related to the issue. For me, there IS an appeal in images that make me think, that make me confront difficult issues, that make me reconsider my own actions and feelings.
Obviously, a smaller minority of DPCers will get something out of these kind of images but we exist nonetheless.
And, it is my opinion that even those photographers who would like to specialise or venture into presenting images of difficult, thought provoking things have the right to use DPC to learn how to improve their skills in doing that. Most aren't so stupid as to think they'll get as high a vote with these as with a pretty, happy picture but can still hope to get the one or two comments that constructively help.
Message edited by author 2005-06-08 13:03:21.
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06/08/2005 01:48:19 PM · #108 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Originally posted by Artan:
Was he not the Mayor of New York |
Yes he was Mayor of New York City, best-known for his stewardship of the city post 9/11, but also noteworthy for his rather unilateral enforcement of his own taste on the body politic under the guise of "claning up" the city.
R. |
Thanks Robt. Sorry I am so ignorant of this part of US politics. Ken Livingstone is the London Mayor and his decisions are causing some discussion over here. One man's meat............
P |
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06/08/2005 01:48:21 PM · #109 |
I am just too impatient! Keep double posting. Sorry!:(
Message edited by author 2005-06-08 13:49:17. |
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06/08/2005 02:36:14 PM · #110 |
Originally posted by :
Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
Improving technique ok, but improving one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? For me a big NO NO!
The art of photography
is like writing poetry
Your soul should show
in the way you display
The things you see,
the things you feel
You put them together
in words of colored pixels
The way you see fit
And if you're lucky
Others will see your soul
flying free
That... is photography to me
just like writing poetry
Titia
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06/08/2005 02:38:53 PM · #111 |
Originally posted by Riponlady:
The point remains - who is going to draw these lines of acceptability and on what basis?
Also we have a wide variety of cultures represented.
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Exactly.. Why don't we respect DPC members from some muslim countries for example, where taking pictures of people and animals is forbidden, those pictures are chocking, maybe they will file a legal suit.
Originally posted by Riponlady:
By the way, were there not recent photos in "Decisions" that showed lines of pseudo cocaine? Do these not go against the rules of showing drugs and so were these DQ'd?
Pauline |
Exactly my thoughts.. Thinking there's a sub motive for the other stuff, disguised as.. :)
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06/08/2005 04:00:29 PM · #112 |
| I think this thread is pretty fuuny. No offense to anybody's opinion because your all intitled to one. The simple fact is that when someone posts a image like the ones you are discussing they are seeking to provoke and stir feelings. By ranting and arguing about it, you are doing exactly what the image was intended for. They have succeded and you all have helped them. They win...with your help.... |
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06/08/2005 04:14:15 PM · #113 |
| could a member of the site council please tell me if the drug pictures of decision were dq'd? |
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06/08/2005 04:19:42 PM · #114 |
Originally posted by J_Ehrat:
I think this thread is pretty fuuny. No offense to anybody's opinion because your all intitled to one. The simple fact is that when someone posts a image like the ones you are discussing they are seeking to provoke and stir feelings. By ranting and arguing about it, you are doing exactly what the image was intended for. They have succeded and you all have helped them. They win...with your help.... |
Well yea... the question is, should their scores be negatively impacted by the feelings stirred (since they will most likely be negative). So... do you vote them higher for having your feelings stirred at all, or do you vote them lower for having your negative feelings stirred, or neither.
I choose to not go one way or another. |
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06/08/2005 04:22:59 PM · #115 |
The image didn't depict someone actually using drugs so it was OK per TOS. It wouldn't be a DQ infraction...
Originally posted by Riponlady:
could a member of the site council please tell me if the drug pictures of decision were dq'd? |
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06/08/2005 04:27:38 PM · #116 |
Originally posted by Titia:
Improving technique ok, but improving one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? For me a big NO NO!
The art of photography
is like writing poetry
Your soul should show
in the way you display
The things you see,
the things you feel
You put them together
in words of colored pixels
The way you see fit
And if you're lucky
Others will see your soul
flying free
That... is photography to me
just like writing poetry
Titia |
That's beautifully put. Thanks for sharing. When my scores suffer, and I feel I've done some of my best work, I'm always tempted to think "how could I have done this to appeal to the masses, and get a higher score?"
And then I come to my senses and I remember that I primarily take the picture to express how I see something, and if it pleases me, that's enough. (Granted, I am always trying to improve both creatively and technically.)
But I do admit to hearing the high score siren call.
And it makes me stop and think.
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06/08/2005 04:39:24 PM · #117 |
Originally posted by glad2badad:
The image didn't depict someone actually using drugs so it was OK per TOS. It wouldn't be a DQ infraction...
Originally posted by Riponlady:
could a member of the site council please tell me if the drug pictures of decision were dq'd? |
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Thanks - although cutting a line of coke is not technically using seems pretty close to me! |
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06/08/2005 04:39:54 PM · #118 |
Originally posted by glad2badad:
The image didn't depict someone actually using drugs so it was OK per TOS. It wouldn't be a DQ infraction...
Originally posted by Riponlady:
could a member of the site council please tell me if the drug pictures of decision were dq'd? |
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The TOS prohibits photos which PROMOTE the use of drugs -- none of these photos was adjudged to meet that criterion, and thus they still appear in their proper ranking in the challenge results.
If any photo is DQ'd, you'll find it at the very end of the challenge results, below the last-placed picture, along with the reason for the DQ.
Message edited by author 2005-06-08 16:44:49. |
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06/08/2005 04:48:57 PM · #119 |
Originally posted by Kavey:
Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
I think that's the first time I have heard that premise put forward -- that dpc's point is to improve one's ability to appeal to the masses. On the other hand I have heard many times people and images being disparaged for appealing to the masses being their main thrust.
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06/08/2005 04:58:33 PM · #120 |
There are two DQs listed at the end of Decisions. One for a spot editing violation and the other at the submitter's request.
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06/08/2005 05:04:08 PM · #121 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Yes he was Mayor of New York City, best-known for his stewardship of the city post 9/11, but also noteworthy for his rather unilateral enforcement of his own taste on the body politic under the guise of "claning up" the city. |
I admit that Rudy is conservative, and not the most open-minded guy out there, but CLANING UP may be a bit harsh ;)
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06/08/2005 05:04:50 PM · #122 |
the Granular challenge had a number of cocaine shots. one was of someone actually using, so that was disqualified.
photos that are disqualified for ToS violations will not appear at the end of challenges (displaying images that violate ToS -- even if they were disqualified -- presents a liability). therefore, it's not viewable anymore.
there were 4 other cocaine shots in that challenge. all had DQ requests and all were allowed to remain by a large majority of the SC. we also had a thorough debate about them during the voting. |
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06/08/2005 05:06:19 PM · #123 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Originally posted by Kavey:
Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
I think that's the first time I have heard that premise put forward -- that dpc's point is to improve one's ability to appeal to the masses. On the other hand I have heard many times people and images being disparaged for appealing to the masses being their main thrust. |
Oddly enough, what I was trying to say but not expressing well is that DPC is NOT just about improving technique but ALSO about improving one's ability to learn about how to select CONTENT.
I guess what I should have said to more accurately express what I meant is that DPC is also about learning to improve one's ability to elicit the response one is looking for from the masses.
That's actually what I was really meaning.
Essentially, some people want to learn how to take pretty, decorative images that people would like to have on their walls. Some want to learn how to take images that tell a story, introduce an idea, evoke an emotion. Others want to learn how to take images that change peoples' attitudes about a given subject or at the very least make them think.
Given these varying aims, it seemed to me that it was wrong to ask people to vote purely on their (supposedly) objective opinion of the technical merits of entries.
Voting according to their subjective opinions of the entries as a whole, including their reactions to the contents, seemed to me to be a better way of providing a more all-round learning environment for photographers.
Hopefully that clarifies better what I was trying to get at?
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06/08/2005 05:08:00 PM · #124 |
Originally posted by coolhar:
Originally posted by Kavey:
Isn't the whole point of DPC improving not only in technique but also improving in one's ability to create work that appeals to the masses? |
I think that's the first time I have heard that premise put forward -- that dpc's point is to improve one's ability to appeal to the masses. |
i would think that wanting to improve your ability to create work with mass appeal is a personal choice -- and for many it's optional. a lot of people enter shots they like and don't care about the score, and i say "good for them" and vote accordingly. |
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06/08/2005 05:08:46 PM · #125 |
Originally posted by Kavey:
I guess what I should have said to more accurately express what I meant is that DPC is also about learning to improve one's ability to elicit the response one is looking for from the masses. |
i think that's worded much better. :) and it's true! |
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