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05/26/2005 07:53:49 PM · #1 |
Hi Everyone,
I very exitedly went to look at the Rebel XT 8MP at my local camera shop thinking it was exactly what I wanted, and now I am more confused! The salesperson really tried to sell me the Nikon D70 instead, (same price with the rebates). Any thoughts on this? I know the Nikon D70 is a great camera, but one of my major concerns was my nikon (Prosumers?) (coolpix 995 and 4500) had problems in low lite situations - the D70 only goes to ISO 200 vs. the canon ISO of 100 - isn't the 100 better for this and to reduce noise? I also think for the money maybe the 6.3 Rebel may be okay for what I need, because I could afford two lenses with that instead of one. Or is the Rebel XT worth getting with only the one lens? Thought I had this figured out, now I have no clue again as to what to get! My head is spinning and I still have no new camera!!! help if you can!
thanks, bj
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05/26/2005 09:25:40 PM · #2 |
Hey BJ,
I had the same dilemma 10/04, except there was no Rebel XT. First, in terms of image quality, ISO 100 is in theory better to have than 200. Will it make your images look cleaner? I'd doubt you'd notice the difference unless making really large prints. In terms of MP's, 6.1 or 6.3 should be enough unless you really like croppig or intend to regularly print bigger than 8x10 inch prints. In terms of focusing performance in low light, I don't think anyone of the three cameras are notoriously good or bad.
The biggest difference for me was the price difference and the difference in performance. The D70/XT start almost immediately, capture more frames of picture per second, have faster buffers that can download images to the CF card faster. I liked the feel of the D70 the best but with the price difference, I got many Canon accessories for my Digital Rebel, especially the battery grip (which Nikon doesn't offer), which makes shooting/holding the camera much more pleasant. The slower performance of the DR doesn't bother me enough to have gotten the D70.
So ask yourself some questions after handling the camera to see how they feel in your hand. Is the performance in start up, buffer, fps, worth the extra money? If so, get the D70/XT. If not, consider the DR and either save some money or buy a good second lens. If you have particular interestes and need a more specialized lens than the 18-55 Canon kit or the Nikon 18-70mm kit lens, then saving the extra money for a second lens maybe your best option.
P.S. I wouldn't bother with the salesman's advice. Their main job is to sell you things that makes them the most money or inventory that they need to get rid of (i.e. for the new D70s and D50).
Message edited by author 2005-05-26 21:34:37.
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05/26/2005 09:28:55 PM · #3 |
Sorry to butt in here, but.. you're missing a great choice.
I don't see the Pentax *ist Ds in that line up! lol
It's truly deserving of being mentioned among those two canons and the nikon.. check it out :)
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05/26/2005 09:31:56 PM · #4 |
The salesman talked to me about the Nikon too but I picked the 350D. Roght or wrong is hard to tell. There are only two bugs about my camera that I personnally think would not have been problem with the D70. firts one is the camera size. I'd have never believed it before but the 350D is a little bit to small to really be perfectly efficient, while the Nikon is bigger. 2nd problem is the autofocus and viewfinder size with the canon. The autofocus often get wrong and focuses on the background and if you want to do it manually the viewfinder is too small to make it easy. If I had to choose again today I'd buy the canon again for all the other advantages the camera have. Higher pixel count, more people in the canon owners community to help if you have a problem. lightweight, fast enough (with a fast CF card) iso 100-1600 is hell of a range. Perfect at 100 very clean from 200 to 400 very usable at 800 and still usable at 1600 (specially if you turn on in camera noise frame-substraction) and the last. This thing look awesone!.. (especially with my sigma 70-300mm APO with lens hood on it).
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05/26/2005 09:32:04 PM · #5 |
| the real question you should ask yourself is which company's glass impresses you the most. if you go canon or nikon... once you start buying glass..they "own" you.. so this is what you need to be looking at. |
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05/26/2005 09:32:43 PM · #6 |
If you're interested, I might be willing to part with my eos 300 d with 18-55 kit lens, Canon EF 75-300 f4-5.6 III, 512 MB card, USB 2.0 card reader, Lowepro mini trekker AW, 2 Cokin 58mm UV filters, and lens cleaning cloth for $800...maybe interested...let me know if you are.
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05/26/2005 10:15:09 PM · #7 |
im currently in the same dilemna...so here's what i have figured so far
nikon (d70/d70s/d50) -
-they feel more professional (solid build, heavier, better grips) than the rebels
-2 inch screen on the 70s and the 50, compared to the 1.8 on the rebels and also the d70
-18-70 is a much better kit lens than the 18-55 that canon gives you if you go for the kit.
-that nikkor 50mm 1.8D is really appealing and, in my opinion, looks a lot better than the canon counterpart - the 50mm 1.8 II
-nikon is coming out with two new mid price range lenses for the d50 coming out june sometime
rebel xt
-higher mp count
-it seems like canon is putting higher technology and better features into their lower lines now, instead of just keeping them in the 10/20D and 1 series (digic II, etc.)
-i think canon has more options in the mid price range when it comes to glass
-i heard canon customer service is better than nikon's
-50mm 1.8 II is supposedly very good for the 70$ or so that you can get it for
-on the professional side, canon L glass is top of the line. not sure if nikon has a professional lens line as extensive as canon's
-canon is most likely going to win more consumers than nikon will
for me, i thought the rebel xt was the surefire way to go. but then i went to best buy, like you, and got both cameras in my hands, and clearly, the nikons felt much better than the xt in my opinion. but then again, if that's the case, maybe i'll just get the bg-e3 vertical grip for the rebel. that's all i have to say |
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05/26/2005 10:16:48 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by art-inept:
...and got both cameras in my hands, and clearly, the nikons felt much better than the xt in my opinion... |
I felt the same way at best buy, but in all honesty, you get really used to the camera after you have it -- I know the xt is smaller than the 300d, but still, you WILL get used to it.
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05/26/2005 10:26:43 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by deapee:
Originally posted by art-inept:
...and got both cameras in my hands, and clearly, the nikons felt much better than the xt in my opinion... |
I felt the same way at best buy, but in all honesty, you get really used to the camera after you have it -- I know the xt is smaller than the 300d, but still, you WILL get used to it. |
ya i figured that too, and plus, photography is about the image not the comfort right? canon had to cut some luxuries to pack all that power into such a small, and relatively cheap, package. |
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05/26/2005 10:31:12 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by art-inept:
ya i figured that too, and plus, photography is about the image not the comfort right? canon had to cut some luxuries to pack all that power into such a small, and relatively cheap, package. |
That's the thing...there aren't many corners cut.
More MP's, better sensor, faster buffer, smaller (yet just as effective) battery, stronger lens-mount, sturdier mirror, stronger body...the list goes on and on. The XT *IS* going to steal sales away from the 20d, there's no doubt about that...it's quite the package.
With canon's glass and the new XT, it over the d70 is a no-brainer, in all honesty. I don't just say that because I have a canon either -- I'm not a Nikon hater -- if Nikon was better, I'd say so.
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05/26/2005 10:39:28 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by Artyste:
Sorry to butt in here, but.. you're missing a great choice.
I don't see the Pentax *ist Ds in that line up! lol
It's truly deserving of being mentioned among those two canons and the nikon.. check it out :) |
rofl
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05/26/2005 10:43:58 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by deapee:
With canon's glass and the new XT, it over the d70 is a no-brainer, in all honesty. I don't just say that because I have a canon either -- I'm not a Nikon hater -- if Nikon was better, I'd say so. |
I'd say the XT is comparable to the D70. I haven't seen anything that makes it a "no brainer" better than the D70. Weigh the pros & cons of each and they are about the same. Glass of both brands are good, although the D70 kit lens is, from what I've seen/read, much better than the Canon.
I personally think Nikon makes a better quality product overall.
I just had a problem with my D70, but that was the first issue I had with it in 14 months of owning it. Actually, I just bought a second D70 this week, to add to the collection.
It's whatever you like though.
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05/26/2005 11:19:37 PM · #13 |
i dunno, i think the xt definitely has more power, digic II, 8mp, slightly longer full burst duration with its buffer, etc. nikon feels better, more professional and built, period. but nikon has a few problems that xt really doesn't, two i can mention, nikon has noticeable moire, and more noise. not only does the xt have an iso 100 but the added mp count reduces the appearance of noise when you downsize it to a 6mp size image. you know what i mean?
.art-inept.
Message edited by author 2005-05-26 23:20:23. |
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05/26/2005 11:24:01 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by deapee:
[quote=art-inept]
With canon's glass and the new XT, it over the d70 is a no-brainer, in all honesty. I don't just say that because I have a canon either -- I'm not a Nikon hater -- if Nikon was better, I'd say so. |
not that it will ever matter to me really, but nikon has the reputation for the better glass usually.
the only reason i bought the d70 over the 20d was cuz nikon made a digi fisheye and canon doesnt. d70 just felt better to me too.
its whatever feels more comfortable to you i'd say. dont get too caught up the in the gear...its you makin the pictures. if your gear has the manual controls etc u need then you're set either way. |
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05/26/2005 11:28:00 PM · #15 |
| What about the reports of the D70 dying after a certain number of pictures were taken? I would try to find out when it was made and see if it was ok. ( I tried to find if mine was ok, it was purchased in November of 2004) |
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05/26/2005 11:30:41 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by petrakka:
Originally posted by deapee:
[quote=art-inept]
With canon's glass and the new XT, it over the d70 is a no-brainer, in all honesty. I don't just say that because I have a canon either -- I'm not a Nikon hater -- if Nikon was better, I'd say so. |
not that it will ever matter to me really, but nikon has the reputation for the better glass usually.
the only reason i bought the d70 over the 20d was cuz nikon made a digi fisheye and canon doesnt. d70 just felt better to me too.
its whatever feels more comfortable to you i'd say. dont get too caught up the in the gear...its you makin the pictures. if your gear has the manual controls etc u need then you're set either way. |
hmm i would say nikon has a better reputation for their wide angle lenses, not necessarily all lenses. but i agree with you, it's really the photographer who makes the picture. in reality, i think even photoshop is more important than the camera. you might think im crazy
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05/26/2005 11:31:12 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by heatherd:
What about the reports of the D70 dying after a certain number of pictures were taken? I would try to find out when it was made and see if it was ok. ( I tried to find if mine was ok, it was purchased in November of 2004) |
I think that was an April Fool's joke that got out of hand. If it's on the internet it must be true. |
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05/27/2005 12:39:19 AM · #18 |
Originally posted by faidoi:
Originally posted by heatherd:
What about the reports of the D70 dying after a certain number of pictures were taken? I would try to find out when it was made and see if it was ok. ( I tried to find if mine was ok, it was purchased in November of 2004) |
I think that was an April Fool's joke that got out of hand. If it's on the internet it must be true. |
It was a problem with some of the first release D70's, which happened to include mine. From the information that I have gathered the problem was fixed before Sept 2004. The good news is it is easily fixable by Nikon. This happened to mine (died) last weekend and I went ahead and bought a second D70 this week.
art-inept - So you are saying that all the D70 photos have noticable moire problems? I've shot over 5300 photos so far and noticed it on one. I think the moire issue was blown a bit out of proportion when the D70 was first released.
Message edited by author 2005-05-27 00:40:36.
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05/27/2005 01:53:26 AM · #19 |
Like many others I went to the store to buy a 300D, I held it and played with the kit lens, then tried the D70, needless to say - I did not bother touching the 300D again.
Unless you have an absolute need for a specific feature then there is little to compare all the cameras in this class (with the possible exception of the Minolta 7D).
I think that there are 2 guidelines to buying such a camera; firstly, if you already have an investment in glass then stick with the relevant brand and secondly, play with the cameras and go with what feels right in your hands.
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05/27/2005 02:03:39 AM · #20 |
simply put, both are good. think about the future, look at the lenses of nikon and canon. go.
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05/27/2005 02:06:01 AM · #21 |
I've heard of short lifetimes with the D70.. dunno how true it is..
but may want to check this
link
Message edited by Manic - tidying the url. |
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05/27/2005 02:18:01 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by deapee:
faster buffer, |
faster buffer? no. The D70 buffer is far faster than the dRebel...I've had both; trust me on this one.
as far as the XT goes, it seems to me to be the best low-cost solution at the moment. It's quick (they fixed the start-up and buffer issues of the 300d), higher res, fater buffer, and it maintains exceptionally low noise according to pop-photog magazine.
As for the glass, I diagree that Nikon has better glass. I'd say the best Canon glass and the best Nikon glass are virtually indistinguishable. Canon has way more options for lesser quality glass, and has far more options overall (and a seemingly good wide angle with the new 10-22mm). But when you're looking at the best lenses of both manufactureres, neither has a notable edge.
For feel, I preferred the Nikon. It seemed the contols were more intuitive, and the menus made more sense, but as Deapee says, you can easily get used to either.
The Nikon Kit lens blows the dRebel kit lens out of the water.
Nikon will likely come up with an answer to the XT, and it will likely be a little better, because that's what they seem to do. They're slow to the race, but they run like hell once they show up.
If I were buying today, and I HAD to buy now, I'd prolly go with the Canon dReb XT. If I could be patient, I'd wait for Nikon to release the D200 or whatever they're going to call it (the D70s isn't anything more than marketing...there's no significant improvements in my mind). If the D100 replacement doesn't show up soon with a significant improvement, the only feasible option over the D70 is the D2X. having said that, Canon is a safe way to go if you're in a hurry.
For the record, I *love* my Nikon. I have invested far more in Nikon glass than I ever did in the D70 body, so I'm trusting Nikon not to let me down.
I've read a billion threads here and on DPreview, and bottom line is you're going to get a great Camera whichever way you go. People tend to get really territorial about it, but side-by-side, they're both awesome.
P
*edit to add: I'm over 30,000 exposures on my D70. no failures yet.
Message edited by author 2005-05-27 02:20:05. |
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05/27/2005 02:22:00 AM · #23 |
For what it's worth, I remember looking up the expected shutter actions before failure and the D70 had the longest life span (by 10,000 I think).
If this is a concern then it's probably best to wait until you have enough to buy a pro level camera, for me I will buy another D70 to act as a backup when I start doing more paid assignments, then after a year or so i will buy a D2X with the money :)
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05/27/2005 02:29:12 AM · #24 |
NEVERRR!! i mean, well...pedro, i feel that for the budget consumer, canon glass is probably the way to go. the nikkor range goes from really cheap cheap lenses and jumps to high end 1k+ glass. as far as i know, there's not much of a middle ground. and even when there is, the difference between nikon and canon in general is that canon uses a lot of its higher end technology like image stabilizer, digic II, etc. in a lot of its mid range line. you practically have to reach the nikkor 70-200 vr to get their vibration reduction (equivalent to canon's IS system). canon's the only company who even puts IS into a point and shoot (s1 and s2 IS). it's crazy talk.
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05/27/2005 02:31:24 AM · #25 |
but i think i might just save up and wait for the d200 when it comes out. plus, i still need to win a ribbon before i can justify buying a dSLR. :(
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