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DPChallenge Forums >> Current Challenge >> Flame suit on - what didn't work here ?
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 02/04/2005 02:49:53 AM · #1
Well, 2005 is a new year of direction for me.
My interests in challenges now lie in what makes me happy first, scores and ribbons second, and am curious as to what didn't work in my Three submission:


My personal goal was met by not having to PS the crap out of it, no Neat Image, no tripod, no remote release, just me, mashing my camera down on the railing for about a 1/2 hour in the cold and drizzle, waiting until I could get 3 cars passing by in the night.

My skin is thick and frankly could not be offended by a negative critique/comment, as I liked it.
Have at it:

Message edited by author 2005-02-04 02:52:20.
 02/04/2005 02:53:22 AM · #2
I'll bite... for me it was a six not a three. I know there were three cars but the lines are so strong it really is more sixish than threeish. Otherwise I do like the graphic quality of the shapes of the light streaks. Ann
 02/04/2005 03:08:46 AM · #3
The admins PM'ed everyone and told us it was yours. We all got together and decided you had too many ribbons! ;-)
 02/04/2005 03:17:33 AM · #4
Originally posted by BradP:
Well, 2005 is a new year of direction for me.
My interests in challenges now lie in what makes me happy first, scores and ribbons second, and am curious as to what didn't work in my Three submission:


My personal goal was met by not having to PS the crap out of it, no Neat Image, no tripod, no remote release, just me, mashing my camera down on the railing for about a 1/2 hour in the cold and drizzle, waiting until I could get 3 cars passing by in the night.

My skin is thick and frankly could not be offended by a negative critique/comment, as I liked it.
Have at it:


Brad IMO it would of done better with the white road reflectors cloned out. Even though the red lines are nice and on a good curve with a nice flow to them the white dot's seems to break the flow that would of made this a great shot. I didn't get a chance to vote in this challenge as is I would of given a 6 but with the white dot's cloned, definitely a higher score.
 02/04/2005 03:17:41 AM · #5
I agree with ACPhotoDesign - there really are more than three red tailight lines, which is the main feature of the photo.
 02/04/2005 03:31:06 AM · #6
Originally posted by Pug-H:
I agree with ACPhotoDesign - there really are more than three red taillight lines, which is the main feature of the photo.


But it was three sets of tail lights, so I think it was OK for the three challenge. BTW here is a cloned out light version that I think would of made it better. Just my opinion. Hope you didn't mind me tinkering with it.


Message edited by author 2005-02-04 03:31:28.
 02/04/2005 03:37:58 AM · #7
Considering I am a "Newbie" in this environment I hesitate to comment but here goes:

1. I found the white dots on the pavement a major distraction;

2. The presence of the street light, tree and what I believe to be an on-ramp had my eyes wandering a bit;

3.While two of the lanes have divided (split) red lines, the line furthest away only have a set of solid lines, something which seem to unbalance the image;

4. There are shadows of the tail lights, particularly at the bottom set of lights which detract from the overall picture;

5. There seem to exist a short section of tail lights just about in the middle of the upper set of lights, which also impact on the overall image;

6. The small illuminated dot located at 7 o'clock when looking at the street light also tends to draw one's attention away from the primary objects, namely the tail lights.

I do hope I have not offended you. I have marvelled at your submissions and almost feel it a sacriledge that as a Newbie I can be so critical of your submission in this instance.

The very best of luck in your future submissions.

Ray
 02/04/2005 03:44:26 AM · #8
Gave it a 7. Liked the idea, the tree and lamp competed with what was the true subject of the picture for me. I slant toward abstract on this sort of look and probably would have cropped to omit the background. Tail lights are a fairly common subject, so something would have to make them sing to make it seem a "new approach". Technically very sound, but a 7 in my book. Hope this helps.
 02/04/2005 04:22:36 AM · #9
I do see it as a way to present 3, but I felt that it was incomplete or elements not interesting. I would have liked it better if the red lines were on a totally black background, making a simple statement. The image as it is makes me ask 'why'.
 02/04/2005 04:31:26 AM · #10
Well I know standing up for one of the ribbon hogs shots might not do me any favours :P - but I quite liked this one, it got an eight from me. I can see where those against the lights on the street are coming from, but for mine cloning them out detracts slightly from the image. I like the context they provide. It wasn't quite one of my favourites of the challenge, but I'm still surprised it didn't top six. I'm also really impressed with the lack of tripod :).
 02/04/2005 04:56:26 AM · #11
Well, I didn't vote but it would not have scored high with me -- maybe a 5. Why? First, the connection with the subject is not immediately obvious without the title. Even then, the subject (the taillights) are not in the frame anymore (just their afterglow), so the image gives an impression of having just missed something -- not a bad thing necessarily, but in this case the thing I feel I have missed is the 'point'. The image is also very dark -- dark enough that I feer on many monitors it consists of just red lines below a glow. And to be the odd man out, I find the three dotted white lines to be a focal point of interest, not a distraction -- but they take my eyes past the only part that is truly of interest to me; the dimly lit area under the light. The tree and lightpost frame it well, and being the only reasonably well lit area it captures my eyes and keeps them. That is good, but not when it keeps them from the original intention of the image -- the Taillight Trio.

Let me turn the tables on you, if you don't mind. What exactly do you like about it?

David
 02/04/2005 06:51:16 AM · #12
5 - While technically good it does nothing for me beyond that. It's just a bunch of streaks across a dark landscape. Just the streaks against a solid black background may have scored a little better, but not much.

Compare it to Konador's streak shot and see the difference.

02/04/2005 08:18:12 AM · #13
Hey Brad, I would love to "bomb" with about 10 consecutive 5.7+ scores such as this one :). That said, I scored your entry as a 7, based solely on the excellent technical quality. IMO you met the challenge just fine (I tend to give a lot of slack in that area, so long as I can figure out how the photographer felt they were doing so... sometimes, though, it is beyond imagination)! Where the image fell short of the top tier, though, is that it is almost a photographic cliche and lacked great interest. Again, as I said, I and many others would take 5.7s all day long with the occaisional 6 as gravy. Good luck climbing back to the pinnacle, my friend.
 02/04/2005 08:37:21 AM · #14
I personally liked it and scored it a 7, and it totally met the challenge in my opinion. I think it would have done better if that lamp wasn't so distracting but hey it's still a very clear and clean capture. If you like the photo yourself that's a bonus, trying new things doesn't hurt, however if you took those shots here in Ontario last week you would have frozen on that bridge ;-)
 02/04/2005 08:51:42 AM · #15
I like the idea, and I actually thought the white reflectors added an interesting effect rather than a distraction. Perhaps the subject wasn't dominant enough. Ignoring reality, if you could have lowered that overpass so the curve was more dominant it may have created a stronger image.

But, that's nit-picking. If I had taken that image I would have been pleased with my work regardless of the votes. The more important question is, does this image reflect what you mind's eye intended when you tripped the shutter?

Votes on this site don't necessarily reflect the quality of one's work because people have such wide interpretations and weightings on the challenge theme. You could have a best-selling print that gets 1s in a challenge because it's controversial. Sometimes they just score low, and you shouldn't change anything.
 02/04/2005 08:58:15 AM · #16
Hi Brad,

I didn't vote, and I like the shot. What I see in my first look is this: I like the geometry here, and like the lighting in the back as it plays off the curves. I see two things that might have made it better to me:

1) Crop the right, it seems unbalanced past the tree. I suggest just to the right of the right edge of the main tree that's lit on the left. That puts the tree towards the upper right corner, and the arcs more or less defining the bottom left corner. Some balance.

2) Consider cloning out the white reflectors in the road.

It's nice you can work on your own style of photography and not worry about ribbons. I made that decision too, sans the past ribbons ;)

I'll put this on the photo too, so you have it in one place. Others should consider that too.

Message edited by author 2005-02-04 08:59:00.
 02/04/2005 09:07:13 AM · #17
Originally posted by nova:
Hey Brad, I would love to "bomb" with about 10 consecutive 5.7+ scores such as this one :)

LOL. Ditto that. Come back when you've hit a run of 4's ; )
 02/04/2005 09:24:36 AM · #18
Technically not a bad shot. I'm sure I don't have to tell you that. But to answer your question: 1). been done before (you know how fickle we are about that) 2). nothing else in the shot other than the light trails to grab the viewers attention, ie. "interesting" cityscape in the BG for example 3). been done before (oh yeah I already said that) It's so much easier to pick someone elses work apart - I could never come to a conclusion like that about my own shots.
 02/04/2005 10:47:53 AM · #19
i feel that the shot is a bit flat. not very vibrant (as in the "drive by" shot posted above) it feels desaturated or something....

to disagree with the first post, i LIKE the six lines in the three challenge. its an implicit connection which i will always favor over an explicit one.
 02/04/2005 11:01:33 AM · #20
I had the same idea, but decided that it would be interpreted as six streaks rather than three lanes. I feel honored that I had the same idea as someone who has won so many ribbons, and even more so to have had the good sense to realize that it wouldn't work for this challenge. A first for me!
 02/04/2005 11:36:35 AM · #21
I want to extend a thanks to all that took the time to share what you saw in the shot that a biased photographer (me) maybe didn't see. I appreciate the extra sets of eyes and the honesty.

All too often, people want to sugar-coat things and never want to say anything negative and nobody can learn from it, hence why I made the statement about the flame suit on.

Pleasing all the people, all the time is an impossibility. I went out to please myself on this one. I tried this same kind of shot before with so so results. This time I was going to do it "just because" and acheived exactly what I set out to do. I saw three sets of lights. I considered that it may be seen as six and dismissed it, being biased. I did clone out an ugly yield sign, but never considered cloning out the white lane reflectors, as I felt they added some definition.

It was fun departing from the normal, setup studio-setting of perfect lighting & composition on this kind of challenge (not that I normally do that anyway) and shooting what I find and what is presented to me just by really looking at my surroundings.

I really appreciate the honesty in the feedback here and applaud all of you that took the time to do so. I have much more respect for those willing to say it as it is.
 02/04/2005 11:38:09 AM · #22
I didn't vote on or enter the Threes challenge.
I find it a bit difficult to see three right away and with the speed voters that probably hurt you quite alot. I also look at everything backwards from the rest of you so I think it should have been flipped 180 degrees horizontally, allowing the left to right readers to be drawn into the picture instead of out the bottom.
 02/04/2005 12:47:19 PM · #23
6. Seen so many times before and it is a bit boring, nothing really interesting.
02/04/2005 01:11:47 PM · #24
I liked it. Didn't care if it is an overseen (cliche?) shot. It was sharp and simple.

Gave it a 7.

High Quality Image, Met the challenge (greatly, I did not have to think that this was 6 lines, I knew it was 3 sets of taillights), but it wasn't over the top for artistic (wallhanging) value.
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