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 01/31/2005 06:35:10 PM · #1
I seem to be noticing a lot more challenge entries that have been previously posted in threads prior to the challenge. I am wondering if everyone is feeling good with this or not. When I first joined, it seemed like a major taboo to do that, but things I think have changed. Any thoughts?

edit for typo

Message edited by author 2005-01-31 18:35:29.
 01/31/2005 06:38:12 PM · #2
Well, for Best of 2004, that should be expected. People usually like to show off their best stuff, so there is a very good chance that some of the shots in that challenge were indeed shown before.
 01/31/2005 06:39:15 PM · #3
Originally posted by Beagleboy:
Well, for Best of 2004, that should be expected. People usually like to show off their best stuff, so there is a very good chance that some of the shots in that challenge were indeed shown before.


Sorry - I should have made it clear that I am not talking about that one. That was fully discussed beforehand and only makes sense! Thanks for mentioning that.
 01/31/2005 07:05:52 PM · #4
I personally don't want to know who has submitted what! I have a few friends on this site and find it very hard to vote on their photos if I know it's theirs. Although it is nice to bounce ideas off one another...
 01/31/2005 07:13:45 PM · #5
Originally posted by mpalitang:
I personally don't want to know who has submitted what! I have a few friends on this site and find it very hard to vote on their photos if I know it's theirs. Although it is nice to bounce ideas off one another...


Moving away slightly from the original topic, this is also a big problem with people who like to enter a lot of 'self'-portraits. Knowing who took the photo does tend to influence my opinions, though I try hard to look beyond it.
 01/31/2005 07:15:48 PM · #6
I was actually thinking more in terms of having already gotten a feel for DPC'ers reactions to a particular image. We of course know the faces of some photographers and their styles, but if you have posted an image for comments, then you have gotten a bit of an idea of how it will be responded to by DPC maybe.
 01/31/2005 07:17:09 PM · #7
Originally posted by GinaRothfels:
Originally posted by mpalitang:
I personally don't want to know who has submitted what! I have a few friends on this site and find it very hard to vote on their photos if I know it's theirs. Although it is nice to bounce ideas off one another...


Moving away slightly from the original topic, this is also a big problem with people who like to enter a lot of 'self'-portraits. Knowing who took the photo does tend to influence my opinions, though I try hard to look beyond it.


The only reason I mention this is because if people are posting their entries before a challenge... then I know who has entered them.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't think people should be revealing which image is theirs until results are revealed.

When I first started on here about a mo. ago, I did mention which image was mine in a thread and someone quickly asked me to edit my post to remove the reference!
 01/31/2005 07:19:11 PM · #8
about 'self' portraits and the same person appearing on various photos is due to not having to many models that are willing to pose for you, this happens to me a lot so.. you'll see me frequently and it's just because i don't really have that much of a choice... sorry if you don't like this but it's what i can get. :)
 01/31/2005 07:22:34 PM · #9
I haven't noticed it really, but then I don't read every thread, so I may be missing them. I think most people agree it is frowned upon to post an image beforehand. The times I have seen it, it is usually newbies that just aren't aware yet.

I personally don't care if I see someone's photo before hand or not, it's not like that makes the photo better or worse. A poor photo is a poor photo, even if it's Jacko's (not because it is Jacko's).

If for some reason I don't think I can judge it fairly, I would just skip it.
 01/31/2005 07:24:16 PM · #10
Originally posted by Discraft:
about 'self' portraits and the same person appearing on various photos is due to not having to many models that are willing to pose for you, this happens to me a lot so.. you'll see me frequently and it's just because i don't really have that much of a choice... sorry if you don't like this but it's what i can get. :)


I wsn't referring to that at all. As I said before - it was more about ysome people trying to get a feel beforehand of how something will be received by posting it for comments.
 01/31/2005 07:30:11 PM · #11
Kylie, I totally agree with you.

It's no big deal if I recognize someone's face in a 'self' portrait, or their dog, their house, etc etc etc.

But it's wrong to ask for opinions on a particular photo BEFORE a challenge is over. That gives people a big advantage, AND it's harder to judge/vote fairly when we have already seen it in forums and profiles (NOT talking about the Best of 2004 Challenge).

Don't do it, folks. Keep your photos to yourselves until afterwards.
 01/31/2005 07:34:41 PM · #12
Originally posted by Beetle:
Kylie, I totally agree with you.

It's no big deal if I recognize someone's face in a 'self' portrait, or their dog, their house, etc etc etc.

But it's wrong to ask for opinions on a particular photo BEFORE a challenge is over. That gives people a big advantage, AND it's harder to judge/vote fairly when we have already seen it in forums and profiles (NOT talking about the Best of 2004 Challenge).

Don't do it, folks. Keep your photos to yourselves until afterwards.


So is it just me that thinks they have been seeing thislately?
 01/31/2005 07:38:31 PM · #13
Not sure how it give someone a "big advantage" if someone sees it before hand. I know a couple people on here and normally know which image is their's and I can still vote fairly.

I agree that it's better to not post an image before a challenge, but these people that go ballistic and vote down and image just because they saw the photo before are ridiculous.
 01/31/2005 08:16:04 PM · #14
I think what you are talking about are the out takes and not the actual entry. I for one think if you have to post your ideas you didn't use you should do them on some other site if you can't at least wait for 'voting' to begin. Posting them after the challenge though is fine.
 01/31/2005 08:22:13 PM · #15
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
I think what you are talking about are the out takes and not the actual entry. I for one think if you have to post your ideas you didn't use you should do them on some other site if you can't at least wait for 'voting' to begin. Posting them after the challenge though is fine.


Well, I guess it really doesn't matter. But the ones I am thinking of are the actual entries. But outtakes of a similar nature are the same thing just about. At the end of the day, though, it's just all DPC.
 01/31/2005 08:33:14 PM · #16
Originally posted by cbeller:
Not sure how it give someone a "big advantage" if someone sees it before hand. I know a couple people on here and normally know which image is their's and I can still vote fairly.

I think the concern here is that if I post an image from my portfolio for comments even before the challenge submission deadline, and then enter it only if it was well received - isnt that an advantage?

01/31/2005 08:34:45 PM · #17
Originally posted by vfwlkr:
Originally posted by cbeller:
Not sure how it give someone a "big advantage" if someone sees it before hand. I know a couple people on here and normally know which image is their's and I can still vote fairly.

I think the concern here is that if I post an image from my portfolio for comments even before the challenge submission deadline, and then enter it only if it was well received - isnt that an advantage?


That was my original question . . . . but I am thinking that notmany care one way or the other. I think it's just me.
 01/31/2005 08:53:59 PM · #18
Originally posted by vfwlkr:
Originally posted by cbeller:
Not sure how it give someone a "big advantage" if someone sees it before hand. I know a couple people on here and normally know which image is their's and I can still vote fairly.

I think the concern here is that if I post an image from my portfolio for comments even before the challenge submission deadline, and then enter it only if it was well received - isnt that an advantage?


Not really. Just because it is received well, doesn't mean it's going to score well, or give it an advantage over someone else. Regardless of if someone saw it before the challenge, it's going to score where it's going to score.
 01/31/2005 08:56:50 PM · #19
Originally posted by Discraft:
about 'self' portraits and the same person appearing on various photos is due to not having to many models that are willing to pose for you, this happens to me a lot so.. you'll see me frequently and it's just because i don't really have that much of a choice... sorry if you don't like this but it's what i can get. :)


I don't expect people to change this, I was just saying that sometimes it makes it difficult to be totally objective. I wish that I were capable of the kind of 'self'-portraits I see here. I'm too scared to even try it, to be honest.

Originally posted by vfwlkr:
I think the concern here is that if I post an image from my portfolio for comments even before the challenge submission deadline, and then enter it only if it was well received - isnt that an advantage?


Yes, I'd definitely say it's unfair. I even resisted the temptation to go back and reshoot an image from my portfolio for the architecture challenge because I didn't want to enter something others had seen. After the result of that challenge, I think I made a mistake.

01/31/2005 09:33:24 PM · #20
Originally posted by Kylie:
I seem to be noticing a lot more challenge entries that have been previously posted in threads prior to the challenge. I am wondering if everyone is feeling good with this or not. When I first joined, it seemed like a major taboo to do that, but things I think have changed. Any thoughts?

edit for typo


I think what Kylie is trying to say is:
A user purposely posting a photograph in the forums for comments knowing that the photograph they are asking to be critiqued may be entered in a upcoming challenge based the feedback they receive. If the feedback is good they will submit picture, if feedback is bad or average then they toss and go to photograph two. Example: a person has two or more photographs they have ready and waiting to enter but just don’t know which one. They post them in a forum and get comments and find that ‘picture A’ was well received over ‘picture b’, so they post picture A. This would give the photographer an advantage. Yes I think this can be a problem.


01/31/2005 09:45:38 PM · #21
I always thought that this was not allowed. The moment you post an entry you are identified with it and in my thinking disqualifies the anonymity of the entry.
 01/31/2005 10:22:03 PM · #22
I can take my outtakes from the light challenge and post them. If you have seen my entry you would immediately know it was me but I can claim, "Well hey, I didn't show anyone the photo I entered so that's OK". Very hard to police. Who decides whether it is similar enough to give the game away, the Site Council? I think they are busy enough already.

I agree that it should not be allowed, but it is bloody hard to enforce. I think that showing the exact same photo before you enter it in a challenge could be enforced easily enough though.
 01/31/2005 10:29:02 PM · #23
Originally posted by SDW65:
Originally posted by Kylie:
I seem to be noticing a lot more challenge entries that have been previously posted in threads prior to the challenge. I am wondering if everyone is feeling good with this or not. When I first joined, it seemed like a major taboo to do that, but things I think have changed. Any thoughts?

edit for typo


I think what Kylie is trying to say is:
A user purposely posting a photograph in the forums for comments knowing that the photograph they are asking to be critiqued may be entered in a upcoming challenge based the feedback they receive. If the feedback is good they will submit picture, if feedback is bad or average then they toss and go to photograph two. Example: a person has two or more photographs they have ready and waiting to enter but just don’t know which one. They post them in a forum and get comments and find that ‘picture A’ was well received over ‘picture b’, so they post picture A. This would give the photographer an advantage. Yes I think this can be a problem.


Numerous times I've been on photosig and seen photos, entered in current challenges. Recently there was actually a winner here that was cross-posted there. I'm sure it happens all the time. Part of the art of photography is "knowing" what to show. Maybe these people aren't as great as they would have you believe.
 01/31/2005 10:32:18 PM · #24
Originally posted by graphicfunk:
I always thought that this was not allowed. The moment you post an entry you are identified with it and in my thinking disqualifies the anonymity of the entry.


I've been told it is alowed and I am guessing that to be the case because I have yet to see any DQs for it. I still think it is bad form.

(and my scoring does relfect that)

Message edited by author 2005-01-31 22:34:59.
 01/31/2005 10:36:26 PM · #25
Originally posted by The Four Bears:
I can take my outtakes from the light challenge and post them. If you have seen my entry you would immediately know it was me but I can claim, "Well hey, I didn't show anyone the photo I entered so that's OK". Very hard to police.


It is quite conceivable that this could be done, but I for one would harbour a fear that the 'voting' audience might take note of this, and, thinking that I did this deliberately, go back and re-adjust their scores to effectively voice their displeasure with me.

In essence, policing would be done from within.

Ray.
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