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09/12/2012 12:19:36 PM · #1 |
I realize here in the US we have free speech and all, but it would be nice if these fools in the US would just back off and stop inciting folks in the Middle east.
You know its going to provoke a response, why bother? It would be nice if a little restraint was shown on occasion. |
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09/12/2012 12:23:08 PM · #2 |
Hey you just can't fix stupid!!!!
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09/12/2012 01:15:27 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by cowboy221977:
Hey you just can't fix stupid!!!! |
Well said. |
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09/12/2012 01:22:10 PM · #4 |
I agree, and take it a step further.
After you cause your second international incident, I think your "free speech" is starting to have a price.
Believe me, I understand that cause and effect are a tricky thing, but as some point, you can't yell "fire in crowded theater," a country has to make its own foreign policy, and not let private citizens incite problems and provoke quasi-military responses from individuals abroad.
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09/12/2012 01:35:49 PM · #5 |
Oh jeez. If you really take enough insult from this video to kill anyone, you're nuts.
Noone should be defending the mob in any way. It wouldn't be OK for ANY other group (religious or other) to do something like this. Don't create double standards. This is totally unacceptable, especially after we aid those same rebels in their revolution.
Furthermore, how is this remotely akin to yelling "fire" in a movie theater?
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 13:42:38. |
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09/12/2012 01:52:22 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by blindjustice:
After you cause your second international incident, I think your "free speech" is starting to have a price.
Believe me, I understand that cause and effect are a tricky thing, but as some point, you can't yell "fire in crowded theater," a country has to make its own foreign policy, and not let private citizens incite problems and provoke quasi-military responses from individuals abroad. |
Wow! So we ought to apply laws to ensure than on one on the planet offends the sensibilities of any group anywhere? Or is it just worry about what will offend a small group of religious zealots who are looking to kill people? These people went looking for some one in a million web clip, which if they were not searching for, they never would have seen, in fact none of us would have heard of it. The film was a nothing, a zero, a nonentity which had no social effect, it was shown once to an empty theater. It is now famous because being offended and attacked is essential to madmen. This is not yelling "fire" in a crowded theater, it is a group looking far and wide for something that will legitimize their desire to become offended and murder in the name of their notion of faith.
Those who wish to murder will always find an excuse, even if we changed our society to try to follow their laws and morals, if we were conform ourselves to their worldview, we could expect killers to keep on killing. |
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09/12/2012 01:56:07 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by JamesDowning:
Oh jeez. If you really take enough insult from this video to kill anyone, you're nuts.
Noone should be defending the mob in any way. It wouldn't be OK for ANY other group (religious or other) to do something like this. Don't create double standards. This is totally unacceptable, especially after we aid those same rebels in their revolution.
Furthermore, how is this remotely akin to yelling "fire" in a movie theater? |
i agree, but here's the point, we know they are nuts. Why keep provoking them? why does some pastor in the south feel the need to burn a Koran, of why does a filmmaker need to ridicule the image of Muhammad? why do cartoonists need to keep drawing him, why do the south park guys have to make fun?
what is the point??? they are doing to it get rise out of a certain group, so why even bother? you know its going to come with a retaliation of some sorts so why keep doing it? just becuase this country affords the freedom do things doesn't make it worthwhile to do so.
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 13:57:48. |
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09/12/2012 02:01:00 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
you know its going to come with a retaliation of some sorts so why keep doing it? just becuase this country affords the freedom do things doesn't makes it right to do so. |
Because some people respond poorly to being bullied. Tell enough people "Don't cross that line, or else" and someone will cross the line just because. It might be stupid, but it is very American. |
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09/12/2012 02:03:08 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by mike_311:
you know its going to come with a retaliation of some sorts so why keep doing it? just becuase this country affords the freedom do things doesn't makes it right to do so. |
Because some people respond poorly to being bullied. Tell enough people "Don't cross that line, or else" and someone will cross the line just because. It might be stupid, but it is very American. |
my point is its stupid. i can understand being rebellious and all but pick your battles. crazy people dont need more reasons to be crazy. |
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09/12/2012 02:04:52 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Wow! So we ought to apply laws to ensure than on one on the planet offends the sensibilities of any group anywhere? Or is it just worry about what will offend a small group of religious zealots who are looking to kill people? These people went looking for some one in a million web clip, which if they were not searching for, they never would have seen, in fact none of us would have heard of it. The film was a nothing, a zero, a nonentity which had no social effect, it was shown once to an empty theater. It is now famous because being offended and attacked is essential to madmen. This is not yelling "fire" in a crowded theater, it is a group looking far and wide for something that will legitimize their desire to become offended and murder in the name of their notion of faith.
Those who wish to murder will always find an excuse, even if we changed our society to try to follow their laws and morals, if we were conform ourselves to their worldview, we could expect killers to keep on killing. |
I had a different view, but you have brought be around somewhat.
The question, I think, is whether it's reasonable for us, as a society or as individuals, to approach people making videos like this and ask whether it's reasonable to do so? We have every legal right to use the "n-word" when refering to blacks, but is it reasonable to do so? Is it helpful? If you are at a family picnic and cousin Eddie keeps taunting crazy uncle Karl, is it reasonable to tell him to knock it off because we all want to enjoy the picnic and crazy uncle Karl might get riled up and ruin it for everyone?
Sometimes I think we in America confuse the question, "can I do something?" with "should I do something?" There are many protected activities that are still ill-advised and unhelpful. |
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09/12/2012 02:20:17 PM · #11 |
To hell with being political correct...Lets just offend everyone. People are too sensitive theses days......But I still think "you can't fix stupid!!!"
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09/12/2012 02:58:08 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Originally posted by JamesDowning:
Oh jeez. If you really take enough insult from this video to kill anyone, you're nuts.
Noone should be defending the mob in any way. It wouldn't be OK for ANY other group (religious or other) to do something like this. Don't create double standards. This is totally unacceptable, especially after we aid those same rebels in their revolution.
Furthermore, how is this remotely akin to yelling "fire" in a movie theater? |
i agree, but here's the point, we know they are nuts. Why keep provoking them? why does some pastor in the south feel the need to burn a Koran, of why does a filmmaker need to ridicule the image of Muhammad? why do cartoonists need to keep drawing him, why do the south park guys have to make fun?
what is the point??? they are doing to it get rise out of a certain group, so why even bother? you know its going to come with a retaliation of some sorts so why keep doing it? just becuase this country affords the freedom do things doesn't make it worthwhile to do so. |
Don't try to make sense out of it. You cannot draw lines on freedom of speech. Hey, they burn American flags all the time... God and Jesus are depicted for better or worse in plenty of mainstream movies... How is that ANY different than what was in this trailer? Just because it pisses someone off, doesn't mean it should be banned.
However, just because you are pissed off, it certainly does not give you the right to kill or be violent.
Those muslims were pissed, that's fine, they can demonstrate against it! But in no way does that make it right to do what they did. You guys need to direct your anger in the right direction.
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 14:59:07. |
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09/12/2012 03:21:37 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by JamesDowning:
But in no way does that make it right to do what they did. You guys need to direct your anger in the right direction. |
How about the wrathful mobs attack the Imamas (and anyone else) who are distributing this hateful film in Muslim countries? Many Arabian countries censor the internet for offensive material, why is this being allowed to be seen, but to stoke the fires of rage and hatred? America has no right to stop out people from producing such films, but in countries that make sure their people never see pornography, why are they even aware that this film exists? |
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09/12/2012 03:30:51 PM · #14 |
You can't win.
Let's pretend you stop making films and cartoons that might insult Islam. Then they'll look for the next thing to be insulted about.
So let's bring in prohibition, ban porn, and shut down Las Vegas. Happy now?
Nope, probably not. Not until you introduce Sharia law. |
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09/12/2012 03:30:56 PM · #15 |
I am not suggesting the censorship of all things that might mention Islam in a way that might piss some fervent Jihadist off somewhere, frankly they don't need a reason. It now appears that the video may have been an excuse to carry out an already planned attack.
If someone in this country is calling out other people, taunting them to attack, etc- don't you think the government has already sent some guys in black suits to investigate, with or without "Patriot Act" style laws or policies in place?
Article about attacks
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 15:32:44. |
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09/12/2012 04:52:35 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by JH:
You can't win.
Let's pretend you stop making films and cartoons that might insult Islam. Then they'll look for the next thing to be insulted about.
So let's bring in prohibition, ban porn, and shut down Las Vegas. Happy now?
Nope, probably not. Not until you introduce Sharia law. |
NO NOT THE PORN!!!!!!!!!!
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09/12/2012 06:19:45 PM · #17 |
Bottom line is that you can rail against people for doing things that incite others, but as previously mentioned, that will only bring out more of them - the incitement can become a power trip, I'm sure.
Regardless of the video and who or why they posted it, I am totally on the side of condemning the reaction to it. For those of you condemning the posting of the video, I have to also believe you condemned movies like "The Last Temptation of Christ" and any number of other movies TV shows, videos, books, drawings, etc. that depicted Jesus in negative or blasphemous ways and you would have defended Christians if they decided to burn down a Hollywood studio, right? Yeah, I thought as much. |
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09/12/2012 06:23:16 PM · #18 |
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09/12/2012 06:39:28 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Regardless of the video and who or why they posted it, I am totally on the side of condemning the reaction to it. For those of you condemning the posting of the video, I have to also believe you condemned movies like "The Last Temptation of Christ" and any number of other movies TV shows, videos, books, drawings, etc. that depicted Jesus in negative or blasphemous ways and you would have defended Christians if they decided to burn down a Hollywood studio, right? Yeah, I thought as much. |
Condemning the posting of the video isn't the same as condoning or validating the reaction to it. |
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09/12/2012 06:44:22 PM · #20 |
Im not condemning anything. Im just saying if you know a group violently reacts to a situation, even if they are looking for a reason to react, why give them any reason? Like doc said just because we can exercise out rights doesn't mean that we always should.
and yes with a movie like passion of the christ, which was written in an anti-Semitic way, by an anti-semite, I disagree with its purpose as well.
when people are getting killed its time to wonder if it's worth whatever point you are trying to make. |
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09/12/2012 07:24:49 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Im not condemning anything. Im just saying if you know a group violently reacts to a situation, even if they are looking for a reason to react, why give them any reason? |
Because, for as long as we are infidels, they will always find a reason.
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09/12/2012 08:03:13 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by JH:
Originally posted by mike_311:
Im not condemning anything. Im just saying if you know a group violently reacts to a situation, even if they are looking for a reason to react, why give them any reason? |
Because, for as long as we are infidels, they will always find a reason. |
You do realize that historically the term "Infidels" was used a great deal by Christians as a derogative term to identify any entity that they deemed to be without faith or not belonging to a faith that they recognized.
Ray |
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09/12/2012 08:23:00 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
Im just saying if you know a group violently reacts to a situation, even if they are looking for a reason to react, why give them any reason? |
.... I just find myself hoping that it will help to open the eyes of the majority of the normal people to what organized religion really represents. This isn't just a Muslim phenomenon, it's simply that they're the ones who are currently busy doing what most organized religions are historically responsible for doing at some point themselves. Religion is one of the most effective sources of power and wealth that has ever been invented, and unfortunate side effects like fanaticism and murder are just the price of doing business it seems.
As for my opinion? Well, let's just say that I'm all for inciting the shit out of everyone who is so easily provoked - perhaps we as a species will decide someday that we've had enough of this ridiculous behavior and change the way we think and act. Then again, I'm probably being overly optimistic.
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 20:26:16. |
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09/12/2012 08:43:46 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by Cory:
As for my opinion? Well, let's just say that I'm all for inciting the shit out of everyone who is so easily provoked - perhaps we as a species will decide someday that we've had enough of this ridiculous behavior and change the way we think and act. Then again, I'm probably being overly optimistic. |
well until they have something better to do with their time they are just going to keep causing trouble. |
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09/12/2012 08:46:34 PM · #25 |
I find it interesting that these two spontaneous reactions to a movie whose whole existence is two thirteen minuet clips on Youtube; posted my a man who it seems does not exist, who writes that he got 5 million dollars to make this movie from 100 Jews. The clips were posted in early July. Nothing in July. Nothing in August.
Then on September 11th there is a spontaneous reaction to this film, which results in attacks on 2 American embassies? Talk about an obvious set-up job. The story rings about as true as the movie. This is not about this crappy Youtube video.
Message edited by author 2012-09-12 21:14:18. |
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