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05/28/2012 06:53:25 PM · #26 |
OECD tertiary level education, 24-64
1. Cananda 2. Japan 3. United States
The rest must think the world is flat. ;)
At any rate, forget the statistics, they can be manipulated to show whatever the author wants, and are meaningless without reference IMO. More importantly, as has been stated by John Paul, we all know that the world, as whole, appears to be declining culturally. |
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05/28/2012 07:13:50 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by bspurgeon:
we all know that the world, as whole, appears to be declining culturally |
and don't forget MORALLY!!!
Message edited by author 2012-05-28 19:14:18. |
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05/28/2012 07:20:23 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by ubique:
Well Bear's quite right. The point isn't the factoids about stultifying stupidity and ignorance that introduce the article. The point is that we are present for the inevitable decent of a now ethically and morally corrupt civilisation from primacy into vacuous, hedonistic barbarism. All that was good is now wasted. It's happened before: it's just the USA's turn now. The only difference this time is that the world's gotten smaller, so everybody who bought the ticket takes the ride. |
I always find this interessting. Is it the perception of the big guy on the block causing all of the problems? I can see that economically, but Japan is a big player. Keeping in mind that I am not a fan of stringint patriotism. What if we set aside economics. . . where would we be as an Earthly community without "rogue" states, or the leaders we currently have in North Korea and China, etc. (Just a couple of quick examples) Where would be without the instigators of the first two World Wars. We could argue that those wars, particularly WWII set the world on a path to idolise Western culture. It's fascinatingly complicated, and I wish it could be as simple to understand as rereading Carlos Casteneda's Journey to Ixtlan or Daniel Quinn's Ishmael. Only two examples, and I'm sure there are others that may be more on point. |
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05/28/2012 07:22:10 PM · #29 |
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05/28/2012 07:22:16 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by Neat:
Originally posted by bspurgeon:
we all know that the world, as whole, appears to be declining culturally |
and don't forget MORALLY!!! |
Yes, I tend to include morals within culture, and vice versa. Very much intertwined. |
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05/28/2012 07:35:40 PM · #31 |
Who gives a shit about tertiary education? It's meaningless. We've overqualified everything on this continent so that the masters degree is the new high school diploma. It's a joke to get a masters, and soon enough a PhD will be a dime a dozen if it isn't already there. A better comparison would be what do the graduates actually know. Something infinitely more difficult to measure. I interview so many MBA graduates who think they deserve a position at the bank because of their degree even though they know dick about anything.
Universities are now setup to be run like a business rather than an institute of education. It's the whole reason I left academia. The universities themselves don't actually care about the pursuit of knowledge, but only of funding dollars. There was a underwritten mandate that each professor was supposed to have four graduate students in my department, and we were pressured to fill those numbers regardless of qualified applicants. The system is broken.
CS
Message edited by author 2012-05-28 19:41:01. |
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05/28/2012 07:37:49 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by vawendy:
No. But I don't respect when people need to use questionable statistics to support their claims. |
Personally I am not in any position to accept or refute these statistics, but I do hope that information in this regard is available somewhere... it would make interesting reading and give up some perspective as to what truly does exist.
Ray |
Living in Canada, we'll never be in that position again as the Harper government has turned StatsCan into a useless department. With the staff cuts coming in the next couple of months, numbers from that office will be entirely meaningless.
CS
Message edited by author 2012-05-28 19:41:22. |
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05/28/2012 07:51:34 PM · #33 |
Tertiary education has an important place, it is a formalized level of attainment and aspiration. The problem arises when you buy into it for shallow gain and resell it for the same. It is also the parasitic administrative structures that grow from the need (and success) of education (and religion and politics and..) that ultimately propagate a moral/ethical/etc decline. Sure the world is heading there now, been there before, and as Leonard says 'There is a crack in everything. That's how the light gets in'. I believe in humankind, it will work when more of us share that sentiment. Most of you are speaking from a well educated and informed background whether you admit it or not, I think Paul's initial post, perhaps unintentionally I really don't know, was not to provide evidence but to relight the flame.
Message edited by author 2012-05-28 19:57:16. |
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05/28/2012 08:48:58 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by cowboy221977:
If more people tried to better themselve and we had less people asking for a handout thing would get much better. We have become a lazy society. |
This is like fussing over the bug splat on the windshield of a '64 Shelby Cobra while ignoring the smoke coming out of the engine.
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05/28/2012 09:52:28 PM · #35 |
| What is wrong with believing in angels? |
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05/28/2012 10:35:10 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by cloudsme:
What is wrong with believing in angels? |
Nothing wrong with that... nor is there anything wrong in believing in the Great Spaghetti Monster.
To each his/her own I guess. :O)
Ray |
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05/28/2012 10:38:59 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by cloudsme:
What is wrong with believing in angels? |
Nothing wrong with that... nor is there anything wrong in believing in the Great Spaghetti Monster.
To each his/her own I guess. :O)
Ray |
Blasphemer, it's Flying Spaghetti Monster. I hope you die a horrible death in his noodly appendages.
CS
Message edited by author 2012-05-28 22:44:38. |
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05/28/2012 10:40:18 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by cosmicassassin:
Originally posted by RayEthier:
Originally posted by cloudsme:
What is wrong with believing in angels? |
Nothing wrong with that... nor is there anything wrong in believing in the Great Spaghetti Monster.
To each his/her own I guess. :O)
Ray |
Blasphemer, it's Flying Spaghetti Monster. I hope die a horrible death in his noodly appendages.
CS |
My sincerest of apologies...I guess I got him and the Great Pumpkin mixed up.
Ray |
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05/29/2012 02:36:11 AM · #39 |
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05/29/2012 02:58:23 AM · #40 |
I'm interested. It's a very thoughtful exposé of the story behind the story in my OP. For the attention-span-challenged, here's a snip from the daisydavid linked article:
But what happens when the experts are fools? What happens when their professions are corrupted, their jargon has become a shield against outside scrutiny, their process of peer review has been transformed into a device by which a professional faction can commandeer the discipline, excommunicate rivals, and give members of the âusâ group endless pardons for their endless failures? |
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05/29/2012 03:29:55 AM · #41 |
| Pointing our blaming fingers at the powers that be, thinking that we are somehow more apt to see what needs changing, its just another mechanism to not facing out own inner problems, the world out there is just a reflection our world inside, how can we possibly help when we cant even controll most of our emotions, we give lessons but we can't sit still with an empty mind for any amount of time, Any revolution of any kind that doesn't take that Into consideration will just end up like all the others and it will all start again. It's all blah blah blah. |
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05/29/2012 04:32:57 AM · #42 |
| Couldn't agree with you more John. But the problem is so systemic and ingrained. The same types do the same things and we watch as ourselves and our children become complicit or the same. What to do?. Constant vigilance and reminders are an initial step, but we are identifying the constant human condition of need/want/greed. I don't think it will go away or be stopped on a grand scale, it's down to one bird at a time, starting with each person in their own space and do your best to pass it on. We can and must point our blaming fingers at the powers that be but remember we are them too. I feel your frustration, it is easy the blame the 'Other' and I don't really have a solution, but whatever solution, I suspect it starts with personal levels of aspiration. I'm looking at Dr Seligman's stuff on //www.authentichappiness.sas.upenn.edu/Default.aspx as an initial approach to how to integrate happiness with modern living. |
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05/29/2012 04:55:01 AM · #43 |
| Paul, I can feel your frustration. Posting it here is not worth it. |
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05/29/2012 05:44:30 AM · #44 |
I agree David, the solution starts from within ourselves, we have to acknowledge and accept our own insatifaction and find its cause, yes, need, want, greed are there but they are only symtoms of something much deeper. Once we start shining the spot light of our attention inside and stop constantly finding a source of blame for that uneasy quiver we feel everyday, we may notice that all our suffering and all the suffering out there comes from constantly thinking of self, or as Shantideva put it:
Whatever joy there is in this world
All comes from desiring others to be happy,
And whatever suffering there is in this world
All comes from desiring myself to be happy.
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05/29/2012 06:41:34 AM · #45 |
Many things such as everything you have you will lose and whatever you give stays with you forever, may be true and may well address what would appear to be a lack of spiritual investment in these material times. Even so, while externalisation of personal problems is stretching the fuse on a time bomb, internalisation of external problems is a quicksand on which to build your personal temple.
I suspect there are real problems. Peace and love should never go out of fashion but it looks like attention is called for. Does starting at home mean stopping at self, family, friends and family, neighbourhood, town, district, county, state, country ... where do you have to stop caring? Whatcha gonna do about it? |
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05/29/2012 07:42:04 AM · #46 |
The revolution we need is a revolution in consciousness. Our societies are based upon looking for happiness by reinforcing the sence of self, fame, success, popularity, ribbons ;-) the list is endless, but it's about nothing else and always has been, The fact that the winners in this frenetic race are usually as unhappy as the losers doesn't even seem to matter and It is of course the totally opposite direction to where we should be heading if we want to live in a equal and fare society. When you consider that we'll do nearly anything not to tarnish this illusory self that we cherish so dearly, there's not much chance of revolution that will work, untill that time people will continue to strive for success, stepping on and over whoever gets in their way. We are even capable of inventing dogmatic religions that have no other purpose than to glorify our lust to be someone and somewhere better, we just can't stop looking, anywhere but not here, not now, not something that may mean all this is my making and a total illusion.
I'm ranting today, sorry. |
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05/29/2012 07:57:28 AM · #47 |
Originally posted by jagar:
I'm ranting today, sorry. |
Rant away. You're putting into words everything i would post in this thread and thus saving me far more time for the Xbox.
That's a joke. I don't have an Xbox. I do agree with everything you posted though. |
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05/29/2012 08:24:44 AM · #48 |
Ganesh & Assisi
Ganesh meets St. Francis of Assisi
in the ally behind an Italian
restaurant in the south side of Brooklyn
on a balmy evening in 1936.
Francis is puzzled, tilts his head
to the left, thinking, âthis is
not the God I thought I was
praying to all those years.â
But hereâs Ganesh, beaming
compassion, with his broken
tusk, enormous belly and elephantâs
head, gently petting the small mouse
he rides from town to town.
âYouâd like my father,â Ganesh says,
stretching out one of his four
arms to offer his ever present bowl
of honeyed rice cakes to the Saint.
Now Francis is really confused.
âYou mean thereâs more than one
son,â he asks. âThereâs more than
one God,â smiles Ganesh, munching
on a honey cake. Francis is astonished.
He collapses to his knees in a mound
of flesh and robe, unable to decide
whether to cry, tremble, worship, or
do something completely undignified
for a Saint. âBut what about Jesus,
the apostles, the virgin birth?â pleads
the Saint. âYeah,â says Ganesh, talking
with his mouth full, âIt was awful what
happened to him. Should âa been more
careful.â Francis feels his eyes
starting to roll back in his head, mouth
agape, though shuts it quickly, not
wanting Ganesh to think he was giving
up his ascetic ways for want of a rice cake.
âYour father?â asks the Saint.
âYeah, heâs an ascetic, like you. I never really
got into that. Father and son thing I guess.â
Ken Siegmann |
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05/29/2012 10:50:39 AM · #49 |
| Canadians are better off than we are, right? |
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05/29/2012 10:56:37 AM · #50 |
Originally posted by whatevers:
Canadians are better off than we are, right? |
Not really. Two teams in the NHL finals are from the states and to add salt to the would one is from California! :) |
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