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10/26/2011 11:24:27 PM · #151 |
Originally posted by MargaretN:
How is choosing between awful and terrible going to help? It is pretty apparent that neither party is going to stop the recession turning into the worst depression. With the politicians we have now around the world (not just in the US) no action will be taken to sort out the mess. So it does not matter who you vote for. |
We are in the mess we are now partly because we are complacent. Those who control the wealth have the greatest influence, and to a great extent our politicians work in service to them. The people who control the purse strings also are willing to vote. The only method that those without vast amounts of money have to influence the governance of their country is the ballot box. There were politicians who saw the massive de-regulation that lead up to the fiscal crisis and cried the alarm, and some who saw it as a boon to their support base. If you had 20/20 hindsight and could have voted for a representative who would have voted against the the repeal of Glass-Steagall in 1999 and helped to head off the current economic meltdown, would you have?
If you can see no difference between Obama and Bush, between Michele Bachmann and Barney Frank, they you are right, you probably ought not vote. But if you are able to see shades of grey between candidates, you ought to to pick the shade that you think is best for yourself and your country. |
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10/26/2011 11:32:14 PM · #152 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by MargaretN:
How is choosing between awful and terrible going to help? It is pretty apparent that neither party is going to stop the recession turning into the worst depression. With the politicians we have now around the world (not just in the US) no action will be taken to sort out the mess. So it does not matter who you vote for. |
We are in the mess we are now partly because we are complacent. Those who control the wealth have the greatest influence, and to a great extent our politicians work in service to them. The people who control the purse strings also are willing to vote. The only method that those without vast amounts of money have to influence the governance of their country is the ballot box. There were politicians who saw the massive de-regulation that lead up to the fiscal crisis and cried the alarm, and some who saw it as a boon to their support base. If you had 20/20 hindsight and could have voted for a representative who would have voted against the the repeal of Glass-Steagall in 1999 and helped to head off the current economic meltdown, would you have?
If you can see no difference between Obama and Bush, between Michele Bachmann and Barney Frank, they you are right, you probably ought not vote. But if you are able to see shades of grey between candidates, you ought to to pick the shade that you think is best for yourself and your country. |
I am not American. Voting in Australia is mandatory and majority of people vote. It makes no difference to the outcome. |
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10/26/2011 11:58:49 PM · #153 |
Originally posted by MargaretN:
I am not American. Voting in Australia is mandatory and majority of people vote. It makes no difference to the outcome. |
Would you be okay with swapping policies on universal healthcare, gun control, vacation policy ? Those are some of the things I would like to see brought up by my representative. If any are brave enough to bring them up, I will vote for them. How sure you will keep those policies if you will not?
Message edited by author 2011-10-26 23:59:42. |
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10/27/2011 12:09:48 AM · #154 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
If you can see no difference between Obama and Bush, between Michele Bachmann and Barney Frank, they you are right, you probably ought not vote. But if you are able to see shades of grey between candidates, you ought to to pick the shade that you think is best for yourself and your country. |
In the larger scale - I don't see any different. Obviously if you pick a specific topic then it's easier to see the difference depending on the topic BUT over all and major topics that matter to me, it's pick which hypocrite you prefer.... |
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10/27/2011 12:39:30 AM · #155 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by MargaretN:
I am not American. Voting in Australia is mandatory and majority of people vote. It makes no difference to the outcome. |
Would you be okay with swapping policies on universal healthcare, gun control, vacation policy ? Those are some of the things I would like to see brought up by my representative. If any are brave enough to bring them up, I will vote for them. How sure you will keep those policies if you will not? |
Here in Australia we have universal healthcare, strict gun controls and mandatory 4 weeks vacation. We also have government regulation of the banks, and the concept of foreclosure does not exist. The American concept of freedom (any regulation is bad), no "nanny state" (let the poor and sick look after themselves, it is their fault they are poor/sick), low taxation (no money for services), right to carry guns (this one is beyond my comprehension), being able to walk away from debt (foreclosures) - are all specifically American problems that generations of your politicians have been unable to solve. |
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10/27/2011 12:39:41 AM · #156 |
I'm not getting into politics but I went down there this afternoon and let me tell you is it an experience. Not only am I drummer so I participated in the music but it is a great way to work on my portrait and candid shots.
Regardless if you agree or disagree with their purpose I highly recommended checking it out to anyone who can get down there.
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10/27/2011 12:43:22 AM · #157 |
| Be quick, Oakland was broken up yesterday at 4:30 AM, and it sounds like San Francisco will be evicted this week. New York may just count on the cold to do the job, but these protests will not allowed to go on much longer. |
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10/27/2011 12:46:50 AM · #158 |
Very true, but after all. We New Yorkers can be stubborn sons of bitches. ;)
Message edited by author 2011-10-27 00:46:56. |
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10/31/2011 06:44:21 PM · #159 |
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10/31/2011 11:20:42 PM · #160 |
Asheville's disbanded last week because (well at least one of the reasons a local news agency cited) -- There are "Occupy Asheville" members who agree the site had become problematic because of run-ins with homeless people, some with substance abuse problems and others with mental health issues.
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11/01/2011 12:09:40 AM · #161 |
I notice this hasn't gotten a whole lot of play in the media ...
Vatican sides with âOccupyâ protesters in call for crackdown on financial markets
Originally posted by Cited article:
VATICAN CITY â The Vatican called on Monday for the establishment of a âglobal public authorityâ and a âcentral world bankâ to rule over financial institutions that have become outdated and often ineffective in dealing fairly with crises.
The document from the Vaticanâs Justice and Peace department should please the âOccupy Wall Streetâ demonstrators and similar movements around the world who have protested against the economic downturn.
âToward Reforming the International Financial and Monetary Systems in the Context of a Global Public Authority,â was at times very specific, calling, for example, for taxation measures on financial transactions.
âThe economic and financial crisis which the world is going through calls everyone, individuals and peoples, to examine in depth the principles and the cultural and moral values at the basis of social coexistence,â it said.
It condemned what it called âthe idolatry of the marketâ as well as a âneo-liberal thinkingâ that it said looked exclusively at technical solutions to economic problems.
âIn fact, the crisis has revealed behaviors like selfishness, collective greed and hoarding of goods on a great scale,â it said, adding that world economics needed an âethic of solidarityâ among rich and poor nations.
âIf no solutions are found to the various forms of injustice, the negative effects that will follow on the social, political and economic level will be destined to create a climate of growing hostility and even violence, and ultimately undermine the very foundations of democratic institutions, even the ones considered most solid,â it said. |
Here is a link to a copy of the original statement.
Message edited by author 2011-11-01 00:10:23. |
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11/01/2011 07:37:35 AM · #162 |
Interesting doc, thanks for the link. I thought it was going to be full of religion, but it's actually very cohesive and logical. |
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11/01/2011 06:54:59 PM · #163 |
Originally posted by karmat:
Asheville's disbanded last week because (well at least one of the reasons a local news agency cited) -- There are "Occupy Asheville" members who agree the site had become problematic because of run-ins with homeless people, some with substance abuse problems and others with mental health issues. |
The police now seem to be encouraging the homeless and mentally disturbed to move to the Occupy locations:
"Two different drunks I spoke with last week told me theyâd been encouraged to âtake it to Zuccottiâ by officers whoâd found them drinking in other parks, and members of the community affairs working group related several similar stories theyâd heard while talking with intoxicated or aggressive new arrivals.
The NYPDâs press office declined to comment on the record about any such policy, but it seems like a logical tactic from a Bloomberg administration that has done its best to make things difficult for the occupation â a way of using its openness against it.
âHeâs got a right to express himself, youâve got a right to express yourself,â I heard three cops repeat in recent days, using nearly identical language, when asked to intervene with troublemakers inside the park, including a clearly disturbed man screaming and singing wildly at 3 a.m. for the second straight night.
âThe first time Iâve heard cops mention our First Amendment rights,â cracked one occupier after hearing a lieutenant read off of that apparent script." NEW YORK DAILY NEWS, October 30, 2011 |
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