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09/14/2011 07:04:47 PM · #26 |
| Lol. I call myself insane all the time... Wouldn't surprise me that other think I am too! Haha! |
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09/14/2011 07:06:50 PM · #27 |
Actually, Nicky's taking "Look serious and act like you know what you're doing" instruction from an old (and grumpy) bear. Next lesson's probably this Saturday. Based on what I'm reading here, I may have to give grasshopper a task... Waxed any cars lately, son?
(Runs for shelter)
R.
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09/14/2011 07:32:13 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Actually, Nicky's taking "Look serious and act like you know what you're doing" instruction from an old (and grumpy) bear. Next lesson's probably this Saturday. Based on what I'm reading here, I may have to give grasshopper a task... Waxed any cars lately, son?
(Runs for shelter)
R. |
LOL! |
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09/14/2011 08:13:42 PM · #29 |
It's probably not *always* ageism, but ageism is definitely something that's out there, even if the older group denies it left and right : )
I've found that it helps to go to games a few minutes early, then to talk to the refs. They're the ones in charge, so just introduce yourself and make small talk and mention that you'll be shooting. If they have any problems, they'll mention it then, but since you were trying to make friends, they'll be nicer about it and you will have a better chance of talking them out of it.
Like others have said, it definitely helps to have the gear, the attitude, and even the outfit to match the persona you want people to pick up on. It's hilarious to see the difference in how I'm treated when I (as a photojournalist for the paper) am treated when I just have my camera with the 50 1.4 on it and how I'm treated when I have the 200 2.8, the big camera bag, the pen behind my ear, and the notepad tucked under my shoulder strap. People seem to want everyone to fit the stereotypes or else they don't believe you.
Anyway, good luck and don't let it discourage you. You'll get the "old" badge soon enough : ) |
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09/14/2011 08:49:40 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by geinafets:
It's probably not *always* ageism, but ageism is definitely something that's out there, even if the older group denies it left and right : )
I've found that it helps to go to games a few minutes early, then to talk to the refs. They're the ones in charge, so just introduce yourself and make small talk and mention that you'll be shooting. If they have any problems, they'll mention it then, but since you were trying to make friends, they'll be nicer about it and you will have a better chance of talking them out of it.
Like others have said, it definitely helps to have the gear, the attitude, and even the outfit to match the persona you want people to pick up on. It's hilarious to see the difference in how I'm treated when I (as a photojournalist for the paper) am treated when I just have my camera with the 50 1.4 on it and how I'm treated when I have the 200 2.8, the big camera bag, the pen behind my ear, and the notepad tucked under my shoulder strap. People seem to want everyone to fit the stereotypes or else they don't believe you.
Anyway, good luck and don't let it discourage you. You'll get the "old" badge soon enough : ) |
It goes both ways...try getting a new job or worse, switching careers, when you're in your mid 50's and you wind up competing with younger folks in their 30's... |
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09/14/2011 09:45:51 PM · #31 |
Not to hijack the thread, but I met Marco  mbrutus2009 at a DPC GTG a couple of weeks ago, and can say that he was well dressed, polite, thoughtful and well mannered. If there was a problem with the ref, it was not because of Marco's demeanor or appearance.
Message edited by author 2011-09-14 21:46:17.
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09/14/2011 09:58:33 PM · #32 |
First off thank you, Waddy! :)
*struts stuff*
Originally posted by Spork99:
It goes both ways...try getting a new job or worse, switching careers, when you're in your mid 50's and you wind up competing with younger folks in their 30's... |
Thing is though... I am only 20 years old and look even younger (so everyone says). |
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09/14/2011 10:09:42 PM · #33 |
Eh, yeah, I could see a bit of what you mean. I'm not as young as you, but I'm on the whippersnapper side of the spectrum. In outings, it feels like you'll automatically get some respect from other photographers if you've been doing it a long time (with no actual link to quality of work) or if you've got a schnazzy lens.
In situations that are not strictly populated by photographers, however, as Louis noted, I sorta ALWAYS feel a bit stared at. The worst has been when I've been at sporting events, especially when at cycling events. But nobody really cares.
There are some who won't respect you initially because they never give respect to strangers. They are often won through a showing of your competence. There are some who presume gear=ability, whose opinions can be swayed by gear or again, a display of competence.
Lastly, there are those who never think you're capable because you're younger. Screw 'em, because you'll never win them over and they aren't worth your time. |
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09/14/2011 11:14:41 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by Spork99:
It goes both ways...try getting a new job or worse, switching careers, when you're in your mid 50's and you wind up competing with younger folks in their 30's... |
I would have agreed with you a few years ago, but nowadays, it seems like the old definitely have the advantage in the job market since everyone is still scrambling for jobs, even if they aren't making the pay they should. Why would you pay a 23-year-old with 7 years of experience $30k if you can pay the 55-year-old with 35 years of experience the exact same amount? Sucks for both the 23-year-old and the 55-year-old, but it'd be silly for the employer to pick the younger one with less experience, so the older one gets the job. That's how it's been for me and my friends over the last 3 years anyway.
Originally posted by MelonMusketeer:
Not to hijack the thread, but I met Marco mbrutus2009 at a DPC GTG a couple of weeks ago, and can say that he was well dressed, polite, thoughtful and well mannered. If there was a problem with the ref, it was not because of Marco's demeanor or appearance. |
I didn't interpret any of the comments as saying that he's grungy or ill-mannered, and I hope my comment didn't come across as implying that. |
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09/14/2011 11:22:49 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by mbrutus2009:
I am young... I feel like I don't get respect walking around with my camera next to someone who has a camera but is middle aged. For example last night I was at a volleyball game taking photos for my brother and for warm ups I was next to the court with my 18-55mm sitting on the floor looking up as they hit the ball. The ref told me to leave that part of the court but then an older guy than me (roughly 50 or 60) walked up with his DSLR and did pretty much the same thing I was doing and the ref actually went up to talk to him as he was taking photos as if nothing was wrong.
This is one of only 12 photos I got of the players during warm ups before the ref kicked me off.
Am I going insane or do people not treat younger photographers with respect just because they are young? Chances are I knew more about photography than the guy because he was using "auto" mode... Now that does not mean that he didn't know more but someone who uses "Auto" over manual inside of a gym is in my opinion not very in-tuned with his setting on the camera.
Someone put me in my place if I am going insane here... |
One of the great things about being "50 to 60" is that refs give us no shit when we want to take pictures. Security guards, too. Patience, grasshopper, someday, all this will be yours.
!)
Message edited by author 2011-09-14 23:23:30. |
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09/14/2011 11:43:32 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by geinafets:
Originally posted by Spork99:
It goes both ways...try getting a new job or worse, switching careers, when you're in your mid 50's and you wind up competing with younger folks in their 30's... |
I would have agreed with you a few years ago, but nowadays, it seems like the old definitely have the advantage in the job market since everyone is still scrambling for jobs, even if they aren't making the pay they should. Why would you pay a 23-year-old with 7 years of experience $30k if you can pay the 55-year-old with 35 years of experience the exact same amount? Sucks for both the 23-year-old and the 55-year-old, but it'd be silly for the employer to pick the younger one with less experience, so the older one gets the job. That's how it's been for me and my friends over the last 3 years anyway. |
Not my experience at all. In fact, if anything, companies are hiring more and more younger workers because salaries are lower across all levels and they'll still wind up paying the older workers more, plus, older workers typically cost more to insure because they are married, have kids etc.
I will say that I recently got lucky because I have specific skills that a local employer was looking for and they were willing to pay, both in salary and "perks", to lure me away from my employer at the time. I was working on contract alongside several "green" engineers, fresh out of undergrad school with zero experience, save an internship or two. I managed to discover that the difference in their pay rate and mine ( I have 12yrs experience and an MS degree) was just a couple of dollars/hour.
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09/14/2011 11:50:39 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by MelonMusketeer:
Not to hijack the thread, but I met Marco mbrutus2009 at a DPC GTG a couple of weeks ago, and can say that he was well dressed, polite, thoughtful and well mannered. If there was a problem with the ref, it was not because of Marco's demeanor or appearance. |
Originally posted by geinafets:
I didn't interpret any of the comments as saying that he's grungy or ill-mannered, and I hope my comment didn't come across as implying that. |
I was not referring to any of the earlier posts, just saying that he's a nice guy so no one would be wondering.
@ Marko, Next time you want to shoot warmups, try to be there early and let the ref know that your brother is playing and ask to shoot there until the actual games are about to start.
If you want to look cool/pro and all that to get access to places, buy a dirt cheap big lens, an off brand used one on line. Most any glass with a Nikon F / Ai mount will fit on your camera. Once you get position, you can switch to your preferred zoom and click away.
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09/15/2011 02:15:40 AM · #38 |
Originally posted by MelonMusketeer:
Not to hijack the thread, but I met Marco mbrutus2009 at a DPC GTG a couple of weeks ago, and can say that he was well dressed, polite, thoughtful and well mannered. If there was a problem with the ref, it was not because of Marco's demeanor or appearance. |
We'll take that into consideration at his next parole hearing.
I can relate to / agree with Sporko on the ageism thing working against us elderly as well. My wife's been looking for a job on and off for 2 years and has run into A LOT of it. For now she's still working with me, but she really needs to find another job because I am really looking for someone younger. |
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09/15/2011 04:05:48 AM · #39 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
[ My wife's been looking for a job on and off for 2 years and has run into A LOT of it. For now she's still working with me, but she really needs to find another job because I am really looking for someone younger. |
You need an intern. |
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