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11/23/2010 09:31:27 PM · #51 |
Originally posted by photodude:
A real movement there.
Again we arent being groped to get on planes to protect ourselves from them. |
No one likes the groping. Well, OK, there are probably a few with a few beers under their belt that find it amusing. No one wants to go through all that shit to fly. I don't. I also don't want to live in a country where after all we've been through to get to where we are, we suddenly revert to judging a man by the color of his skin or the style of his dress. How sad is that? |
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11/23/2010 09:32:43 PM · #52 |
Originally posted by photodude:
Originally posted by kawesttex:
What's that church in Kansas that harasses funerals of military men. I would catagorize that as a terrorist activity. |
Terrible what they are doing, but not a threat to anyones life or safety. |
Once again narrowing the search down. Next? Terrorism doesn't necessarily require a loss of life. |
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11/23/2010 09:35:10 PM · #53 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by photodude:
Again we arent being groped to get on planes to protect ourselves from them. |
That is a pretty weak metric to use to condemn every member of a faith you seem to know very little about. |
Are being way to generous... I would bet he knows NADA about this group.
Ray |
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11/23/2010 09:58:49 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by photodude:
Still waiting guys...
Since 9/11 name a terrorist act perpitrated by persons other than islamics.
We arent being groped in airports to protect ourselves from the IRA or Shining Path. |
Here... feast your eyes on this List and see if you recognize any of the names there.
Ray |
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11/24/2010 01:51:13 AM · #55 |
| So the Real IRA and the Omagh Bombing in which 29 men, women and children were murdered and hundreds injured, some severely and permanently doesn't count as terrorism? They had a quiet spell following that, but if you didn't have such a blinkered, UScentric, world view, you would be aware that they have been regrouping over recent years and pose a very real threat to the people of the United Kingdom - there again, you may of course see the police, the UK armed forces, and any collateral civilian deaths and injuries, as targets. Your remarks are thoroughly offensive to the many muslim members we have here at DPC, and to those who have known people killed by groups such as the IRA. At the moment I am so angry that I can't articulate my thoughts sufficiently. |
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11/24/2010 03:00:29 AM · #56 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
So the Real IRA and the Omagh Bombing in which 29 men, women and children were murdered and hundreds injured, some severely and permanently doesn't count as terrorism? They had a quiet spell following that, but if you didn't have such a blinkered, UScentric, world view, you would be aware that they have been regrouping over recent years and pose a very real threat to the people of the United Kingdom - there again, you may of course see the police, the UK armed forces, and any collateral civilian deaths and injuries, as targets. Your remarks are thoroughly offensive to the many muslim members we have here at DPC, and to those who have known people killed by groups such as the IRA. At the moment I am so angry that I can't articulate my thoughts sufficiently. |
Very, very well articulated Sara.
Message edited by author 2010-11-24 03:02:02. |
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11/24/2010 03:17:29 AM · #57 |
Originally posted by salmiakki:
Originally posted by SaraR:
So the Real IRA and the Omagh Bombing in which 29 men, women and children were murdered and hundreds injured, some severely and permanently doesn't count as terrorism? They had a quiet spell following that, but if you didn't have such a blinkered, UScentric, world view, you would be aware that they have been regrouping over recent years and pose a very real threat to the people of the United Kingdom - there again, you may of course see the police, the UK armed forces, and any collateral civilian deaths and injuries, as targets. Your remarks are thoroughly offensive to the many muslim members we have here at DPC, and to those who have known people killed by groups such as the IRA. At the moment I am so angry that I can't articulate my thoughts sufficiently. |
Very, very well articulated Sara. |
Yes, very well said Sara. The depth of  photodude's ignorance about the world and history outside his own patch is simply astounding. |
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11/24/2010 03:39:37 AM · #58 |
Originally posted by clive_patric_nolan:
.... The depth of photodude's ignorance about the world and history outside his own patch is simply astounding. |
You are giving him far too much credit Clive, by implying that he is ignorant only of the world outside his own patch. |
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11/24/2010 04:11:12 AM · #59 |
Originally posted by SaraR:
So the Real IRA and the Omagh Bombing in which 29 men, women and children were murdered and hundreds injured, some severely and permanently doesn't count as terrorism? They had a quiet spell following that, but if you didn't have such a blinkered, UScentric, world view, you would be aware that they have been regrouping over recent years and pose a very real threat to the people of the United Kingdom - there again, you may of course see the police, the UK armed forces, and any collateral civilian deaths and injuries, as targets. Your remarks are thoroughly offensive to the many muslim members we have here at DPC, and to those who have known people killed by groups such as the IRA. At the moment I am so angry that I can't articulate my thoughts sufficiently. |
And before the argument comes up that the Omagh bomb was a few years ago, the Real IRA are still active:
//www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-foyle-west-11473586
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11/24/2010 06:39:17 AM · #60 |
I'm always amazed how few muslims seem to mind when other muslims attack and blow up a mosque, even on a religious holiday, killing women and kids.
Can you imagine the world wide islamic condemnation and violent reaction if a western person or force blew up a mosque??
I would estimate some muslim group or another has blown up at least 100-150 mosques in the last few years, all in muslim countries. |
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11/24/2010 07:16:24 AM · #61 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
Originally posted by photodude:
As Americans and Westerners, lets ban Kuwait. And while we are at it - Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iran, Iraq, Somalia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Syria, Egypt, Turkey, Sudan, etc. |
So monarchies, theocracies, and democracies, if they are majority Muslim, condemn them all as each being responsible for the worst in the others. That sort of thinking certainly makes sense to the deep thinkers of Islamic extremism who blame all westerners for every evil; but given all the information we have access to, it is shameful to not be able to tell the difference between Turkey and Somalia. |
The root cause of Muslim extremism is not religion, religion is only the guise at which "terrorists" are recruited. Poor weak minded individuals are conned into doing what they do. The are generally and uneducated and easily manipulated people.
The reason the west is targeted is their occupation of muslim lands. We are "stealing" their natural resources, by not paying what they consider to be fair market value.
We can end this threat anytime we choose, by finding an alternate form of energy and simply leaving. With us (and the rest of the world, having no dependence on oil. They would have no money, and more importantly no support from other nations. The nations such as China, Russia, USA would have no reason support groups in these nations to be shadow fighters for their respective interests in the oil.
The terrorists have moved their attack focus throughout recent history to whatever country an opposing supporter needs. The individual terrorists are puppets in a big money game.
The US missed an opportunity to end the struggle by simply accepting defeat after 9/11. They should have worked to build a stable nation, but they went about it in the wrong way, they should have helped to build up a nation of school and business and trade. Educating the people and giving them a life and society to live for besides fighting with each other and the rest of the world.
Instead we keep trying military action against a group of people who have nothing to lose, and we are a nation, who value our lives too much to throw them away for some cause that really doesn't interest us too much.
Message edited by author 2010-11-24 07:17:21. |
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11/24/2010 07:46:29 AM · #62 |
//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents,_2010
//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents,_2009
//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents,_2008
etc
Take a look at those and you'll notice there are in fact a lot of non-muslim groups active, for instance the IRA, ETA, Tamil Tigres. There are also a lot of separatist groups in Russia and former Soviet states (Chechnya, Georgia, ...) resorting to terrorism to front their cause, and there are a whole bunch of drug cartels in countries such as Mexico and Colombia that use acts of terrorism to spread fear in the population. Even radical political groups in countries such as Greece have started resorting to terrorism.
There are also numerous incidents that didn't make these lists, for instance the acts of systematic sexual violence in the DRC (Congo)
As you will see from the lists above, innocent people have been injured and killed by almost all of these groups. The peculiar thing with terrorism though, is that it is a label used by the victims of terrorism - the people performing these acts generally refer to themselves as "freedom fighters", guerilla warriors etc... |
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11/24/2010 08:11:57 AM · #63 |
When you attack Innocent civilians you are a terrorist.
When you attack and armed government, you are a rebel.
Message edited by author 2010-11-24 08:12:05. |
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11/24/2010 08:15:24 AM · #64 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
When you attack Innocent civilians you are a terrorist.
When you attack and armed government, you are a rebel. |
well said |
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11/24/2010 08:29:04 AM · #65 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
When you attack Innocent civilians you are a terrorist.
When you attack and armed government, you are a rebel. |
Do you really find it that simple?
What do you think of attacks on armed Iraqi police officers today? How about under Saddam's rule?
Do you condone Palestinian attacks on Israeli soldiers?
Were the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki during WW2 acts of terrorism? What about the bombing of Dresden?
I believe there are many shades of gray between black and white.
EDIT: Grammar
Message edited by author 2010-11-24 08:30:44. |
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11/24/2010 08:46:00 AM · #66 |
Oh, and what about cases like this?
//www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37203906/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
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11/24/2010 09:01:28 AM · #67 |
Originally posted by wiesener:
Originally posted by mike_311:
When you attack Innocent civilians you are a terrorist.
When you attack and armed government, you are a rebel. |
Do you really find it that simple?
What do you think of attacks on armed Iraqi police officers today? How about under Saddam's rule?
Do you condone Palestinian attacks on Israeli soldiers?
Were the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki during WW2 acts of terrorism? What about the bombing of Dresden?
I believe there are many shades of gray between black and white.
EDIT: Grammar |
actually you make a good point. Im having a hard time classifying the atom bombings. Since they were conducted on civilians, however the two countries were officially at war with each other.
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11/24/2010 10:57:22 AM · #68 |
In his declaration, (emperor) Hirohito referred to the atomic bombings:
â Moreover, the enemy now possesses a new and terrible weapon with the power to destroy many innocent lives and do incalculable damage. Should we continue to fight, not only would it result in an ultimate collapse and obliteration of the Japanese nation, but also it would lead to the total extinction of human civilization.
Such being the case, how are We to save the millions of Our subjects, or to atone Ourselves before the hallowed spirits of Our Imperial Ancestors? This is the reason why We have ordered the acceptance of the provisions of the Joint Declaration of the Powers.â
The Atomic bomb convinced the Japanese to accept defeat or face annihilation. It ended the war. |
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11/24/2010 11:26:35 AM · #69 |
Originally posted by amsterdamman:
The Atomic bomb convinced the Japanese to accept defeat or face annihilation. It ended the war. |
That is continuously debated, but assuming that is it true, are you saying killing of civilians is OK if it is for a greater good? |
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11/24/2010 11:38:44 AM · #70 |
Hmm, I just realized that this discussion started with DSLR's being banned in Kuwait. Interesting how a discussion can derail into something completely different in a few pages...
Anywho, I think the ban on DSLRs is simply moronic, and I find it very hard to understand how they will draw the line between journalism and art. First of all, many photojournalists are freelancers, making the distinction difficult to begin with. Secondly, looking at this years winners and runner-ups in the World Press Photo of the year, many of those photos strike me as art more than journalism.
EDIT: rephrase
Message edited by author 2010-11-24 11:39:30. |
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11/24/2010 11:40:06 AM · #71 |
we classify things as to how they best suit our interests. the consequences of war are simply coincidental. if one less bullet had hit its mark, if one less bomb had not exploded, had one less messenger not gotten through, had one less boat not sunk in stormy seas, had one more sunrise broken through the fog...who's to say what incidents would have turned history in different directions?
we're all hypocrites when we enjoy what we have at the expense of human lives while decrying and denying the need for lives to be sacrificed. it's an ugly truth, but no one enjoys anything that someone else has not wanted bad enough to either take or die trying to take. |
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11/24/2010 11:48:36 AM · #72 |
Originally posted by mike_311:
actually you make a good point. Im having a hard time classifying the atom bombings. Since they were conducted on civilians, however the two countries were officially at war with each other. |
Personally, I agree that being at war somehow changes the rules. But considering the fact that the US hasn't formally been at war since WW2, I am not sure what to think of some of the incidents in "armed conflicts" like Iraq and Afghanistan (this one comes to mind)... |
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11/24/2010 01:09:19 PM · #73 |
I stumbled across this posting I did in my photoblog on 9/11 four years ago.
Nothing has changed
I hope some of you will read it and at least contemplate the message.
Blog Link
Happy Thanksgiving |
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11/24/2010 01:21:59 PM · #74 |
Originally posted by photodude:
I stumbled across this posting I did in my photoblog on 9/11 four years ago.
Nothing has changed
I hope some of you will read it and at least contemplate the message.
Blog Link
Happy Thanksgiving |
Thanks for posting the link. I have read it and contemplated your message and it has certainly clarified some things. You seem to be proposing war with Pakistan and the worldwide obliteration of the religion of Islam and of Muslims. You also seem to be an utter imbecile.
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11/24/2010 01:26:13 PM · #75 |
Originally posted by clive_patric_nolan:
Originally posted by photodude:
I stumbled across this posting I did in my photoblog on 9/11 four years ago.
Nothing has changed
I hope some of you will read it and at least contemplate the message.
Blog Link
Happy Thanksgiving |
Thanks for posting the link. I have read it and contemplated your message and it has certainly clarified some things. You seem to be proposing war with Pakistan and the worldwide obliteration of the religion of Islam and of Muslims. You also seem to be an utter imbecile. |
That is the same impression it left on me. |
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