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07/21/2010 04:19:07 PM · #1 |
Another article hoping to elucidate to the general public that photography is not in fact a crime:
Photos and Public Security, from Popular Mechanics.
Discuss if desired. Alliteration of replies not required. |
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07/21/2010 05:07:31 PM · #2 |
Good article from a clasically "mainstream" media source ... one of my favorite parts:
Originally posted by Cited Article:
Here's how bad it has gotten: Not long ago, an Amtrak representative did an interview with local TV station Fox 5 in Washington, D.C.'s Union Station to explain that you don't need a permit to take pictures there--only to be approached by a security guard who ordered them to stop filming without a permit. |
Message edited by author 2010-07-21 17:07:51. |
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07/21/2010 05:08:48 PM · #3 |
Good article. I was happy to read it. It's always good to get a refresher on what you can and can't do with a camera, and where. It was actually news to me that you're never under a legal duty to erase photos you've already taken.
I do wonder, though, why the article recommends that the first thing you should do, if a security guard asks you to stop taking photos, is ask them for the source of their authority. Questioning them like that seems like it'd put them on the defensive in a hurry. I might think it'd be preferable to act mildly contrite, and perhaps a bit confused, and get to the point of questioning authority only after first showing some deference. |
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07/21/2010 05:19:50 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by mycelium:
Good article. I was happy to read it. It's always good to get a refresher on what you can and can't do with a camera, and where. It was actually news to me that you're never under a legal duty to erase photos you've already taken. |
You should download (and carry a couple of copies in your camera bag) The Photographer's Right (PDF) -- a summary written by Bert Krages, the attorney quoted in the article.
Originally posted by mycelium:
I do wonder, though, why the article recommends that the first thing you should do, if a security guard asks you to stop taking photos, is ask them for the source of their authority. Questioning them like that seems like it'd put them on the defensive in a hurry. I might think it'd be preferable to act mildly contrite, and perhaps a bit confused, and get to the point of questioning authority only after first showing some deference. |
Problem is, if someone says "stop taking pictures" it seems to me that you only have two real answers: "No" or "Why should I?" -- the latter being the abbreviated way of asking under what authority they are making the demand. I understand what you're saying, and I think that's what, in the article, they meant by "always being polite" ...
Once you "defer" to authority, you've pretty much waived your right to question it ...
Message edited by author 2010-07-21 17:21:09.
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07/21/2010 09:09:03 PM · #5 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
You should download (and carry a couple of copies in your camera bag) The Photographer's Right (PDF) -- a summary written by Bert Krages, the attorney quoted in the article. |
I agree 101%. I have a number of copies in my camera bag, just in case. Which is a sad reality - the almost-need to carry proof that what you are doing is not illegal. :( |
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07/21/2010 09:14:32 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by alfresco:
Which is a sad reality - the almost-need to carry proof that what you are doing is not illegal. :( |
"Show me your papers!"
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07/21/2010 10:07:21 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by alfresco:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
You should download (and carry a couple of copies in your camera bag) The Photographer's Right (PDF) -- a summary written by Bert Krages, the attorney quoted in the article. |
I agree 101%. I have a number of copies in my camera bag, just in case. Which is a sad reality - the almost-need to carry proof that what you are doing is not illegal. :( |
Is it really proof of anything. I mean do security guards or police really care about a paper print out that some lawyer they never heard of or care about wrote up no matter how factual?
I'm really curious about this. How many people here have ever been stopped and questioned by someone telling them they can't shoot at a public location and once they showed them this paper they changed their mind and said...oh...well okay then?
I'm NOT saying it's not a smart thing to know and carry. In fact I will print some up and carry them as well, but knowing the attitudes of a lot of people who stretch their authority, and also knowing how even when wrong law enforcement doesn't like it when they are challenged...even politely I just don't see this changing the immediate circumstances a photographer was stopped for on a dime. Seems to me it's more of a handy thing to know in order to pursue the fact that you were stopped further in the future rather than have a cop change their mind about having you stop what your doing and leave, delete your card or worse.
Any true life situations out there to gauge this forms legality and effectiveness? I would really like to hear some success stories or failed attempts at using this if possible.
David |
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07/21/2010 10:14:10 PM · #8 |
Originally posted by DCNUTTER:
I'm really curious about this. How many people here have ever been stopped and questioned by someone telling them they can't shoot at a public location and once they showed them this paper they changed their mind and said...oh...well okay then?
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I share your curiosity. Does this actually do much to assert authority where you've already had it denied?
Similarly... recent discussion about photographing on duty cops. |
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07/21/2010 10:55:18 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by spiritualspatula:
Originally posted by DCNUTTER:
I'm really curious about this. How many people here have ever been stopped and questioned by someone telling them they can't shoot at a public location and once they showed them this paper they changed their mind and said...oh...well okay then?
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I share your curiosity. Does this actually do much to assert authority where you've already had it denied?
Similarly... recent discussion about photographing on duty cops. |
I share your point of view. It has been my experience that those who are inclined to abuse their authority, have tendency to try to play it through. Once they are in deep, they tend to think forward is the only way out. Before I got into one of these I would recommend deciding how far I was willing to escalate. The photographer could be risking legal fees, jail, and some bruising before finally winning the day. Cases fought all the way to the supreme court take years out of one's life. |
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07/22/2010 09:53:10 PM · #10 |
No stories? The only time I was approached by an authority actually happened about a little over a month ago. Across the street from where I normally get gas etc. There is a large open field where some company has large logging machinery and stacks upon stacks of long cut timber logs. During the last hour before sunset (Golden Hour) the cut ends of the logs face the western sky and the whole scene is a red glow. Pretty surreal at times. Anyway, one day I parked my car in the gas station lot, and walked across the state highway (only a two lane road) and started taking some shots as I walked along the edge of the road to get various angles.
Out of the corner of my eye I see a New York State Trooper that had just rounded a corner at the intersection up a little ways start to pull over near me. I wasn't on any one's property...just taking shots of some other property, but on a public road. I thought to myself...ok, here we go. Well, to make a long story short, and mind you NYS Troopers are some of the toughest in the country he barely even stopped his SUV and came to a rolling stop. I turned to face him, and obviously he had already been looking as he pulled over because all he said was "Oh, just taking some pictures Sir?" Which I simply replied "Yes, just some photos." to which he said "Ok" and made a quick way and headed back down the road.
Man, I was relieved. I knew I wasn't doing a think wrong, but you just never know what to expect. I appreciate his concern in asking, and respected him A LOT for the friendly and professional way he handled the interaction. I wish everyone who has had a rough time in the past could have it as easy as that. It really made my day to be honest that went the way it should. :)
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